acupuncture ...... Has anyone tried it

Timmywalldo

Im thinking of trying it but im a bit of a skeptic

any good experiences out there

homerun_homer

My experience with acupuncture were frustrating ones. I was told to try it to help with sleep problems and tinnitus (I was surprised to hear that this potentially could help too). The acupuncturist was recommended to me and I did 3 sessions in all I think before I gave up. She analysed me and found that I was very tense, too much going on in my head keeping me awake at night - and this was just from checking my pulse, a few other things & one or two minor questions.
I was told that the sessions would be short enough but I would be left in the room for ages on end, with someone in a car outside waiting for me. This made me more frustrated, especially when the acupuncturist would begin to arrive back to the room only to get called to see if she wanted a cup of tea, which she accepted. At that point I had been waiting ages as it was and to hear them having tea and biscuits while my sister texts me to hurry up was really aggravating me.

It did nothing for me but aggravate me more so I quit the sessions and found no benefit to them at all. But that's just me. It works for some, not for others.

L31mr0d

I'm a consummate skeptic in regards to these things but a few years back I pulled my hamstring (Grade 2). The Doctors gave me a series of exercises and said to just let it heal normally and gave it 9 weeks.

A friend of the family does acupuncture, he said he would examine my hamstring and give me the first session for free.

While there I also told him I have a constant tension and slight pain in my lower back at all times (even now) He talked about channeling Qi and some other stuff which I ignored then started sticking needles in me.

There was zero pain from the needles and almost instantly all tension in my lower back dissipated. You have to understand, I always have a slight amount of tension and pain in my lower back, even when lying prone. Call it placebo, call it whatever, it was completely unexpected from me. He said the procedure interrupts the signals from my lower back to my brain which is why I was no longer able to feel pain from it.

I went to 4 weeks of sessions and my hamstring was fine again.

I haven't been since though. As soon as he removed the needles the pain in my lower back returned. I think the needles do work in that they interrupt electrical signals going to the brain. But as to the lasting benefits of this? I'm not so sure.

The_Minister

Never had it, but I'd suggest going to one of the actual doctors who does it, not some randomer.

WIZE

I have done it loadz a times . But thats because my sister is on The Professional Register of Traditional Chinese Medicine

Panthro

tried it for sinus headaches and asthma..
still get sinus headaches, and still living with asthma
not my kind of thing i dont think.

deadhead13

I tried it for a sinus problem as well...didn't work.

LostinBlanch

L31mr0d wrote: »

There was zero pain from the needles and almost instantly all tension in my lower back dissipated. You have to understand, I always have a slight amount of tension and pain in my lower back, even when lying prone. Call it placebo, call it whatever, it was completely unexpected from me. He said the procedure interrupts the signals from my lower back to my brain which is why I was no longer able to feel pain from it.

I went to 4 weeks of sessions and my hamstring was fine again.

I haven't been since though. As soon as he removed the needles the pain in my lower back returned. I think the needles do work in that they interrupt electrical signals going to the brain. But as to the lasting benefits of this? I'm not so sure.

Glad to hear it worked for you, as regards the lasting benefits - you cold compare it to the lasting effects of taking a course of medication or excercise or both. If you stop taking your medication or doing excercise you're probably not going to get the benefits of it. The same with acupuncture.

Acupuncture can work for a number of conditions, the W.H.O. has listed conditions where it has proved beneficial.

The OP or anyone else who is thinking of getting acupuncture should make sure that the practitioner is properly trained, generally this means a minimum of 3 years training, which meets WHO guidelines. They should have insurance and be a member of a professional association like the AFPA all members operate under a code of ethics and practice, which is always a good thing IMO.

If you've got insurance with VHI, Aviva, Quinn etc they also have a list of qualified acupuncturists, so you could contact them.

Finally, if you are on any medication for you condition, no reputable acupuncturist should suggest you stop taking it, without discussing it with your GP first of all.

Osgoodisgood

I've used acupuncture on several occasions for sports injuries. The most successful was in treating a sprained ankle in 10 days in prep for a big game. I've also used it whilst rehabing muscle tears (in addition to physio, strapping, excercise) and found it to greatly assist the process.

Dave!

It's bollix basically

If your ailment is something that may improve on it's own, or with rest and relaxation, then I'm sure it couldn't hurt, but for most of the stuff they say they can fix (sinuses, acne, asthma, etc) it's useless.

There has been plenty of study on it and basically it just amounts to a placebo, there's no science behind it.

