Why aren't we doing this?

genericguy

in thailand they don't like their government, so they stormed the parliament today:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0407/thailand.html

Everyone here seems to be pissed the fcuk off with cowen and his fat posse constantly sticking their hands into peoples' wallets, taking money away from health services, education, justice etc. and giving it to the banks. soon they're taking business away from the headshops to give it to drug dealers. they're planning to make everyone work later into their lives, which will eventually extend so far that nobody will be able to retire in the country. They've chopped the pay of low grade civil servants, yet they are giving an exemption from said cuts to the highly paid ones.

Look at what other countries do in similar situations:
In france they fcuking run amok until they get what they want.
Greece, they don't stand for it either.
in russia... well, you know.

what do we do when we're unhappy here? we go to the pub and grumble into a pint, and because the price of that pint was reduced recently, Fianna Fail stay in power. whether or not you deem what they are doing necessary or not isn't important,

edit: Just to clarify - i have no position with regard to nama etc. i'm just speaking based on the things i most often hear people complaining about)

but why is it that a nation founded as the result of a revolution never does anything despite complaining about being shat on time after time?

Max Power1

we cant do it here, the dail is still on their easter break are they not?

lol

Also some would say that the NAMA decision was as a result of a lot of goverment ministers being stoned

Sheeps

ok, yo go first im right behind you

IvyTheTerrible

Yeah, except in Thailand they are trying to get a corrupt fecker back into government.

Ruu_Old

You go first.

Biggins

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

Yeah, except in Thailand they are trying to get a corrupt fecker back into government.

Bertie is in Thailand now? :eek:

dr.bollocko

They're always at that the Thais. Interesting political history actually. I blame their inability to afford a constant supply of brain melting booze.

genericguy

Sheeps wrote: »

ok, yo go first im right behind you

meh, the only thing that really bothers me in this country is crime, and to be fair to myself i'm packing in my Ph.D. to *hopefully* become a Garda so I can make my contribution, so I'm doing my bit.

Glenster

because our country doesnt look like a penis and testicles, it looks like a grizzly bear, rearrr!

Sheeps

genericguy wrote: »

meh, the only thing that really bothers me in this country is crime, and to be fair to myself i'm packing in my Ph.D. to become a Garda so I can make my contribution, so I'm doing my bit.

ok so what is it your're' complaining about exactly?

prinz

genericguy wrote: »

..why is it that a nation founded as the result of a revolution never does anything despite being shat on time after time?

You answered your own question tbh. We weren't founded as the result of a revolution, we were founded as the result of factional infighting, civil strife and back stabbing. Ireland has never been any different. Back through the centuries there was always one c*nt who'd do anything to get one over on the next, the 'greater good of Ireland' has always been and is a secondary thought.

peabutler

Because no one can organise a protest to save their lives.

genericguy

Sheeps wrote: »

ok so what is it your're' complaining about exactly?

how people grumble about issues that annoy them , yet make no effort to rectify them.

Sykk

genericguy wrote: »

what do we do when we're unhappy here? we go to the pub and grumble into a pint?

Or in your case, go on a forum and whine about it!

Sheeps

genericguy wrote: »

how people grumble about issues that annoy them , yet make no effort to rectify them.

ironic that youve posted about an issue that has annoyed you and when we told you that you should go first you kind of back down and made it all a non issue

D.Q

You go ahead, We're right behind you.

fontanalis

Would you trust the type of morons you hear complaining to run a country?

rossie1977

read this OP http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8004306.stm

thailand is nothing more than a giant group of rival football supporters

believe me you don't want ireland following them, if you think its bad now it could get a hell of alot worse

RMD

Have you not noticed by now the vast majority of the Irish public like nothing more than to complain and bicker about things but when it comes to actually doing something about it they sit on their ass and wait for someone else to do it.

Max Power1

Sheeps wrote: »

ok, yo go first im right behind you

Ruu wrote: »

You go first.

DieselQueen wrote: »

You go ahead, We're right behind you.

sounds like the op is gaining support by the second!

genericguy

Sheeps wrote: »

ironic that youve posted about an issue that has annoyed you and when we told you that you should go first you kind of back down and made it all a non issue

I don't see that. I've said that people complain about these things, yet do nothing, and i've asked why people think this paralytic grumbling happens here, as opposed to the protests carried out by people in other countries when things are upsetting them.

ejmaztec

There seem to be so many pissed off groups, each with a different agenda, that if they did all pile up to Dublin, they'd be start fighting amongst themselves long before they reached the dail. Biffo and his chums wouldn't even know that anything was happening, because they'd be miles away from the punch-up.


