Doing the SIGA 'taping up' ourselves??

selfbuildache

Did anyone else do it themselves rather than getting a company/'professional' to do it? We figure we can do it ourselves, saving ourselves a few hundred quid in the process. My partner went on one of these Siga courses but didn't find it to be that practical, plus the Siga guy seemed to think we were mad to attempt ourselves - so now we're doubting ourselves. What do you all think??

soldsold

Definitely a DIY job, if you have done the course should be no problem doing the taping.

Its what I am planning to do, I did the airtightness course a month ago.

It will be a slow job though, if you dont rush you should get a good finish

morning delight

soldsold wrote: »

Definitely a DIY job, if you have done the course should be no problem doing the taping.

Its what I am planning to do, I did the airtightness course a month ago.

It will be a slow job though, if you dont rush you should get a good finish

Hi soldsold

Sounds like a good way to ensure its done right, and time is spent at the tricky corners etc. A few questions come to mind though:
How much do you think you'll save per sq ft by doing it yourself? I'm looking at 320 sq m new build.
Did you pay to go on the course and how long was it?

soldsold

morning delight wrote: »

Hi soldsold

Sounds like a good way to ensure its done right, and time is spent at the tricky corners etc. A few questions come to mind though:
How much do you think you'll save per sq ft by doing it yourself? I'm looking at 320 sq m new build.
Did you pay to go on the course and how long was it?

Hard to know in sq ft but I would guess a couple of thousand needed to pay someone to do the job right. The tapes are very sticky and you only get one go, it gets like trying to unstick the sticky fly catcher paper if that makes sense. I believe around half an hour per window is about right if that gives an idea.

There are two courses I know of, one run by ecological building systems (Pro Clima tapes) in Athboy and one by METAC in Mountmellick (Siga tapes). Both cover the basics, both are 50 euro and at least the one I was on was a big sales pitch from start to finish but was definitely worth doing. Free tape dispenser and knife as well as a sandwich helped offset the cost! Courses last one day. Good overview of condensation, basic building physics etc.

As much as I would never let a builder build a house for me, I would never consider letting someone else make the house airtight - unless they had years of experience and had built up the knack. Ive only seen one airtightness job that a carpenter was let do and it was a messy disaster. Id prefer to be left to blame myself than to be fuming with someone else that wasted my expensive tapes. Having said that I let my roofers tape the velux windows for wind-tigtness and they did a good job, but the main guy was on the airtightness course with me so had some basic training.

Technophobe

Myself andf my Site manager/adviser did it ourselves, with a little help from family in terms of holding the membrane when stapling to josts etc...
Also did all the taping and my own insulation.....
Depending on the house type, it is a time consuming process but as soldsold states, you know when you do it yourself that it will be done right....;)

So if you have the time, then go for it...

selfbuildache

Thanks for the replies. I think we'll be doing it ourselves so!

MorningDelight, if it's any use to you, we got a quote from the guy doing our insulation and if we do the taping up ourselves, we figure we'll save around €1800 in labour costs.
In terms of time, our very-helpful insulation guy reckoned it'd take 4 of his (experienced) guys 3 days to tape up our house, so we figure if we rope in some family we can surely do it in a week!
Even the insulation guy (who would've made money out of us) said we could do a decent job of it ourselves, especially as SoldSold said, it's our own house.
Our house is 2000sq.ft.
Hope that helps someone else.
SoldSold, I think it was the same course we went on - not much use practically though!
Cheers!

morning delight

selfbuildache wrote: »

Thanks for the replies. I think we'll be doing it ourselves so!

MorningDelight, if it's any use to you, we got a quote from the guy doing our insulation and if we do the taping up ourselves, we figure we'll save around €1800 in labour costs.
In terms of time, our very-helpful insulation guy reckoned it'd take 4 of his (experienced) guys 3 days to tape up our house, so we figure if we rope in some family we can surely do it in a week!
Even the insulation guy (who would've made money out of us) said we could do a decent job of it ourselves, especially as SoldSold said, it's our own house.
Our house is 2000sq.ft.
Hope that helps someone else.
SoldSold, I think it was the same course we went on - not much use practically though!
Cheers!

Thanks for that selfbuild.
It all comes down to time and by the looks of it people! I suppose it depends on how much of the mortgage has been drawn down vs the amount of time lost due to doing it yourself. It may take me 2/3 weeks (mornings, evenings & weekends!)
Good to have a rough idea of the saving involved though, thanks. I may do the course anyway just to get the basics. Then if someone else is doing it i should at least know whether they are doing it right or not. Getting it right should have a big effect on space heating requirements.

morning delight

soldsold wrote: »

Hard to know in sq ft but I would guess a couple of thousand needed to pay someone to do the job right. The tapes are very sticky and you only get one go, it gets like trying to unstick the sticky fly catcher paper if that makes sense. I believe around half an hour per window is about right if that gives an idea.

