O'Gara's comments in the Guardian. *Read Mod Warning, Post #13 BEFORE posting.*

Kev37

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/apr/06/ronan-gara-munster-northampton

Thought it was deserving of it's own thread rather than clogging up the Munster Northampton match thread.

I am disgusted. Criticising a fellow player saying hes only there for development and then saying we would of won if he was on the pitch is really sticking the knife in. What really gripes me is this isnt the first time he has publicly criticised a fellow player. No other Irish player has ever come out and criticised a fellow team mate and I believe O'Gara's actions were a disgrace.

I ask Munster fans, if Fitzgerald came out after the French game and said Earls was only starting for development and if he himself had been playing we would of won how would you react?

Very low, opinions?

danthefan

I'm going to be very careful in this thread because it has potential to head south very quickly, but I think there are some very disappointing and disrespectful comments from ROG there in my opinion.

kippy

I think its much ado about nothing to be honest.
1. Nobody knows if they are direct quotes.
2. He doesnt actually criticise anyone.
3. If its true, its good to see a bit of honesty from a player.

Ash.J.Williams

There is nothing wrong there. I think the thread slightly misleads the facts.

JustinDee

Kev37 wrote: »

No other Irish player has ever come out and criticised a fellow team mate and I believe O'Gara's actions were a disgrace

I'll bet your right nut that if you heard a transcript of said interview it was a cherry picked section of a quote and context wholly different to how it reads in the Grauniad.

nosco

Kev37 wrote: »

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/apr/06/ronan-gara-munster-northampton

Thought it was deserving of it's own thread rather than clogging up the Munster Northampton match thread.

I am disgusted. Criticising a fellow player saying hes only there for development and then saying we would of won if he was on the pitch is really sticking the knife in. What really gripes me is this isnt the first time he has publicly criticised a fellow player. No other Irish player has ever come out and criticised a fellow team mate and I believe O'Gara's actions were a disgrace.

I ask Munster fans, if Fitzgerald came out after the French game and said Earls was only starting for development and if he himself had been playing we would of won how would you react?

Very low, opinions?

Here, we all know what he's like. I think its fairly obvious that he has viewed himself as a great player when the irish rugby public view him as a very good player. I think thats where the problem lies. Its as if he's thinking "here, what the hell is going on here. I've done x,y,z but i'm not treated as a legend like others".

Webbs

I'm neither a Munster or Leinster fan and certainly never been a fan of O'Gara but all I see is a player believing he has more ability than his rival and could have won a game.
I would be more disappointed if a player didnt believe that, and there is nothing wrong in voicing that opinion, show me a winner in any sport who doesnt have a belief that they are better than their competition.

seeing_ie

Yeah, nothing wrong there imo, if he didn't think he could've done a better job he might as well hang up the boots. I'm glad Sexton got the gametime though.

e2a : beaten to it by webbs

Kristopherus

Kev37 wrote: »

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/apr/06/ronan-gara-munster-northampton

Thought it was deserving of it's own thread rather than clogging up the Munster Northampton match thread.

I am disgusted. Criticising a fellow player saying hes only there for development and then saying we would of won if he was on the pitch is really sticking the knife in. What really gripes me is this isnt the first time he has publicly criticised a fellow player. No other Irish player has ever come out and criticised a fellow team mate and I believe O'Gara's actions were a disgrace.

I ask Munster fans, if Fitzgerald came out after the French game and said Earls was only starting for development and if he himself had been playing we would of won how would you react?

Very low, opinions?

What are you talking about. There is absolutely no reference to a development player on that link you gave. IMHO ROG opined nothing more than what most people thought after the first half of the Scotland game.

Riskymove

Kev37 wrote: »

Very low, opinions?

I dont know who is taking it more out of context the Guardian or you

1.

'saying hes only there for development '

he says he understands that the IRFU is

'trying to develop two outhalfs'

that is quite different to what you suggest he says

2.

we would of won if he was on the pitch is really sticking the knife in

he says

'I felt I could have made a better go of that [Scotland] game from the start'

again I contend its not what you are saying he said

danthefan

Kristopherus wrote: »

What are you talking about. There is absolutely no reference to a development player on that link you gave. IMHO ROG opined nothing more than what most people thought after the first half of the Scotland game.