You know those elaborate diagrams with all the different locations on the body that they need to put the needles? The energy zones or whatever. Well those are nonsense. Studies have been done where they give people acupuncture, some people with the needles being put in the exact place the diagrams say, and some with them being put in random locations, and the effect is the same. Similarly, with some subjects the needles break the skin, as acupuncturists normally do, whereas with others they just pressed down on the skin with something like a toothpick, and again the effect is the same.

It's the theatre and mysticism of the procedure that helps some people with minor complaints.

If your ailment is serious, then go to a doctor/physio. Otherwise just go to masseuse and relax for a couple of hours.

entropi

The_Minister wrote: »

Never had it, but I'd suggest going to one of the actual doctors who does it, not some randomer.

Well it would be hard to find some randomer practicing it i would say, takes like 6 years proper training to be certified iirc?

Two guys i know went and had treatments for injuries, where there was a problem with nerve function afterwards and they both said it was brilliant.

keenan110

I got acupuncture for to stop migraines and it worked really well, hardly ever have them now, and before i started the acupuncture i used to get them about 4 times a week.

The_Minister

Master of Nothing wrote: »

Well it would be hard to find some randomer practicing it i would say, takes like 6 years proper training to be certified iirc?

Two guys i know went and had treatments for injuries, where there was a problem with nerve function afterwards and they both said it was brilliant.

Yes, but there are actual qualified doctors in Dublin that practice some acupuncture.

This guy is one: www.allergy.ie, and I'm sure there are others.

degausserxo

I've suffered with chronic back pain since I was about fourteen. I've been on every medication under the sun, hospitalised way too many times and have been 'diagnosed' with degenerative disk disease and sciatica (neither of which, it turned out, were correct diagnoses). The amount of medication I was on completely dulled me for about two years of my life, and I just had to stop and find an alternative. The past three months I've been seeing a doctor who practices acupuncture and it's really helped me. I used to feel a constant dull pain in my right leg which has completely subsided, and I haven't felt any real pain in my back since starting. I never really had problem skin, but I'd always have a spot or two somewhere on my face, be sickly pale and have deep, dark circles under my eyes, but I haven't had a single blemish in the past three months (I haven't changed my diet or any cleaning products or moisturisers) and my skin has brightened up a lot. I would recommend acupuncture thoroughly, but obviously by a professional.

abouttobebanned

Tried it for hayfever. Didn't work.

Exclamation Marc

Tried it for sinus problems did sweet FA to help. I ended up coming out more so in pain after one or two of the needles in sore spots.

Will never go again.

dango

I was coerced into doing it for sinus problems. One session a week for a month. Didn't work at all.

Gran Hermano

Do you think acupuncture can do anything for pins and needles?

Tabnabs

I received acupuncture from my Physio for chronic lower back pain. I tried all the GP & medication, osteopath and chiropractors, but the physio really helped. Then she suggested using acupuncture in addition to the physio and although sceptical at first, it was carried out at no extra cost as part of the physio treatment and I was very impressed with the results.

A thumbs up for acupuncture if carried out by someone qualified in western medicine and also registered (she was registered in the UK as their register was more "official").

faceman

Dave! wrote: »

There has been plenty of study on it and basically it just amounts to a placebo, there's no science behind it..

Not entirely true anymore.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4631930.stm

I watched that documentary and there was also another study done in the UK on a batch of patients with a specific leg injury that caused pain. Similar to the link below, they had the patients hooked upto to either a CT or MRI machine during the accupuncture session that it showed the effect it had on the brain and the patient's pain.

The UK study took a sample of AFAIK 700 people. One third were given no accupuncture, another third "fake" accupuncture (unbeknownest to them) and the final third proper accupuncture. I cant remember the stats now as it was a few years ago, however there was a significant difference in pain relief for those who received the accupuncture. I should point out that all subjects suffered the same affliction.

I had accupuncture myself many years ago for tinnitus but it was complimentary to TRT (tinnitus retraining therapy) I was receiving. I found the accupuncture useful.

princess-lala

I had it done on my neck and back of my head! Just the once though! I swore never again!

Didnt do much for me pain wise though! My dad had it done for years on his knees and it worked for a while - his wasnt supposed to be a long term solution though!

LostinBlanch

faceman wrote: »

Not entirely true anymore.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4631930.stm

I watched that documentary and there was also another study done in the UK on a batch of patients with a specific leg injury that caused pain. Similar to the link below, they had the patients hooked upto to either a CT or MRI machine during the accupuncture session that it showed the effect it had on the brain and the patient's pain.

