To the 'former' atheists here.......

JimiTime

Hi Guys and Gals,
A question for the Christians who used to be atheists.

a) Were you 'won over' by reasoning? I.E. arguements with other Christians about the validity of Christianity etc.

b) Do you see your former self in any of the regular atheist posters? If so, what traits resemble your former ways of thought?

c) Were you a 'thinking' atheist or merely a 'meh' one. I.E. You made a choice that you were an atheist based on 'reasoning';) and you conciously rejected theism in all its forms, or you were an atheist in a 'Ah I don't believe in all that sh!te, mines a pint' kinda way?

Fanny Cradock

JimiTime wrote: »

If so, who?

Humm, that could get a little personal. Perhaps sticking to general traits would be better?

MrPudding

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Humm, that could get a little personal. Perhaps sticking to general traits would be better?

Aw, that woudl be the most interesting part...

MrP

JimiTime

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Humm, that could get a little personal. Perhaps sticking to general traits would be better?

It was just an afterthought to the question anyway, a kind of 'measuring rod' thing. You're probably right. I'll edit it out.

PDN

I was much more argumentative and antagonistic than most of the atheists who post here. In fact I would have been banned from both here and the A&A forum pretty sharpish.

Arguments played little or no part in my conversion. It was much more about meeting real Christians who obviously had something real happening in their lives.

Xluna

PDN wrote: »

I was much more argumentative and antagonistic than most of the atheists who post here. In fact I would have been banned from both here and the A&A forum pretty sharpish.

Arguments played little or no part in my conversion. It was much more about meeting real Christians who obviously had something real happening in their lives.

I never knew you used to be an athiest. Do you think you're happier now that you're a Christian?

Slav

Good question Jimi! Although I think I wouldn't be able to give precise answers I'll give it a go.

a) Were you 'won over' by reasoning? I.E. arguements with other Christians about the validity of Christianity etc.

No, I don't think so. There were not too many Christians around and I don't remember them discussing anything related to the faith. Also it was not too easy to find any Christian literature; I remember my first book was a copy of the New Testament which I got not long before I baptised. Perhaps only the first step for me was 100% reasoning when after being exposed more to science in the course of my education I realised that Agnosticism might hold more weight then Atheism. Then based on some personal experience and thanks to my raising interest in Philosophy it became evident for me that we also exist in some spiritual realm and not just the physical one. Then for quite a while there was Buddhism, a really fascinating teaching. From this point I cannot really explain what was happening; I can only say that after few years that journey had ended (or just started) when I heard a priest saying my name and "...is baptised in the Name of the Father, Amen, and of the Son, Amen, and of the Holy Spirit, Amen". All my attempts to find out what exactly helped me reach that point are not very successful; I can say that this or that could possibly influence it but at the end I always give up and conclude that perhaps God guided me and it will probably remain a mystery for me how exactly He did it.

b) Do you see your former self in any of the regular atheist posters? If so, what traits resemble your former ways of thought?

No, I don't think so. Perhaps because if I were a true atheist I would not be bothered posting either here or in A&A! :P
But seriously, I have a great respect for atheist here and in real life. I've met many sincere and bright people among them.
And to be honest, I have a fear that if Orthodoxy did not exist I would return back to Atheism or Agnosticism after all...

c) Were you a 'thinking' atheist or merely a 'meh' one. I.E. You made a choice that you were an atheist based on 'reasoning' and you conciously rejected theism in all its forms, or you were an atheist in a 'Ah I don't believe in all that sh!te, mines a pint' kinda way?

I was raised in an environment where Atheism was very natural. That sort of Atheism does not even need to fight against Theism. In most people minds theism and religion in general was something that Humanity has already left behind, something that only few uneducated hundred years old grannies were still believing in, so it was rather silly to debate it seriously. Atheism as a scientific discipline still was taught by the education institutes but its polemic with theism only existed in academic environment which had very little in common with the day-to-day life.