The half where we scored a try that we couldn't possibly have scored with ROG on the field?

What is your interpretation of this then anyway:

"It's an interesting position I'm in. I understand Ireland need to develop two out-halves but Test rugby is played in the present tense..."

Dempsey

I see nothing wrong with the article, someone care to point out the drama?

toomevara

Against my better judgement I'm leaving this open for a bit, but watching this thread like the proverbial. Any bollixology and it's getting closed. Remember do not abuse players, do not abuse each other and ANY tribal trolling and a ban is guaranteed.

JustinDee

Some people are just too quick to jump on a view without taking a little breather first.
Way too thin-skinned.

buck65

O Gara would have probably kicked the points true, Sexton certainly did ok from play but his kicking was poor during that game.
Let's not forget Sexton nailed a crucial kick with O Gara on the sideline waiting to come in, this was a serious pressure kick.
Both good players who bring different strengths to the table , I could care less about what they say in the press or how it's quoted, their performance on the pitch is all that matters.
Neither are particularly likeable individuals and are quite full of their own importance, I woudn't get too bothered by it they certainly won't.

Aidric

Webbs wrote: »

all I see is a player believing he has more ability than his rival and could have won a game.

Exactly. Heaven forbid a player come out and speak his mind for fear of upsetting a few faint hearts.

TarfHead

Just read the article.

So, to conclude, O'Gara has confidence in himself and backs himself to be a success. Like a few years ago when he made 'incendiary' comments about players in the English Premiership.

Not much of a story, IMHO :rolleyes:

danthefan

Aidric wrote: »

Exactly. Heaven forbid a player come out and speak his mind for fear of upsetting a few faint hearts.

Pretty sure I can remember your good self getting upset and a Sexton interview in the past, and he said nothing like what ROG has said here.

myflipflops

What's the big deal?

In the era when himself and Humphreys were tit for tat in the Ireland number 10 jersey, he often stated his frustration at being benched or subbed and felt he could do a better job given more time. In his book he stated that he went so far as to have a go directly at Eddie O'Sullivan about it.

O'Gara is ultra confident and ultra competitive. Of course he thinks he's better than Sexton.

If he came out and said, 'I should play because Sexton is rubbish' then that's not on. Coming out and saying he feels he feels he should start is fine.

Aidric

danthefan wrote: »

Pretty sure I can remember your good self getting upset and a Sexton interview in the past, and he said nothing like what ROG has said here.

Eh, I'd say you should go back and check that thread if it's the one on that interview he gave Thornley. I didn't get upset at all, he has every right to speak his mind as does ROG. I think I commented on his temper which he himself eluded to in the article.

rjb80

I don't see anything wrong with this article. I'm a Leinster fan and happy to see O'Gara show that being dropped hasn't dented his confidence, just the opposite in fact, it's gotta be good for the Irish team while Sexton sorts out his kicking.

danthefan

Aidric wrote: »

Eh, I'd say you should go back and check that thread if it's the one on that interview he gave Thornley. I didn't get upset at all, he has every right to speak his mind as does ROG. I think I commented on his temper which he himself eluded to in the article.

You found something in absolutely nothing in a Sexton interview, yet it's all good with ROG. 'Upset' is possibly the wrong word so.

Kev37

My gripe with it is he states had he been on the pitch we would not of lost against Scotland. He is essentially attributing the defeat to Sexton for missing 2 kicks. In reality I doubt O'Gara would of gotten the try though so he should really watch his comments. I didnt see any players come out and criticise him for missing tackles against France so why is he doing the same to a young player?

JustinDee

Kev37 wrote: »

He is essentially attributing the defeat to Sexton for missing 2 kicks

. . . according to the article in the Grauniad.

sock puppet

It's hardly anything new. He said he thought he should have started ahead of Jones for the Lions. If he actually believes that then it's hardly surprising he thinks he would have done better than Sexton, a much less accomplished player.

myflipflops

Kev37 wrote: »

My gripe with it is he states had he been on the pitch we would not of lost against Scotland.?

I'm sure he fully believes it too. So what though?

