Father minding children - Irish Times Article

burger1979

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/health/2010/0413/1224268217311.html

I have just read the above article and want to know if there are any fathers who have done this, or indeed if any of the mothers who know of their husbands/partners have done this due to work being scrace or being made redundant. I am going to be a dad in august and I work in construction, things aren't going so good in work and there things afoot which could mean i might lose my job in a few months (wife is pretty secure). Myself and the wife have looked at it and from looking after the baby its a win win situation, the baby has constant parental care rather than being in a creche and I would like to think can make that bond grow faster and better with one parent always being around. From a monetary point of view it would mean losing a few bob in net income a month. Indeed we havent fully delved into the figures of trying to balance it all out, its just an initial look and quickly adding up some sums.

But would it be worth it all?

Raiser

burger1979 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/health/2010/0413/1224268217311.html

I have just read the above article and want to know if there are any fathers who have done this, or indeed if any of the mothers who know of their husbands/partners have done this due to work being scrace or being made redundant. I am going to be a dad in august and I work in construction, things aren't going so good in work and there things afoot which could mean i might lose my job in a few months (wife is pretty secure). Myself and the wife have looked at it and from looking after the baby its a win win situation, the baby has constant parental care rather than being in a creche and I would like to think can make that bond grow faster and better with one parent always being around. From a monetary point of view it would mean losing a few bob in net income a month. Indeed we havent fully delved into the figures of trying to balance it all out, its just an initial look and quickly adding up some sums.

But would it be worth it all?

Have not done this but I have heard of People who have done it (some not by choice) who look back on it and are eternally grateful for having the time and experiences.

I've also heard of People who feel that they've missed out on a significant part of their Childs life through the commute/work/commute routine.

- Creches are often just a reluctant source of minimum wage employment for grumpy, disinterested, teenage Girls from what I can see.......

Victor

Financially* the best option might be to look after the kids and it there is occasional work available that you can schedule around your other half's timetable then good. Ideally do it on a PAYE basis to use up personal tax credits.

* Be careful not to fall into the trap of one partner doing days and the other evenings, but at the same time its healthy for all involved to have some time away from their partner, with and without the children.

Bodhan

burger1979 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/health/2010/0413/1224268217311.html

I have just read the above article and want to know if there are any fathers who have done this, or indeed if any of the mothers who know of their husbands/partners have done this due to work being scrace or being made redundant. I am going to be a dad in august and I work in construction, things aren't going so good in work and there things afoot which could mean i might lose my job in a few months (wife is pretty secure). Myself and the wife have looked at it and from looking after the baby its a win win situation, the baby has constant parental care rather than being in a creche and I would like to think can make that bond grow faster and better with one parent always being around. From a monetary point of view it would mean losing a few bob in net income a month. Indeed we havent fully delved into the figures of trying to balance it all out, its just an initial look and quickly adding up some sums.

But would it be worth it all?

It's worth it! I've done it in the last year with our Daughter who's now 18 months. Once the maternity leave was over I found myself alone with a 6 month old, it was weird and lonely at first but you soon get the hang of it.
I did the housework too, making dinners and washing. You get a routine after a bit. Very soon it was easy, and the best part is you miss nothing.
I wouldn't change a thing, best of all my Daughter is happy.

Let me know if you need help, us Fathers need to stick together.

Das Kitty

My friend is a Stay at Home Dad. It works really well for their family. He has a blog on the subject : http://daddynolan.wordpress.com/

My own husband will be staying at home with our son for two days of the week when I go back to work.

I think it's wonderful that children get so much more time with their fathers these days.

burger1979

Victor - part time work could be handy but i dont think that i would be likely to do it until such time that the new born would be in pre-school. we had though about me going part time but in looking at some figures briefly then even that income would not pay for the creche fees/childminder fees.

It is the great cost thats associated with the creche that is pushing us to consider this driection. We both work in dublin but live in navan and the child would have a life like us on the commute (after maternity leave) of early morning and then getting home about 6 in the evening. my wife works in trinity and they have creche facilities which are pretty good.