The UK study took a sample of AFAIK 700 people. One third were given no accupuncture, another third "fake" accupuncture (unbeknownest to them) and the final third proper accupuncture. I cant remember the stats now as it was a few years ago, however there was a significant difference in pain relief for those who received the accupuncture. I should point out that all subjects suffered the same affliction.

I had accupuncture myself many years ago for tinnitus but it was complimentary to TRT (tinnitus retraining therapy) I was receiving. I found the accupuncture useful.

Ah jaysus, Faceman you can't be showing evidence that it works, it'll give the professional skeptics conniptions!

Dave!

faceman wrote: »

Not entirely true anymore.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4631930.stm

You know that the patient undergoing heart surgery was loaded up with sedatives and local anaesthetic? Not exactly compelling evidence for the efficacy of acupuncture mate :pac:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/3344833/Did-we-really-witness-the-amazing-power-of-acupuncture.html

For example, the scene showing a patient punctured with needles and undergoing heart surgery left viewers with the strong impression that acupuncture was providing immense pain relief. In fact, in addition to acupuncture, the patient had a combination of three very powerful sedatives (midazolam, droperidol, fentanyl) and large volumes of local anaesthetic injected into the chest.

With such a cocktail of chemicals, the needles were merely cosmetic. In short, this memorable bit of television was emotionally powerful, but scientifically meaningless in building a case for acupuncture.

The BBC actually upheld a complaint made against it in relation to this experiment, and admits that it "misled" the public.

faceman wrote: »

I watched that documentary and there was also another study done in the UK on a batch of patients with a specific leg injury that caused pain. Similar to the link below, they had the patients hooked upto to either a CT or MRI machine during the accupuncture session that it showed the effect it had on the brain and the patient's pain.

The UK study took a sample of AFAIK 700 people. One third were given no accupuncture, another third "fake" accupuncture (unbeknownest to them) and the final third proper accupuncture. I cant remember the stats now as it was a few years ago, however there was a significant difference in pain relief for those who received the accupuncture. I should point out that all subjects suffered the same affliction.

Might be worth having a read of this article about it.

However, Professor George Lewith of Westminster University, the most experienced acupuncture researcher on the team devising the BBC experiment, criticises the way the experiment was presented: "The interpretation of the science in this particular programme was not good and was inappropriately sensationalised by the production team. I think all of us on the experiment felt like that."

Although sympathetic about some of the claims of acupuncturists, he contradicts the way the experiment was described: "The experiment was not groundbreaking, its results were sensationalised and there was insufficient time to analyse the data properly and so draw any sound conclusions. It was oversold and over-interpreted. We were encouraged to over-interpret, and proper scientific qualifications that might suggest alternative interpretations of the data appear to have been edited out of the programme. Because the BBC had funded the experiment, they wanted their money's worth - that's not a good basis for science."

But even if you grant that experiment, science doesn't work on the basis of individual experiments (I presume this one was just designed for the TV show too, hardly as rigorous as peer review is it). The overwhelming consensus from experiments shows that putting needles in the skin may indeed have an effect, but (a) it doesn't matter where you put the needles, (b) it doesn't matter if you break the skin or not, and (c) it doesn't even matter if you use needles* !

*

In George Ulett’s research, he found that applying an electrical current to the skin of the wrist – a kind of TENS (transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation) treatment – worked just as well as inserting needles, and one point on the wrist worked for symptoms anywhere in the body.

Here's a quick study on acupuncture's effect on lower back pain, and it concludes that it doesn't matter where the needles go, and it doesn't matter if they penetrate the skin.

faceman wrote: »

I had accupuncture myself many years ago for tinnitus but it was complimentary to TRT (tinnitus retraining therapy) I was receiving. I found the accupuncture useful.

You reckon it would have been useful without the TRT?


Here is a good article analysing the efficacy of acupuncture.

LostinBlanch wrote: »

Ah jaysus, Faceman you can't be showing evidence that it works, it'll give the professional skeptics conniptions!

Not sure who you think is paying me, but if you could get onto them and have them put the money straight into my account that would be great -- so far I haven't recieved a penny ! :eek:

faceman

Dave! wrote: »

Lots of stuff

Interesting, I hadnt seen those articles before. Thats not good.

wrote:

You reckon it would have been useful without the TRT?

No definitely not on its own but it did have an effect. The reason I say that is similar to most tinnitus sufferers, you quickly grow a sense of hopelessness because there isnt a cure and conventional and alternative therapy is pants. (With the exception of TRT, but its a lengthy process) There is no magic pill and every treatment I took i had a massive scepticism attached. The accupuncture was complimentary to the TRT. A bit like having a fever and taking paracetomol but also placing a cold wet towel on your forehead.