I bet there's plenty on the fringes of the tea/squad who might feel the same. At least he comes out and says it.

I also guarantee Jonny Sexton doesn't give a sh*t what O'Gara thinks.

D-Generate

Players competing for spots on teams has never done damage to squad development. It is healthy to have rivalries between players for positions, god knows how much we gave out when ROG looked like he was getting complacent due to having no competition for No. 10.

danthefan

D-Generate wrote: »

Players competing for spots on teams has never done damage to squad development. It is healthy to have rivalries between players for positions, god knows how much we gave out when ROG looked like he was getting complacent due to having no competition for No. 10.

Don't think you'll find anyone who sees competition for places as a negative (apart from the guy who loses out maybe).

wixfjord

Possibly misconstrued and theres not that much in the article, but mother of god how is it always O Gara that this happens to, not just a coincidence imo! Someone get this man some P.R. lessons, he hasnt a clue how to handle media. These are all things a pro sportsman should think, but not say, and depending on where you stand on O Gara you may appaud his bravery or condem his stupidity to repeatedly be caught up in stuff like this.

phog

danthefan wrote: »

The half where we scored a try that we couldn't possibly have scored with ROG on the field?

What is your interpretation of this then anyway:

I think he meant he wants to be known for what he does now not what he did before i.e he wants the No10 jersey for his country and wouldn't he be a fool to say otherwise. He was cricitised for not being honest in his autobiograpghy now some are saying he needs PR lessons becuase he is too outright.

I dont see anything out of order in anything he said, I bet if you got the full context of the interview it wouldn't be close to what is qouted.

Aidric

wixfjord wrote: »

Someone get this man some P.R. lessons, he hasnt a clue how to handle media.

By 'handle the media' do you mean give soft copy? There are enough robots doing a great job at that.

wixfjord

phog wrote: »

I think he meant he wants to be known for what he does now not what he did before i.e he wants the No10 jersey for his country and wouldn't he be a fool to say otherwise. He was cricitised for not being honest in his autobiograpghy now some are saying he needs PR lessons becuase he is too outright.

I dont see anything out of order in anything he said, I bet if you got the full context of the interview it wouldn't be close to what is qouted.

He just shouldnt be allowed to give interviews imo, because it seems that every year there are three or four minor controversies about O Gara and his 'honesty' or idiocy depending on how you see it. Its not wrong as Ive said to think this, but for the love of Christ man dont say it. The same with the stuff about the ML at the start of the year, and numerous other instances of ROG talk!

Would be interested to hear what JustinDee has to say about this coming from a media (?) perspective.

canine

Much ado

Dempsey

Yea, I rather sportsmen/women speak their mind that give those bland media trained answers. Just look for the player's quotes and ignore the journalists spin on the interview.

wixfjord

Aidric wrote: »

By 'handle the media' do you mean give soft copy? There are enough robots doing a great job at that.

Yep exactely. Suits Uncle Deccie, O Driscoll and O Connell down to the ground doesnt it> What Im saying is it doesnt benifit a pro sportsman to be honest and fortright with the media, and ROG is the epitome of this. What has he to gain from telling people this? Nothing. But it could (not saying it will) affect moral and team spirit, and definitely will affect peoples perceptions of him.

Aidric

wixfjord wrote: »

Its not wrong as Ive said to think this, but for the love of Christ man dont say it.

Rrrrright..so he should say what he doesn't think is it?

wixfjord

Aidric wrote: »

Rrrrright..so he should say what he doesn't think is it?

Haha your some man!
No he shouldnt say anything at all and keep his trap shut if controversial opinions could harm a team imo, as I say what has he to gain from the above, however tame it is, the stuff about the ML or the stuff about the GP?! Nothing except negative outcomes.

Micky Dolenz

The usual suspects knocking O Gara here and bigging up Sexton and visa versa, bit daft.

There is nothing shocking in that article.

wixfjord

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

The usual suspects knocking O Gara here and bigging up Sexton and visa versa, bit daft.

There is nothing shocking in that article.