Bodhan - its nice to hear that you ejoyed it, i have no doubt that i would too, even the house work . Can i ask if you have any friends or know of any one close to you who has a child in the creche/child minder and parents working? do you notice a difference in relationships between their children and your own between child and parent?

Bodhan

Bodhan - its nice to hear that you ejoyed it, i have no doubt that i would too, even the house work . Can i ask if you have any friends or know of any one close to you who has a child in the creche/child minder and parents working? do you notice a difference in relationships between their children and your own between child and parent?[/QUOTE]

Yes I have a couple of friends who have had their child around the same time as mine. Their child was in childcare/childminding from 6 months. They always seem to struggle to find out what the child wants and they can't get him to go to bed, whereas I know all my child's moods tired hungry whatever. I wouldn't go near childcare now, but I would like to go to a parent and child group sometimes.

bogtotty

My brother in law has been out of work and looking after his two kids for the past 18 months or so. He's brilliant with them and it definitely is better for them than them going to a childminder, although it has had a pretty big (and mostly negative) impact on his relationship with my sister. Before he lost his job she was working part-time and taking care of the home & kids and now has had to go back to working all the hours she can to pay the bills. There is an awful lot of resentment on her part that she doesn't get to spend as much time with the children as he does, and of course she blames him for being 'useless' and incapable of holding down a job. She also is of the mindset that a woman's place is with the family, the man should be out working. He doesn't help matters by being fairly hopeless with the housework and by disappearing out to his shed the minute she gets in from work, leaving her with the kids for the rest of the night (which she loves, but she gets zero time to herself).

I would advise that if you're going to do this, make sure you and your partner both fully understand the implications. Will she be okay with being the 'secondary carer', who may miss out on major milestones like baby's first smile, first word, first steps?
Will you be happy to have the baby all day and be mostly responsible for night-time care too (the main earner should be allowed a good night's sleep most nights)?
Will you be happy to do the laundry, shopping and most of the cooking?

Most important is the need to reassess the situation periodically as time goes by, as poor communication can lead to simmering resentments (on both sides) and can be pure poison to a relationship. This can also be the case where the female partner gives up work to be a stay at home parent - I'm not suggesting it is only an issue where the dad stays home.

Personally, if my other half lost his job, I'd be out looking for full-time work in the morning - he and most other dads I know would be just as good caring for their kids as me or most of the mums I know. My hubbie would most definitely be better at this housework malarky than I am...

Nevyn

My Dad became a stay at home dad 25 years ago when he came out of the army and my Mam went to work, he was the stay at home parent for the 5 of us who ranged from 10 to age 2, at the time. So for me a Dad being at home isn't that unusual at all.

If money wise you can work it out and get a routine going for sorting out the house work then go for it.

Sleipnir

I would quit my job and be a stay-at-home dad in a heartbeat. Sign me up.

Bodhan

Its not an easy job by any means. It's 24 hours a day 7 days a week for no pay. The working conditions are what you make them, and you get a lot of abuse from the employers but ahhhh at the end of the day you get to say my child does that because I taught it to her.
There's nothing better in the world than seeing the first steps, or the first time She says dada.
Talk it over with your missus, I know that mine wanted to spend more time at home but we got through that.
It's all good, and with the right attitude there's no down side.

