NAMA Could this save us Taxes

WIZE

I wrote this in another thread but would like your Ideas

What if Nama takes ownership of the Finished Houses

They put the houses up for rent to people say 500 month which is deducted from the price of the house ( Like a Mortgage )

You pay off the the house over example 25 years you own the house then

If you leave the House early Nama keeps the money you paid and they can start again and you have no problems with getting chased for a Mortgage

They should test the people who can avail of this as a long term Rent/Ownership rather then people who they think would Trash the Houses

Another Example could be that if you lose your job and you claim rent allowance this money is not deducted from the price of the house

Also add in the Contract that If rent is not paid in example 2 months you will leave the house instead of court cases where prople are staying in houses for 9 months rent free .

I not looking for this wont work comments but proactive comments to make it work

Boards could save the day :pac:to save us all taxes

MaceFace

Most Haunted wrote: »

I wrote this in another thread but would like your Ideas

What if Nama takes ownership of the Finished Houses

They put the houses up for rent to people say 500 month which is deducted from the price of the house ( Like a Mortgage )

You pay off the the house over example 25 years you own the house then

If you leave the House early Nama keeps the money you paid and they can start again and you have no problems with getting chased for a Mortgage

They should test the people who can avail of this as a long term Rent/Ownership rather then people who they think would Trash the Houses

Another Example could be that if you lose your job and you claim rent allowance this money is not deducted from the price of the house

Also add in the Contract that If rent is not paid in example 2 months you will leave the house instead of court cases where prople are staying in houses for 9 months rent free .

I not looking for this wont work comments but proactive comments to make it work

Boards could save the day :pac:to save us all taxes

What if someone wants to move within the 25 years?

Cookie_Monster

MaceFace wrote: »

What if someone wants to move within the 25 years?

OP wrote:

If you leave the House early Nama keeps the money you paid and they can start again and you have no problems with getting chased for a Mortgage

simples

OMD

Well anything will be done to make money and perhaps an idea like this will be used in places. It is basically a version of some schemes already in place. However most of the completed houses that are unoccupied are that way for a reason. There are many more houses in Leitrim for example than people to rent them.

Remember also much of the property that will be repossessed by NAMA is either not completed/started or not rentable.

dRNk SAnTA

It's not the worst idea.

But this would end up having a pretty serious effect on the whole rental market. The state would be setting artificial market prices, and that would bring down rents everywhere. I'd prefer not to see the Irish Government becoming Europe's biggest landlord, the property market would be better off in private hands.

WIZE

OMD wrote: »

Well anything will be done to make money and perhaps an idea like this will be used in places. It is basically a version of some schemes already in place. However most of the completed houses that are unoccupied are that way for a reason. There are many more houses in Leitrim for example than people to rent them.

Remember also much of the property that will be repossessed by NAMA is either not completed/started or not rentable.

But im sure that Investing some of the Money they are making from this will go towards finishing the houses to continue this type of project . Also if This is run on a Family idea any member of the Family could be paying the Rent so If the money is not comming from an account from someone who is claiming benifits then the money could be deducted from the Price of the house

Cookie_Monster

some of them should be walled off and used as prisons, heavens knows we need more prison space anyway

The_Honeybadger

Not a bad idea, would work in places but many of the NAMA properties are in places with no demand, and where there is unlikely to be demand in future. This is a positive proposal at least, and I can see something like it being done. This idea is similar to local authority housing, which is a good scheme for people who can't afford to buy their own home in the open market.

Sleepy

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

It's not the worst idea.

But this would end up having a pretty serious effect on the whole rental market. The state would be setting artificial market prices, and that would bring down rents everywhere. I'd prefer not to see the Irish Government becoming Europe's biggest landlord, the property market would be better off in private hands.

The government already interfere in the rental market by placing an artificial floor on rents via the rent allowance limits.