I hope thats not aimed at me I havent mentioned he who shall not be named. If your gonna go down that road why not say the usual suspects defending ROG?! Thats where a lot of posters here fall down, a bit of common sense and perspective with your own teams players goes a long way.
Would you not agree that ROG could do with brushing up on the P.R. side of things, or do you blindly defend him as a ligind because of his honesty?!

Also the only bigging up that other player, is Buck65, as fair as I see, hes a usual suspect for knocking O Gara and bigging up that other guy is he?!

themont85

Nothing wrong with bigging himself up.

But my God, giving out about the 'Dublin media'. This is the same media which licked Munster's hole and his for years, that is a fact. Its not like he was routinely criticised in the Irish media, this isn't Britain. The likes of Thornely and Ward barely ever criticised him. This is the same media which lauded him as 'world class' for years. Just because Kevin Myers wrote an article (which writing a letter to a newspaper giving out about it is very thin skinned) doesn't make the media 'anti Rog', if suggesting Sexton as OH is considered by Rog then he really needs to grow up.

Micky Dolenz

wixfjord wrote: »

I hope thats not aimed at me I havent mentioned he who shall not be named. If your gonna go down that road why not say the usual suspects defending ROG?! Thats where a lot of posters here fall down, a bit of common sense and perspective with your own teams players goes a long way.
Would you not agree that ROG could do with brushing up on the P.R. side of things, or do you blindly defend him as a ligind because of his honesty?!

Also the only bigging up that other player, is Buck65, as fair as I see, hes a usual suspect for knocking O Gara and bigging up that other guy is he?!

Hence the visa Vice Versa.

danthefan

Look, he is not just 'bigging himself up'. Read this quote, bolded bit especially:

"It's an interesting position I'm in. I understand Ireland need to develop two out-halves but Test rugby is played in the present tense. The most frustrating part of the Six Nations from my point of view was that we didn't win a Triple Crown. Ireland have only won 10 in their history and I felt I could have made a better go of that [Scotland] game from the start."

What is the interesting position he finds himself in? It's either he's been dropped for the better man, or he feels he's been dropped for the sake of development, and it's pretty clear what ROG thinks. He is essentially saying Sexton does not deserve to be starting. This is not something you say about one of your teammates in public.

Risteard

wixfjord wrote: »

I hope thats not aimed at me I havent mentioned he who shall not be named. If your gonna go down that road why not say the usual suspects defending ROG?! Thats where a lot of posters here fall down, a bit of common sense and perspective with your own teams players goes a long way.
Would you not agree that ROG could do with brushing up on the P.R. side of things, or do you blindly defend him as a ligind because of his honesty?!

Also the only bigging up that other player, is Buck65, as fair as I see, hes a usual suspect for knocking O Gara and bigging up that other guy is he?!

He did.

wixfjord

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Hence the visa Vice Versa.

Sorry didnt see that

Kev37

Aidric wrote: »

Rrrrright..so he should say what he doesn't think is it?

He shouldn't comment about a team mate like that. Just yesterday thomond posted a video where Ferris and Fitzgerald were being interviewed in a funny manner, a question was put to them who would they rather start at 10 and both refrained from answering the question. That was in a relaxed, joke like enviroment and still they refrained. O'Gara made those statements about a fellow player in a national newspaper and its just plain nasty.

Aidric

Kev37 wrote: »

O'Gara made those statements about a fellow player in a national newspaper and its just plain nasty.

There is nothing nasty in there. You are simply overreacting.

congress3

I can't see anything wrong with what he said. This thread is very misleading.

castie

danthefan wrote: »

Look, he is not just 'bigging himself up'. Read this quote, bolded bit especially:



What is the interesting position he finds himself in? It's either he's been dropped for the better man, or he feels he's been dropped for the sake of development, and it's pretty clear what ROG thinks. He is essentially saying Sexton does not deserve to be starting. This is not something you say about one of your teammates in public.

theres two sides you could go from that and your taken the insulting one.
Could he not of easily as meant that in his opinion hes the better OH and feels Sexton is starting ahead of him for development. Hes not saying Sexton isnt good enough to start, hes saying he deserves to start instead of Sexton and feels Sexton is ahead of him due to development reasons

toomevara

Thats enough of that. No more, and don't take this crap on to other threads.