BlackForestJule

My partner works shifts, so he started looking after our daughter on his days off after I went back to work (luckily, his sister takes her when we are both at work). I have to say, it's done his relationship with the little one a world of good. I think he did feel left out quite a bit at the start as I was breastfeeding and she wouldn't really settle for him at all. Now it's more the opposite and it took me a while to accept that he has her for full days while I only get to see her in the mornings and in the evenings for a couple of hours. I must admit that I was quite jealous for a while as she turned into a bit of a daddy's girl. On the plus side, I think he now does understand a lot better that looking after a baby is a full-time job and all arguments about housework have stopped as he realised how little you get done when you have to look after a toddler. Also, I have been working from home for a little while now and she now seems to want both of us again.
I can't comment on what it's like for a man to be a stay-at-home-dad, obviously, but I cannot recommend enough to get dads as involved as possible. In germany, where I come from, couples even get an additional 2 months of parental leave if the partners share and most dads I know do stay at home either parallel with the mother or after she goes back to work. All of them (the ones I know that is) loved it.

problemchimp

I gave up my old job almost 8 years ago when our first baby was born and started driving a taxi at night and weekends while my wife worked full time. We have since had a second child who is now two and a half. I can't imagine life any other way now. It is the greatest years I've ever had and would recomend it to anyone. My relationship with my kids and wife is fantastic and these are years I could never get back. I can be a bit knackered sometimes but that's a small price. I've just given the kids their dinner and here I am now playing on the computer drinking a big mug of tea. Happy days.

casio4

I say go for it, my husband wasn't happy in his job so left to mind our daughter when she was born, at first I was shocked as we were giving up good money and also i thought he would be fed up after 4 months or so, but here we are 18 months later and he and the little one have really bonded.We have had to give up some things like our week in spain in the summer but it's all worth it as i can go to work happy knowing she is with her dad and not a child minder.Make sure you text mammy every day to let her know what you 2 are up to then she won't feel left out and it will brighten her day. Good luck and I hope it works out for the 3 of you like it did for us

Elessar

It is a road I would go down very reluctantly.

I was only recently reading an article on stay at home dads and it can cause massive problems in the relationship. A few were interviewed and stated it destroyed their marriage. The wives grow resentful that they are the breadwinners and lose respect for their partners because they lost their perceived "maleness" having the roles reversed. After a while the wives took the children and left. It's becoming more common now that stay at home dads are on the increase.

Thoroughly think this through, and talk to your wife, before you go for it.

Raiser

Elessar wrote: »

It is a road I would go down very reluctantly.

I was only recently reading an article on stay at home dads and it can cause massive problems in the relationship. A few were interviewed and stated it destroyed their marriage. The wives grow resentful that they are the breadwinners and lose respect for their partners because they lost their perceived "maleness" having the roles reversed. After a while the wives took the children and left. It's becoming more common now that stay at home dads are on the increase.

Thoroughly think this through, and talk to your wife, before you go for it.

Are you aware of how 99.999% of crap print media works?

Editor tells talentless Hack to write an Journalistic Expose/Opinion Piece/Lifestyle Piece on something to fill two pages and sell some advertising.

Hack "writes" comprehensive article in time for his deadline - Makes sure to include some "actual", totally not made up interviews with People and mysteriously unnamed "Friends" of said People stating the drama and shocking insider truths involved..... Blah, blah, horseshít etc. until next riveting story for the Masses.....

car crazy

have to say i think its a lovely idea, im currently unemployed since nov just gone and my little girl is 11wks old, i think i will be waiting until nxt year to look for something, even then part time as i would love to be here for her, if it works out financially for you to stay at home rather than handing out 600euro or whatever it is for a creche per mth certainly do and reconsider things when they go to school or if the economy pics up even go p/time...make sure u get ur house work done tho

Raiser

Please do not attempt to be a stay at home Dad without wearing one of the above NHL Spam Jerseys.

Gloomtastic!

It is a road I would go down very reluctantly.

I was only recently reading an article on stay at home dads and it can cause massive problems in the relationship. A few were interviewed and stated it destroyed their marriage. The wives grow resentful that they are the breadwinners and lose respect for their partners because they lost their perceived "maleness" having the roles reversed. After a while the wives took the children and left. It's becoming more common now that stay at home dads are on the increase.

Thoroughly think this through, and talk to your wife, before you go for it.

I've been looking after our two kids now for six years and I have to agree with the above. My wife works during the week while I work mainly weekends. Luckily, it hasn't broken us up yet but it has not been easy!