Thomas828

I was never a true atheist. I never said "There's no God. There's nothing but us here." Looking back, I'm not sure what I was, whether I was agnostic or pagan or what. I was really a Christian who drifted away from religion in his teens and who has only recently drifted back again. The difference between me now and me five years ago is now I feel more at ease with the world, myself and my future. And I have something more to look forward to on Sundays than just a day of lazing about.

philologos

I wasn't an atheist, but I was an agnostic, in that I didn't care. I thought there might have been this thing called God out there, but I couldn't know Him. I believe that agnostics are very different creatures to atheists from my past. A good friend of mine who is agnostic at the minute would definitely be of the same opinion. There is a difference in how open one is, and how much people are willing to think about it all.

liamw

PDN wrote: »

Arguments played little or no part in my conversion. It was much more about meeting real Christians who obviously had something real happening in their lives.

Could you expand on that? Do you mean that life events happened for them in such a way that a naturalistic explanation was improbable?

thebaldsoprano

Slav wrote: »

Perhaps only the first step for me was 100% reasoning when after being exposed more to science in the course of my education I realised that Agnosticism might hold more weight then Atheism. Then based on some personal experience and thanks to my raising interest in Philosophy it became evident for me that we also exist in some spiritual realm and not just the physical one.

I find this very interesting. I too studied sciency stuff and would regard myself as an agnostic. I'm studying for an art degree at the minute and with it being exposed to new approaches to evaluating the world around us. While I wouldn't go so far as to use the word 'spiritual' this does include the possibility that there's more to the world than that which we can rationally deduce from our five senses. An unfortunate aspect of this is that it's rather difficult to articulate though.

Were there any philosophers you found particularly interesting at this point?

Seaneh

The C.S. Lewis book "A Pilgrims Regress" could have been written about me.

I was a passionate atheist between the ages of 13 and 17ish (think I was saved just before my 17th birthday). I thought people believed in god were weak and needed his existance to explain their lives, using it a s a crutch etc, the whole "sure it'll all be better in heaven" thing, doesnt matter that your life sucks now, you'll be grand when you get to heaven.

Looking back I don't think I ever didn't believe in God though because I hated the idea of God and religion so much and really I don't believe you can hate something that passionately if you don't have some sort of belief in it, no matter how what you think.

Then at 16 I befriended a JW and he'd talk about God to me and I'd mock him etc, I started to read the bible to find holes and poke fun at him about it, and the more I read the more I realised that Christianity was nothing like I thought it was. this put some sort of seed in me because one day I was walking through Athlone and a girl called Heini from Helsinki looked me dead in the eye and said "Do you know that God loves you", I laughed at her said "whatever" and walked straigh by her, got on ym bike and cycled home. The whole way home something in me was screaming GO TALK TO THAT GIRL so I get to my house, get off the bike, put the key in the door and all of a sudden I found myself back on the bike and cycling towards town. I talk to her for about 5 hours, debating, poking "holes" in her beliefs but everything I said she had a valid answer to, pointed out social and historical conext of certain things, pointed out how stuff didn't actually contradict itself at all. These were things my JW friend was never able to do. I was shocked. I went home, read about 4 books of the NT looking for holes of flaws. found a few (I thought) and text her about them, she phoned me and explained them again, offered to meet me again and talk about it more etc. this went on for a few weeks and the one night in bed I experienced a sort of epiphany, stuff made sense to me all of a sudden. I told her and she asked if I thought maybe I believed in God now, I said I did, she said ok, think about it and if you are sure ring me tomorrow or whenever and we will do something about it.

So I thought about it for a month, in the month I didn't text or email her one and she didn't contact me. Then I text her and said "ok, what do I do now". She met me for a coffee and gave me a card with a salvation prayer, the standard "Jesus I accept you as my personal saviour yadda yadda" thing, explained John 3:16 to me fully. I was like "so, all I have to do is believe and say out loud that I believe and want god to be part of my life and that's it? what's the catch? where's the hard part" and she was like "there is no hard part, God took that away from you, all you have to do is be thankful and accept his gift". I took the card and went home and looked at it now and then for about 3 weeks. then one day, on my bike cycling through town I had another epiphany, turned my bike toward a park, got off, took the card out of my wallet and rather sheepishly said the prayer, not sure what to expect. But when I finished saying it I just felt amazing, I can't explain what it was like but the only other time I've felt like that was when I was baptized 3/4 years later on the beach in Troon (near glasgow). Just the rush of joy and I wasn;t able to stop giggling and I got really giddy and stuff.