As for a revolution, there's another 700 years to go for that, judged on past performance.:(

Agricola

The main difference between the Ireland of today and Ireland pre-1922 is that the target of all the previous revolts was the British crown. We have a long and proud history of putting it up to the Brits, before being hammered back down again. Its easy to get behind revolt against foreign oppression!

This time the culprits of the devastation are other Irish men, those running the banks and running the country. I think deep down alot of us arent able to summon up the same level of blind hatred against democratically elected Irish people as we are so adept at doing for British monarchs! So the default position is to grumble, resigned to our fate.

peabutler

genericguy wrote: »

in thailand they don't like their government, so they stormed the parliament today:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0407/thailand.html

Everyone here seems to be pissed the fcuk off with cowen and his fat posse constantly sticking their hands into peoples' wallets, taking money away from health services, education, justice etc. and giving it to the banks. soon they're taking business away from the headshops to give it to drug dealers. they're planning to make everyone work later into their lives, which will eventually extend so far that nobody will be able to retire in the country. They've chopped the pay of low grade civil servants, yet they are giving an exemption from said cuts to the highly paid ones.

Look at what other countries do in similar situations:
In france they fcuking run amok until they get what they want.
Greece, they don't stand for it either.
in russia... well, you know.

what do we do when we're unhappy here? we go to the pub and grumble into a pint, and because the price of that pint was reduced recently, Fianna Fail stay in power. whether or not you deem what they are doing necessary or not isn't important,

edit: Just to clarify - i have no position with regard to nama etc. i'm just speaking based on the things i most often hear people complaining about)

but why is it that a nation founded as the result of a revolution never does anything despite complaining about being shat on time after time?

If you want it done organise it. Setup a Pirate Radio station and stick it to the man.:)

DonkeyStyle \o/

peabutler wrote: »

Because no one can organise a protest to save their lives.

Max Power1 wrote: »

sounds like the op is gaining support by the second!

OP for mod of a new Protest Planning forum.

(imagines various scenes from Life of Brian)

Nulty

Thailand = ladyboys.

shoegirl

Don't be fooled by this carry on in Thailand, this "opposition" is basically large numbers of people who were bribed by Thaksin in the past and probably still now. They are not a genuinely democratic opposition, but like our own "golden circle" the angry disenfranchised vested interest group who like Thaksin because he looked after their interests.

This challenge is tantamount to massive protests by builders and bankers in our economy, except of course, they've nothing to protest against, having had billions poured into their tankers at the taxpayers expense.

AnonoBoy

I'm going to get right on this as soon as Lost is over.

SV

because it's a nation of people who won't do anything for themselves and want it all 'fixed' without ever doing anything.

genericguy

SV wrote: »

because it's a nation of people who won't do anything for themselves and want it all 'fixed' without ever doing anything.

this fcuking "shore it'll be grand" attitude grates on me.

parker kent

Because it would cause ridiculous political instability and reduce us to a nation of idiots in the eyes of the world. We would basically be committing economic and social suicide.

Caoimhín

dr.bollocko wrote: »

I blame their inability to afford a constant supply of brain melting booze.

Ha, yeah, give them loads of booze, Taytos and English football and there wont be a peep out of them.

ejmaztec

Agricola wrote: »

The main difference between the Ireland of today and Ireland pre-1922 is that the target of all the previous revolts was the British crown. We have a long and proud history of putting it up to the Brits, before being hammered back down again. Its easy to get behind revolt against foreign oppression!

This time the culprits of the devastation are other Irish men, those running the banks and running the country. I think deep down alot of us arent able to summon up the same level of blind hatred against democratically elected Irish people as we are so adept at doing for British monarchs! So the default position is to grumble, resigned to our fate.

If we had a good rabble-rouser, that would be easily managed, the only problem being that I can't think of one.

In before The Godwin.

dr.bollocko

God wins again.

prinz

Caoimhín wrote: »

Ha, yeah, give them loads of booze, Taytos and English football and there wont be a peep out of them.

That explains Shinawatra's interest in Man City then...

inforfun

dr.bollocko wrote: »

They're always at that the Thais. Interesting political history actually. I blame their inability to afford a constant supply of brain melting booze.

I would throw over a government for a cold Singha now though...

D.Q

Max Power1 wrote: »

sounds like the op is gaining support by the second!

we just need a leader.

twinQuins

Can I just say I'm fucking terrified that there seems to be a generation that compares our situation to those of countries with actual fucking dictatorships and real problems.

Have people really lost all perspective?

EuskalHerria

Morkarleth wrote: »

Can I just say I'm fucking terrified that there seems to be a generation that compares our situation to those of countries with actual fucking dictatorships and real problems.

Have people really lost all perspective?