BostonB

I did it for a short while 4 months or so and it was fine. Lots of bonding. But I did miss working. I think its important for whomever is at home to have some time away from the house, so its doesn't become your entirely life!

car crazy

id imagine it may be harder for men to stay at home as they see themselves as breadwinners, however, have to say i wouldnt have a prob going out to work and hubby staying at home whatever works best,im a stay at home mother as the company i worked for went into liquidation so didnt have much choice...altho an awful lot of people now adays dont have much choice with the way the econemy has gone...:mad:

Fatscally

Hi

I'm a full time parent and part time worker.
I can always earn a few punts with IT and other weekend work that I do, just like the man that's driving the taxi. This is important to a lot of men because earning money for the home makes them feel worthy and contributing. So get a few odd jobs going on the side, you'll have no time for yourself but you'll be happy for the few quid.

My wife has just earned her 4th year degree so her career path is developing and we feel we need to support that too therefore she's in the 9 to 5. She's a proud Mammy and she's taking a bit of a knock by not being the stay at home parent but I bring the baby to her at least 3 days in a week and I send her phone photos of this and that in the days in an effort to keep her clued in.

She gets up with Baby at 6:30am and does all the caring and feeding until 8:30. When she gets in at about 5ish she'll sort herself out/get in the door, then I'll back off and leave her with the baby. After 8ish we'll have dinner and time together.


I'm doing it for the last 7 months with our first little girl and it's working out fine. It's not easy though. Things like "I need a drop of milk for me tea so I'll just fly down to the Spar" are changed into "I need milk for me tea so I have to get her ready, which means; dress her up warm, don't forget a hat lest the busy neighbours scold you, get bottle ready (boil water, mix, cool down), bring toy, squeeze out the door, either bundle her into the car or walk around (each has it's pros and cons) buy the fekkin milk, come back unbundle her, undress her, settle her down again to Barney or toys etc or maybe do a 1 arm around the house effort and finally have that cup of tea OR I'll just drink water instead.

You have to learn things like your baby has NO concept of time at all, whatsoever. "Gimme a sec" is replied with NOW NOW NOW NOW NOW WAAaaaaaa!!! So you have to re-learn your time management skills; If I say I'll just get this and that done I become frustrated with her and I'm like "ahh for fuksake just gimme a sec will ya?" However if I take a different approach and say "I'm gonna watch 6 hours of Barney today and forgo all the things I want done then even though I might not like it then I'm totally much more relaxed with her. The second she conks out for a nap I'm like a blue@rse fly buzzing around getting things done in triple time.

Taking her to the Pool everyday enters you into the world of "Baby Unfriendly". "Oh we have a dedicated baby changing table over there" and she takes you to a fold down table the size of a mobile phone placed behind 2 heavily sprung doors furthest away from the lockers. ((Like seriously have these architects a brain at all???)) Then I spent 9 weeks complaining that the water was too cold for her and like other babies she was coming out blue at her extremities (really) and that it was more like punishment than fun.
"It's a sports pool and the temperature is correct for training" - Eh so how many oldfolks, babies, disabled, kids do you have and how many olympians do you have? -They turned the pool up by 1 lousy degree!
These are some of the minor but unexpected/realised adjustments you have to get used to.

I could write loads more but here's a few things to keep in mind
They are relentless.
Baby will rely on you for their every need non stop 24/7/365. It's you you you and always you that has to get up and do it.
They have no concept of time.
They feel hunger pains and can't put it off.
The world doesn't give a toss about your problems and how hard it is.
Let teenagers help you - they have tonnes of useful energy.

