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Greedy Dragons

  • 26-03-2010 10:23am
    #1
    FusionNet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 695 ✭✭✭


    Does anyone else think the Irish Dragons on Dragons Den are very greedy when it comes to percentage ownership? Compared to the UK dragons who seems to give bigger amounts at less percentage our guys seem like the typical rip of Irish?! I know our dragons are poor compared to the UK but stil, I havent seen an investment where they havent wanted 50%...


    It would make me personally take my ideas over to the UK rather than pitching here..


    Any thoughts...


Comments

  • #2
    Axwell
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    Yeah was saying the same to my mate last night. Everytime someone pitches the amount of equity always seems to end up at 50% or very close to it. Maybe its down to the current climate and the next season of the UK one will be the same!


  • #3
    BennyBlanko
    Closed Accounts Posts: 179 ✭✭BennyBlanko


    to be honest, some of the ideas are so sh!te, and with the risk involved, any dragon would want 50% or more of it.


  • #4
    FusionNet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 695 ✭✭✭FusionNet


    Ah but they only invest in the soundish ones.. I mean the woman in it took a year and a bit to put her money where her mouth was..

    I think some of the ideas are great and deserve investment but I feel bad for people back into a corner. I mean one would think the least you'd want is 51% percent of your own business so as to be a majority shareholder..

    Am I right in thinking this. If two dragons went in on a business and took 50% say, then the business became huge and was genuinely a massive success. Could the 2 dragons eventually muscle out the original owner as they have 50%?


  • #5
    Axwell
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    They would have 25% each, they are 2 individuals not a single entity called "the dragons". Most people on it are glad of the investment though and take the offer. It would make more sense of them to take the offer but suggest that if they reach their estimated targets that the percentage drop. So if I reach my turnover of 150k in year one your stake goes down to say 20% each. I think only one person so far has made that type of deal. Also the thing is just because they get a deal on the show doesnt mean they actually go through. A lof of deals on the Den fail later on due to patents not being there or issues arising that dont appear on the show at the time of the pitch. The editing is awful on the show though, if you watch each week its always the last and/or first pitch that gets money.


  • #6
    BennyBlanko
    Closed Accounts Posts: 179 ✭✭BennyBlanko


    FusionNet wrote: »
    Am I right in thinking this. If two dragons went in on a business and took 50% say, then the business became huge and was genuinely a massive success. Could the 2 dragons eventually muscle out the original owner as they have 50%?

    yes, they would have votes on motions at board level. But, they could not take over a co without the other 50% from the original owner, but they could make life real messy.
    Could you image having to deal with that bint :rolleyes:


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  • #7
    Axwell
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    BennyBlanko wrote: »
    Could you image having to deal with that bint :rolleyes:

    lol yeah shes a bit of a pain in the ass on the show alright but thankfully she doesnt invest much at all, you would nearly be hoping if you were on it that she would just say shes out asap


  • #8
    BennyBlanko
    Closed Accounts Posts: 179 ✭✭BennyBlanko


    +1


    I have an idea myself for the DD, but to be honest, I'd only want investment from Gavin, hes the switched on one there and a guy you could do business with.
    But if I do go on, i'd be doing it for the free promotion on national telly, not really to get an investment and if some came along, I'd badger them down to MY percentage, not theirs.
    If not, I'LL BLOW THEM OUT!


  • #9
    Bandara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭Bandara


    Its a tv show, nothing else.

    Its similar to any reality style show in the amount of interest the dragons have in the people pitching to them.

    With the odd extreme exception they are normally looking for such tiny amounts that if their idea was any way good they would have investment long before they got anywhere near going on a tv show looking for it.


  • #10
    martingore
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 129 ✭✭martingore


    I was reading an article about the uk version and as another poster said , the majority of the deals fall through and the contracts contestants have to sign are absolutely crazy, running for hundreds of pages .


  • #11
    Axwell
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    Id be interested in any of the others to be honest, preferably Sean and Gavin I think though. Gavin made a post on his blog yesterday about the woman on last night at the end, basically saying you should thank them for their offer of investment and if you are after a second dragon wait till you have them then ask about the percentage and reducing it. The minute Sean said 25% she said 50% would be way too much and didnt even have a second Dragon on board.


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  • #12
    Axwell
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    martingore wrote: »
    I was reading an article about the uk version and as another poster said , the majority of the deals fall through and the contracts contestants have to sign are absolutely crazy, running for hundreds of pages .

    They actually did a show on it in the UK showing some of the deals that went through and how they are doing today and they were talking about it how so many just fall by the waste side after the show and never get going due to all these issues later on when things become more looked into. Then they also had some that didnt get investment off the dragons and got it elsewhere and how they are doing. There was one James Caan hasnt invested in and the guy was after making a load of money once he got going and James Caan joked how he had missed out on that one and made a mistake.


  • #13
    D.W
    Closed Accounts Posts: 218 ✭✭D.W


    Hammertime wrote: »
    Its a tv show, nothing else.

    Its similar to any reality style show in the amount of interest the dragons have in the people pitching to them.

    With the odd extreme exception they are normally looking for such tiny amounts that if their idea was any way good they would have investment long before they got anywhere near going on a tv show looking for it.

    Agree 100%-most are looking for such tiny amounts to take their idea/product to a National/International level that its simply unfeasable. Ok the free on air publicity is worth a huge amount but if your idea was that good would you sell half for a few grand?


  • #14
    Dark Phoenix
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,185 ✭✭✭Dark Phoenix


    Axwell wrote: »
    They actually did a show on it in the UK showing some of the deals that went through and how they are doing today and they were talking about it how so many just fall by the waste side after the show and never get going due to all these issues later on when things become more looked into. Then they also had some that didnt get investment off the dragons and got it elsewhere and how they are doing. There was one James Caan hasnt invested in and the guy was after making a load of money once he got going and James Caan joked how he had missed out on that one and made a mistake.

    I saw this it was really interesting! Was it the guy with the tangle teezer product that he said he missed? It was funny the dragons were not overly enthsed about his idea but he has done really well for himself andthe product has had very good reviews


  • #15
    bon ami
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 85 ✭✭bon ami


    The dragons den whether it is the UK or Irish is primarily for entertainment purposes , it's a TV show. The dragons are there because it enhances their image. Yes the do on occcasions stumble upon a good idea and a person capable of delivering on the idea but the majority of proposals fall down because they will never transfer into a profitable business or the people lack credibility.


  • #16
    flash harry
    Closed Accounts Posts: 511 ✭✭✭flash harry


    yeah saw it yesterday and the standard was poor compared to UK, not really anything where you'd go "great idea" which I think you do get in UK show, at least occassionally.

    I'm not sure would all those Dragons really open doors for you the way the UK ones would, I dont thinnk they are as multi faceted (spelling?) as their UK counterparts.


  • #17
    DubTony
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,267 ✭✭✭DubTony


    It's a TV show and for that reason it's a big fail. The Irish dragons are way too nice. Most people who view it aren't watching it for the skill of the presenter or for how good his product is. They're watching to see people getting slagged off and humiliated. Whether this is right or wrong is irrelevant. It is what it is.
    Duncan Bannatyne and Theo Paphitus are brilliant at this. The only Irish guy who does it consistently from what I've seen is Niall O'Farrell. HAving said that I don't watch the show very much because it's really not all about helping entrepreneurs / inventors bring their product to market. It's about showing idiots with their idiot ideas being shown up, and as I said, it doesn't do that very well at all.


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