OMD

Most Haunted wrote: »

But im sure that Investing some of the Money they are making from this will go towards finishing the houses to continue this type of project . Also if This is run on a Family idea any member of the Family could be paying the Rent so If the money is not comming from an account from someone who is claiming benifits then the money could be deducted from the Price of the house

But my point is that most of the unoccupied properties are in places where people do not want to buy or rent. The last thing you want to do is reinvest the money to build more of them.

If the property is rentable then it makes most sense in most cases for NAMA to sell any rentable properties it repossesses and let the private sector take the risk of renting them, unless there is a very obvious property price increase likely.

WIZE

OMD wrote: »

But my point is that most of the unoccupied properties are in places where people do not want to buy or rent. The last thing you want to do is reinvest the money to build more of them.

If the property is rentable then it makes most sense in most cases for NAMA to sell any rentable properties it repossesses and let the private sector take the risk of renting them, unless there is a very obvious property price increase likely.

But Nama already own theses Houses so for them to wait until some comes along and wants to buy them is a waste of money

Also while we are bailing out the banks so people Might get a Mortgage they will be holding onto these empty shells for a while

Surely they could get the ball rolling with a couple of Housing estates around the country to test the water ?

Zamboni

OMD wrote: »

But my point is that most of the unoccupied properties are in places where people do not want to buy or rent.

Everything has a price. If the damned things were up on the market at the right price they would sell regardless of location.
These geezers have the right idea.
Middle of nowhere but they will sell at those prices...

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/luxury-homes-for-836499950-as-receiver-orders-firesale-2138636.html

Cookie_Monster

Most Haunted wrote: »

But Nama already own theses Houses so for them to wait until some comes along and wants to buy them is a waste of money

The only own the debt on them, no? Unless they were used as security on said debt, which is fairly likely tbh.

MaceFace

Actually, there is some bones to this idea (apologies, it is long but I think it will work).
Short version: nonrecourse loans for all future mortgages

Long version:
First, here is what I don't like:
If I rent this house, I don't like the idea that if I need to move in 10 or 22 or 24 years time, that I will leave penniless. It opens up corruption here that I can sublease under the counter to cover the time I am not living there.
You need to give people the ability to leave early without losing out on potentially tens of thousands of euros.
Also, as they will be considered tenants until the 26th year, they can not convert attics, build extentions etc.
Another problem with tenants is that you will need someone to manage the property (fix broken windows, pipes, cut grass etc). After a few years, people may do that themselves, but if someone is only interested in a short term letting, they won't.

Lets assume you charge 500 quid a month, and after 25 years of occupancy, say average 4% interest rate, you are valuing the property at 95k.
The actual price (95k) should be open to normal market conditions.

Here is how I would tweak this.
Change new mortgages in this country to be nonrecourse, so anyone can hand in their keys at any time.
Now, allow the government to give out mortgages on these properties (through a semi state body so they are not subject to political interference). The government can only give out mortgages say at 80% of the price of the property, and is subject to strict lending criteria (e.g. 2.5 times main salary plus 1.5 times second). Interest rates are tied on a monthly basis to the government 10 year borrowing rate.

The purchaser now has a house of their own that they will take care of and can move at any time.
The government are giving out mortgages under strict criteria, to people who can afford the property.
The key though is the nonrecourse bit. Now that the purchaser can hand in their keys at any time, so if the government was to allow a bubble to build up again, after this bubble burst, anyone could hand their keys back to the government and they would be in a financial mess (again). Therefore, they would be much more interested in keeping prices at what should be considered normal prices.

SkepticOne

Zamboni wrote: »

Everything has a price. If the damned things were up on the market at the right price they would sell regardless of location.
These geezers have the right idea.
Middle of nowhere but they will sell at those prices...

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/luxury-homes-for-836499950-as-receiver-orders-firesale-2138636.html

The reason this won't happen is that NAMA has been sold on the basis that it is a great investment for the public and that prices are about to rise shortly.