I will and am looking for a fulltime job because despite having an adequate income being selfemployed means I'm not a little square that fits into a little box on a bank's mortgage form. That's not a huge hurtle, we'll take in an au-pair and look after her that way BUT the bond between me and our baby now is huge and going back to fulltime work is going to be a heart breaker.
-oh well, we men gotta do what we gotta do. Just be greatful and don't wish it all away. :cool:

Karlos13

Interesting topic. You get both sides of the argument from Bodhan and Bogtotty. I think it depends on the personalities of those involved whether it will work or not. No black and white answer.

gowayouttadat

I think it probably depends on the individual.
My boyfriend has been out of work really since our son was born nearly 10 months ago. It's been great that we're both off at the same time but it did look for a while that he would be minding our little fella full time when I went back to work. I honestly don't know how it would have went. I can hand on heart say that we both love the little fella to bits but for women and men being a stay at home parent is so difficult. I don't think I'd handle it very well and I'm female.
The way it has worked out now is that my boyfriend will be working shift so will still end up minding our son 1 or 2 days a week. Having the independence of going out to work on those other days will make a big difference though I think.

NealB

I'm currently in development on a TV series about stay at home dads, I'm interested in parenting from the dads perspective and want to find people who are going to become stay-at-home-dads in the coming months. If anyone is interesed please contact me at www.hollybrookfilms.com/dad, Neal

LegacyUser

Very interesting. The whole debate is fueled by society's perception of male and female. Technically the man is just as capable of looking after a child while the woman works - but society has perceived that men should be the breadwinners. Fatscally's points are all extremely good in terms of childcare and facilities in th this country, but at end of the day, they are the exact same challenges a woman would (and does) face when caring for their child.

Setting that aside, I am married with no kids yet and we both work in construction (engineers). Obviously our jobs are less than safe and we both want to get new ones - the hours are ridiculous aswell. I'm hunting at the moment, but we've agreed that when/if I get something else, he wants to go back and do teaching.

We've discussed it a lot - personally I have no interest in teaching, but I kind of feel that as long as one of us is at home in the afternoons/holidays when children do eventually come, that's all that matters. We both know it will not be easy - I come from a family where my mother was a teacher, both my parents worked through my childhood and still do.

Reversing the roles will be very different though, and difficult at times. We're willing to try it anyway - and although since I obviously don't have kids I can't tell, but I feel that I don't want to sit at home with a small child all day, I want to work and have my own life too.
Some very interesting points here for me to think about though!

Fatscally

@NealB; Your link isn't working

civgirl wrote: »

Fatscally's points are all extremely good in terms of childcare and facilities in th this country, but at end of the day, they are the exact same challenges a woman would (and does) face when caring for their child.

Absolutely. I'm not sure what angle I was writing from or towards but I think I was writing more towards men because these are some of the things that you just don't really understand until you live it. I should do a full post about my daily trips to the new local pool. It might be good for your engineering.
Overall the whole experience has been very enlightening to how hard women work in the home. It looks like they're pottering about the home and popping out when it suits them but they're really on call all day and getting out when they can. They might by majority be better suited to or prepared for the task from something as simple as growing up with dolls but it's still a huge effort. And when I see a woman with a buggy and 2 kids tagged on to it I think Holeyf* that's asking for it.

civgirl wrote: »

...and although since I obviously don't have kids I can't tell, but I feel that I don't want to sit at home with a small child all day,

That might change when you see their little face.:D

civgirl wrote: »

I want to work and have my own life too.

It's just not that simple.:o Everything becomes a juggle and a balancing act. Great if you've lots of people around like nannies and teens etc but something has to be traded if it's just the 2 of you in the mainstream. I think that's what's high lighted in this thread.

Offy

Elessar wrote: »

It is a road I would go down very reluctantly.

I was only recently reading an article on stay at home dads and it can cause massive problems in the relationship. A few were interviewed and stated it destroyed their marriage. The wives grow resentful that they are the breadwinners and lose respect for their partners because they lost their perceived "maleness" having the roles reversed. After a while the wives took the children and left. It's becoming more common now that stay at home dads are on the increase.

Thoroughly think this through, and talk to your wife, before you go for it.

Bases on my life I have to agree with you Elessar. Thoroughly think this through, and talk to your wife, before you go for it.