What are you talking about? We as a nation a have a serious problem here. Nobody is saying that we have the largest problem (although cowen has to be a contender) but we still have a problem.
That problem is a completely inept government. Everyone knows they are incapable of getting us through the recession because look at how they have handled things so far. The have failed to tighten the reins of the bankers and speculators because they are of the same ilk as those who led us into this recession.
What has been done? Nothing! As was said there's such a passive attitude to it all and the same fools that got us hear are being allowed to blindly lead us out of it, which their not doing. As a nation we're hoping that its just magically going to get better.

ScumLord

Violence and ripping apart the current government with no idea what your replacing it with will just leave us in a mess.

Organizing your local community, making a clear list what what's lacking and how you think it can be improved would be a start, never mind the rest of the country sort out your own back garden first, but if your doing nothing then there's no point of complaining about other people doing nothing.

conorhal

DieselQueen wrote: »

we just need a leader.

That's a bingo!

The problem with an organized protest movement as I see it is a lack of leadership, who are we to coalesce behind? Socialist Joe? Eamon Glib-more? Enda KennnZZzzzzz? Some granola munching sandal monkey?


It used to be that a protest could be led by a charismatic intellectual figure that could articulate the grievances of the masses in a focused way, but the sad truth is that there's a severe lack of leadership in this country, and in it's absence all we have are grumbling sectional interests all pulling in different directions.

Dunjohn

Can't afford the bus ticket over to Dublin for it. Otherwise, hell, yeah.

parker kent

EuskalHerria wrote: »

What are you talking about? We as a nation a have a serious problem here. Nobody is saying that we have the largest problem (although cowen has to be a contender) but we still have a problem.
That problem is a completely inept government. Everyone knows they are incapable of getting us through the recession because look at how they have handled things so far. The have failed to tighten the reins of the bankers and speculators because they are of the same ilk as those who led us into this recession.
What has been done? Nothing! As was said there's such a passive attitude to it all and the same fools that got us hear are being allowed to blindly lead us out of it, which their not doing. As a nation we're hoping that its just magically going to get better.

Are you honestly saying he is a contender given what happens in Africa, South America and Asia? Ireland is in a much better situation than countries like Greece too. Their government have an international reputation for being liars and incompetent. In fact, the CIA World Factbook even mention corruption and poor governance.

Ireland on the other hand, have people who have grown up with unrealistic expectations. Plus a few others who are old enough to know better. The governments international reputation is actually not bad. The last budget and NAMA are relatively well received in the international markets.

But of course that is not as funny or as easy to say. It is not as if people bought houses they couldn't afford out of their own free will or anything (Plus the other dozens of reasons for the global financial crisis). Instead lets find ourselves scapegoats in the bankers and the government. Lets completely lose the run of ourselves in over-the-top remarks about how poorly we are being run.

Yes they have made mistakes. But I mean honestly...Morkarleth is right. People are comparing our stable government with countries where they have civil wars and saying we have a contender for worst leader.

EuskalHerria

parker kent wrote: »

Are you honestly saying he is a contender given what happens in Africa, South America and Asia? Ireland is in a much better situation than countries like Greece too. Their government have an international reputation for being liars and incompetent. In fact, the CIA World Factbook even mention corruption and poor governance.

Read the sentence again, I was subtly having a go at Cowens size, i'll not be so subtle about it next time.

Ireland on the other hand, have people who have grown up with unrealistic expectations. Plus a few others who are old enough to know better. The governments international reputation is actually not bad. The last budget and NAMA are relatively well received in the international markets.

Yes, its unrealistic expectations that has led is into financial meltdown and left half a million people unemployed. I'm sure dole lines are filled with people still thinking their going to be actresses and footballers.:rolleyes:
At least have the common sense to admit that nothing but greed has got us where we are now.
Nama can be aswell received by the global elite all it wants, its not taking money out of their pocket is it? Its probably well received because of the sheer audacity of the government even trying it, let alone gettting away with openly giving away billions.

But of course that is not as funny or as easy to say. It is not as if people bought houses they couldn't afford out of their own free will or anything (Plus the other dozens of reasons for the global financial crisis). Instead lets find ourselves scapegoats in the bankers and the government. Lets completely lose the run of ourselves in over-the-top remarks about how poorly we are being run.

Those people who made the mistake of investing and re mortgaging are being made responsible for their actions, its well accepted that people are more than struggling with daft purchases and financial decisions they made.
The thing is accountability only goes so far up the ladder. When it comes to institutions like anglo the government are giving them bailouts? Their is a better way and for the money already spent anglo could have been allowed go belly up and the government assured those who didn't deserve to be punished for such massive financial mismanagement.