There are two courses I know of, one run by ecological building systems (Pro Clima tapes) in Athboy and one by METAC in Mountmellick (Siga tapes). Both cover the basics, both are 50 euro and at least the one I was on was a big sales pitch from start to finish but was definitely worth doing. Free tape dispenser and knife as well as a sandwich helped offset the cost! Courses last one day. Good overview of condensation, basic building physics etc.

Nothing to lose by doing it at that rate of going. The bit on condensation and basic building physics wouldn't go amiss either!

As much as I would never let a builder build a house for me, I would never consider letting someone else make the house airtight - unless they had years of experience and had built up the knack. Ive only seen one airtightness job that a carpenter was let do and it was a messy disaster. Id prefer to be left to blame myself than to be fuming with someone else that wasted my expensive tapes. Having said that I let my roofers tape the velux windows for wind-tigtness and they did a good job, but the main guy was on the airtightness course with me so had some basic training.

I feel the same as you on this. Isn't it sad that we're so sceptical of the building trade. If I had the time I'd definitely take the whole project on myself but may end up going down the contractor route - depending on tenders.

Technophobe wrote: »

Also did all the taping and my own insulation.....

I may look at doing elements of the build myself where I feel the extra attention my pay dividend. It's interesting to see you did the insulation yourself. Pray tell, what was your build type?

Technophobe

Hey Morningdelight....

The Build was a dormer, also with an area of vaulted/double height ceiling on the ground floor, so there was lots to do...:(

But still worthwhile from the feel good feeling after you know you have completed a significant and vital element of the build yourself...:)

sas

Anybody got any actual airtightness figures to back up that they have been successful?

Ferocious

When taping around windows, do you tape directly on to the bare block?
I read in the instructions from one manufacturer that the tape should be placed between two layers of plaster although this is not spelled out by Siga for example. All of their (Sigas) instructions seem to reference timber frame houses.

soldsold

Good question - generally a mastic is applied in an 8mm bead onto bare block, as tapes wont stick because of the holes in the block/ dusty surface. The membrane is then pressed onto the mastic, making sure to keep at least 4mm mastic under it, ie dont squash it down. Ive seen bare block taped and it lifts straight off.

Siga do a thin 8-10mm wide tape that is basically an 8mm thick mastic gel preapplied on a roll, its not on the market yet though I think but will be very soon. They had a sample on the training day and its super stuff but probably not cheap. It looks like the rolls of draught stopping tape for sealing doors and windows, except its like a gel instead of foam.

For plastered concrete or finished floors, a primer is painted on and the tape sticks to the primer. If you call ecological building systems (Pro Clima), or METAC to get the Siga guys number, or Klober (google for contact details - new to the market) or MOY Isover (google for contact details too) they will advise the best approach for their system.

Pic of the "mastic on a roll" below

gears

Ferocious wrote: »

When taping around windows, do you tape directly on to the bare block?
I read in the instructions from one manufacturer that the tape should be placed between two layers of plaster although this is not spelled out by Siga for example. All of their (Sigas) instructions seem to reference timber frame houses.

For SIGA see their instructions on using Primur it's a mastic type product you use to stick membrane or tape to concrete. This also comes on a roll now which isn't mentioned on the video.

soldsold

Sorry Gears, you were a minute too slow there

Although you did give the name of the mastic that I couldnt remember so I have to give you that...

gears

No bother there soldsold.

I just called the SIGA rep from the METAC course and he gave me a price on the Primur roll its €11.84 (ex VAT) versus €16.70 (ex Vat) for the tube didn't mention coverage for the tube but I suppose it depends on how thick you make the bead so makes me think the roll is better as it' s a definate thickness, no guess work. He also gave me the name of my local supplier who has the roll in stock so if any one want's the name just pm me.

Ferocious

I saw that mastic alright. Wasn't sure if it was definitely needed because, as you suggeseted, it adds expense.
Just wondering then, where windows fit tight to the opening, would a bead of this mastic alone be good enough? Or is it more like an adhesive supplmenting the tape?

gears

The mastic on it own wouldn't be enough. It allows the tape to seal to the rough concrete. To give you an idea of the extra cost just measure the perimeter of each window and door to give you a meterage then multiply it by the cost of each roll. My opinion on air-tightness is that you give it your best shot and to it as well as you can or not at all. It is an extra in most peoples minds these days but a more than worthwhile exercise in the long run.