LegacyUser

Fatscally wrote: »

@NealB; Your link isn't working


Absolutely. I'm not sure what angle I was writing from or towards but I think I was writing more towards men because these are some of the things that you just don't really understand until you live it. I should do a full post about my daily trips to the new local pool. It might be good for your engineering.
Overall the whole experience has been very enlightening to how hard women work in the home. It looks like they're pottering about the home and popping out when it suits them but they're really on call all day and getting out when they can. They might by majority be better suited to or prepared for the task from something as simple as growing up with dolls but it's still a huge effort. And when I see a woman with a buggy and 2 kids tagged on to it I think Holeyf* that's asking for it..

I know that's the angle you were coming from, I was just having a little dig at men in general!!! It's true, you are right, men (and often women) don't understand how much work it is until they've experienced it for themselves. As with so many things in life.

[/QUOTE]That might change when you see their little face.:D.[/QUOTE]

That's what I keep getting told!! Ah no, I know it's all very well to sit here from my point and say things like that, but I suppose what I really meant was that as much as I hear about how great it is to mind your kids, I also hear about how it can be very lonely, or people realising that all they've got to talk about to their friends is what their kid did that day. I'd prefer no creches, a childminder for some of the day, and one or the other of the parents for the remainder of the day, but that's just my personal preference. All I'm saying is that I want a life of my own too...Just because I can have babies doesn't mean that I'm not entitled to a life aswell. (it's hard to make it sound non-insulting to others!)

It's just not that simple.:o Everything becomes a juggle and a balancing act. Great if you've lots of people around like nannies and teens etc but something has to be traded if it's just the 2 of you in the mainstream. I think that's what's high lighted in this thread.[/QUOTE]

I understand something has to be traded, but what I'm saying is that he wants to do teaching which allows him a lot of time at home, whereas I intend to stay in a 9-5 job if possible. Essentially it is reversing the roles, because my OH will be the one with more time at home. He's okay with this - my hours mean he's already cooking dinner for us a lot of evenings! I juggle a huge amount as it is.....loathe though I am to say it, it's something a lot more women do than men. Our relationship is very 50/50 - housework,shopping,etc gets split between us. Probably partly to do with the fact that I'm with men all day long, and what I've been trained in.....I just don't differentiate. He lives in our house as much as I do, and it's his responsibility to clean up as much as it's mine. We discuss everything, and hopefully will continue to do so into the future!!

Now that I've completely derailed the thread, I'll stop! To the OP - keep talking to your wife about it, make sure everything is out in the open and discussed and I'm sure you'll do fine.

AutumnComission

Raiser wrote: »

- Creches are often just a reluctant source of minimum wage employment for grumpy, disinterested, teenage Girls from what I can see.......

I beg your pardon but I work in a creche and am neither grumpy, disinterested NOR a teenage girl. I am a fully qualified lady who loves working with children - In fact I gave up my better paid full time job to return to college and study childcare. I now do something I love in the company of people I love spending my time with, both staff and children alike. So before you tar all childcare workers with the same brush, and jump to highly irrational comclusions, think twice about the genuine people out there who mind children out of love for the job and come up against judgemental people such as yourself blackening our name. :mad:

eviltwin

My husband became a stay at home dad to our 12 year old daughter in Jan 09.

He loved it. He's since gone back to work but only on a part time basis because he enjoyed being at home so much. He would have stayed at home forever but the bills need paying!

We now have a baby of 7 months in addition to our daughter and all I can say is that having both of us at home for the first few months of his life was fantastic for all of us. I have had such an easy time of it because the extra pair of hands is there, he has bonded with the baby more than he could have thought possible and our daughter has a much better relationship with him.

I personally didn't have a problem with being the main earner. If anything our relationship is better than it was. We have talked more in the past six months than we ever have and thats with a new baby!!

Will it work for you? Maybe, maybe not but you have no reason not to give it a go.

casio4

I agree with the post above, try it out and if you do I would love to know how you get on.