The fact is that certain people at the bottom and middle rungs of the ladder are being punished, while those at the top are getting bail outs and continuing like before.

Yes they have made mistakes. But I mean honestly...Morkarleth is right. People are comparing our stable government with countries where they have civil wars and saying we have a contender for worst leader.

We do have a horribly incapable leader in power. He isn't the worst but he is a problem in this country and we have to focus on that.

But I get your point, don't think for a minute I don't count my blessings for Brian Cowen:rolleyes:

ScumLord

parker kent wrote: »

Ireland on the other hand, have people who have grown up with unrealistic expectations. Plus a few others who are old enough to know better. The governments international reputation is actually not bad. The last budget and NAMA are relatively well received in the international markets.

Well received by who though, other bankers and economists looking for a way back to unrestricted profiteering at the expense of others?

As far as I'm concerned these people are trying to fix a fundamentally flawed system for they're own benefit, we won't get anything out of it and 20 years from now we'll more than likely be heading into another recession as that seems to be the cycle on these things.

parker kent

EuskalHerria wrote: »

Read the sentence again, I was subtly having a go at Cowens size, i'll not be so subtle about it next time.

Oh yes humour....I'll have to download that upgrade some day

Fair enough I get your points too. I guess I just used your post to get out a rant that has been inside me for a while! It is just people annoy me by finding scapegoats. Bankers are the current boogeyman. It will be something else in the future.

Sometimes not every problem can be isolated down to some nefarious forces, sometime s**t just happens. A lot of people need some perspective (not you, the people in the dole queues who thought they were on their way to millions for example). We may not be the best, but we are far from the worst. Just because some people got a raw deal, doesn't mean the whole system is corrupted.

parker kent

ScumLord wrote: »

Well received by who though, other bankers and economists looking for a way back to unrestricted profiteering at the expense of others?

As far as I'm concerned these people are trying to fix a fundamentally flawed system for they're own benefit, we won't get anything out of it and 20 years from now we'll more than likely be heading into another recession as that seems to be the cycle on these things.

Well who else is responsible for monetary decisions? Somebody, somewhere has to make the calls. When the economy gets going, everybody will benefit to some extent. Bankers, economists etc are not hiding away in a cave with Bin Laden with all the money. In the good times, infrastructure, schools, sports etc benefit. Sure some argue it could be better spent somewhere else, but people will always disagree. Largely it is distributed OK. People get higher wages. It is not restricted to people that work with money.

EuskalHerria

parker kent wrote: »

Fair enough I get your points too. I guess I just used your post to get out a rant that has been inside me for a while! It is just people annoy me by finding scapegoats. Bankers are the current boogeyman. It will be something else in the future.

I don't want a scapegoat, I want accountability. Bankers and speculators gambled and lost. If someone went into paddy powers and lost a fortune on a bet they shouldn't be bailed out.
Sheer greed led rich people who were not satisfied with their wealth to try and gamble in the hope of acquiring more wealth, they fcuked up and its the normal working people of this country that have been made pay and in an effort to deflect from the governments shortcomings, workers have turned on one another.
There is no bailouts for anyone except for those who fcuked up in the first place. Even though they are the creators of the circumstances of what should have been their own downfall, they get bailed out. This recession has hit the pockets of everyone but those responsible.

They should be made accountable for their actions and not bailed out by the hard working people of this country.

Sometimes not every problem can be isolated down to some nefarious forces, sometime s**t just happens. A lot of people need some perspective (not you, the people in the dole queues who thought they were on their way to millions for example). We may not be the best, but we are far from the worst. Just because some people got a raw deal, doesn't mean the whole system is corrupted.

We are far from the worst, I agree. That however does not mean that we should accept the current inadequacies of the government and sit by while we watch them sign us up for massive debts.
Again its a passive if not apologetic attitude that is leading us down the drain. Other countries are starting to get out of the recession and we are still here chasing our tails.

Cunning Stunt

BREAKING NEWS -- Dail stormed by angry boardsies - govnt forced to adapt Thai escape plan and flee by helicopter...

ScumLord

parker kent wrote: »

Well who else is responsible for monetary decisions? Somebody, somewhere has to make the calls. When the economy gets going, everybody will benefit to some extent. Bankers, economists etc are not hiding away in a cave with Bin Laden with all the money.

That kind of implies that the money we're talking about is a real and tangible thing when it's not. It only exists on hard drives and peoples imagination. It's a false economy that plays politics with actual resources in an extremely wasteful way so that a few can profit.

Max Power1

Cunning Stunt wrote: »

BREAKING NEWS -- Dail stormed by angry boardsies - govnt forced to adapt Thai escape plan and flee by helicopter...

youd need a hell of a lot more power to airlift that whale mary harney out of there!