That's when I knew for sure that God was real, I started to see him in everything. #


But yeah, basically, when I actually researched Christianity, it made sense to me, I logiced myself into faith, much like Lewis.

lmaopml

Jackass, I would say I was more agnostic too, in that I didn't really care - I was just too caught up in living, where I was going, career paths etc.

I remember at uni, a friend studying English Literature handed me a poem...and wanted my thoughts on it, an atheist mind..... While it didn't 'convert' me to anything, it was the first time I really stopped and studied myself and started to think about these things, it wasn't a religious poem either..lol

The seed was there of 'maybe', and it harboured...

It took a number of years and touching on various different faiths to come around to Christianity.I'm still learning, and I don't regret it one bit..

strobe

Seaneh wrote: »

I was passionate between the ages of 13 and 17ish.....


Then at 16....I was walking through Athlone and a girl called Heini from Helsinki looked me dead in the eye.......something in me was screaming GO TALK TO THAT GIRL so I get to my house, get off the bike, put the key in the door and all of a sudden I found myself back on the bike and cycling towards town. I talk to her for about 5 hours..... poking "holes" in her..... These were things my JW friend was never able to do. I was shocked. I went home..... she phoned me and..... offered to meet me again and more etc. this went on for a few weeks and the one night in bed I experienced a sort of epiphany...... all of a sudden. I told her and she asked if I thought maybe.... I said I did, she said ok, think about it and if you are sure ring me tomorrow or whenever and we will do something about it.

Then I text her "ok, what do I do now". She met me for a coffee and gave me..... the standard "I accept you" thing, explained.....to me fully. I was like "so, all I have to do is.....say out loud that I believe and want....the hard part" and she was like "there is no hard part. I went home and looked at it now and then for about 3 weeks. then one day, on my bike cycling through town I had another epiphany... got off.... rather sheepishly.... not sure what to expect. But when I finished...... I just felt amazing, I can't explain what it was like but the only other time I've felt like that was when I was..... on the beach in Troon (near glasgow). Just the rush of joy and I wasn;t able to stop giggling and I got really giddy and stuff.

That's when I knew....everything. #

Scandinavian girl?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgoXUzIwXk0

(just a joke, couldn't help it, no offense meant, please don't ban me)

DrumSteve

strobe wrote: »

Scandinavian girl?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgoXUzIwXk0

(just a joke, couldn't help it, no offense meant, please don't ban me)

I thought the same haha

Slav

thebaldsoprano wrote: »

I find this very interesting. I too studied sciency stuff and would regard myself as an agnostic. I'm studying for an art degree at the minute and with it being exposed to new approaches to evaluating the world around us. While I wouldn't go so far as to use the word 'spiritual' this does include the possibility that there's more to the world than that which we can rationally deduce from our five senses. An unfortunate aspect of this is that it's rather difficult to articulate though.

Were there any philosophers you found particularly interesting at this point?

Pure atheism is very logical if we are limited by the scientific method of the pre-20th century natural science. Its choice is a classic example of Okham's Razor.

However, I think it might be a bit limiting and not necessarily praeter necessitatem if we consider modern science or some philosophical matters like Epistemology. In this case agnostic views are at very least beneficial in my opinion.

As for the particular philosophers, for me thoughtful reading of Kant was like a cold shower!..

Zombrex

What happened post-20th century that made theism or agnostism more reasonable?

Slav

Wicknight, not theism, only agnosticism. As far as I can see both theism and atheism are unscientific so science, at least as we know it today, cannot benefit from either of them.

As far as the 20th century is concerned, the way science (particularly physics) developed made the philosophy of science very outdated. Positivism looked very promising some 100 - 150 years ago but since then the scientific method and science outgrew it and effectively departed from it. What we have now is science without its philosophical basis. That's how I see it.