Difficult Classmate.

LegacyUser

Hi all,
Going to go unregd for this one, it's not the biggest problem in the world, but still on my mind.

I'm in my third year of university at the moment with one more year left, there's a girl in my class who is really driving me insane. I honestly don't know what to make of her, but she has this awful vendetta against me and I honestly don't know why. We do the exact same options, so of course we have the exact same classes, etc. In first year, I didn't really take that much notice of her, I kept to myself to be honest and I wouldn't have ever considered a friend or anything, but we would be considered the most opposite people in our class.
It started off not too bad at first, people coming up to me saying "I heard this, that, etc" of things which I hadn't said over simple things like when assignments were due, what a lecturer said, etc. Basically she was telling the wrong info because she didn't listen properly or whatever.

Then it started to escalate into me apparently spreading rumours about people, which I hadn't, which initially I ignored because I found out I had to do my work placement with her. Once we started placement, I was willing to let go whatever had happened in the past for the sake of not causing any drama. Of course she didn't and within a few days (unknown to me at the time) she was telling people that I made her feel really uncomfortable, that I was very insensitive with my remarks, etc.

I hadn't known this at the time but about a week after that initial incident she told my boss that me and two others who I had become friends with made her feel uncomfortable, etc and she didn't want to take part in certain things,etc. BUT, before our boss said anything to us, she came up to the 3 of us, and said "I don't know why, but X thinks we're not getting on" in a ploy to cover it all up. One of our superiors had a word with us, and told us exactly what she said, and told us to watch what we say around her, etc even though she knew full well there was no intention of bullying her, etc. It seems that any time I'd be having a joke with my friends or whatever, she assumes it's about her, even though it's not at all.

As the placement progressed, several incidents came up, one including her hitting me (outside of work) in which I didn't react, basically because I couldn't, her talking about me behind my back, blatantly putting me down in front of others, and playing the victim throughout.

I thought it was confidence issues or insecurity, but that definately isn't it. She loves having control of groups, situations, etc and if she is given any sort of power she'll have a powertrip and dictate.

I'd love to be able to ignore this, but really I can't anymore because it's driving me insane and I don't want to sound sexist but since I'm a guy, she can easily play the bully card. Should I just have it out with her next time something comes up or what? This is really driving me crazy!

tenchi-fan

You just need to ignore her. This is the only way you can win against her.

When you're with co-workers or mutual friends just be polite but don't speak to her otherwise.

When you're with your friends, ignore her altogether. If she comes up to you just act a bit surprised, let her say her piece and wait until she leaves.

The allegations at work are pretty serious because she is insinuating all sorts of things. You need to be really careful here because mud sticks.

I'd recommend you read about dealing with manipulative people. She has you on the defensive the whole time and she knows it is stressing you out. Yet her attacks are just so barefaced.. she brushes them off by feigning ignorance and playing the victim.

pookie82

Are you still on placement with her? I'd do some reporting of my own if I were you. If she's in the same classes on the same course maybe there's someone in the department or student's union can help. The least you can do is talk to someone, let them know how much she intimidates you, if nothing else it should be recorded or on report somewhere incase she pulls something really serious. You shouldn't have to put up with her.

Cheap Thrills!

Hi OP,

She sounds mentally ill to be honest.

I hate to say this but I think the only way around it is to pre-warn everyone around you what she is like and explain that you are going to be ignoring her unless really provoked when you should calmly stand up to her.

Manipulative people are very difficult to handle but unfortunately the world is full of them. The playing the victim act I recognise and the sneaking behind your back to attribute rumours started to you.

Write an account of what has gone on, stick to the facts, don't exagerate at all and date it and email it to the Course tutors. Explain that you are feeling nervous that she is manipulative enough to allege bullying. Also mention that she hit you and is ruining your experience of college.

Keep your gunpowder dry. In the meantime diary everything wrong she does to you. Don't be obsessed with her though. Try to keep out of her way (hard I know) then the next time she steps out of line go nuclear on her. You have that information with the course tutors.

I understand why you have not stood up to her, you have to be careful with these people. BUT on the other hand she can't be allowed hit you and walk all over you either.

LegacyUser

Thanks for the messages!

@Pookie: I wouldn't go as far as the SU or Dept, unfortunately she's our class rep (not our choice, she put herself forward) so she has all the dealings with the dept, SU etc and our course isn't that big and we've a close relationship to an extent with lecturers, etc. Like I said, I think reporting her won't do me any favours because she knows how to change stories any way she wants.
Also, one of my friends had an issue with her last year, reported her to the SU and was told that if she gets another complaint she won't be allowed to be class rep anymore; I think that's one of the reasons for some of this stuff, because she associates me with my friend, etc. Placement's over now thank God but I'm on study abroad with her (I know, what are the fúcking odds!!!) and there's a whole new group for her to work her way through. By the end of placement she managed to annoy just about everybody, ruined the whole experience for me and had me so annoyed to the extent that I actually had to just be on my own for a few days to get away from it all. In relation to the dealings with the boss the whole thing really annoyed me, especially since the placement went pearshaped for me so I told them exactly what happened, and what I was putting up with while working there. There wasn't anything they could really do, but it took a bit of weight off my shoulders.

@Tenchi-Fan:
The ignoring her step is what I did for my placement, and that resulted in me bottling it all up and going half mad! I know in the long run it's probably the best option but I'm sick of her badmouthing me and playing these games and having to win people I've just met over just because she has an issue for absolutely no reason. It took months the last time, and now I just want to be rid of her. Also, the annoying thing is that while I have a large circle of friends, we have a lot of so-called mutual friends (to use an odd example we've got the most mutual friends in common with each other on Facebook) although the vast majority would be people who'd add me and automatically she'd add them straight after, without saying two words to them. She's very clingy too, and managed to know all my business when we were on placement, etc. Will def try and get my hands on some reading material, any recommendations???

@CheapThrills:
As I said above, I've started keeping note of everything. She found out that I said it about the hitting me incident, completely denies is and actually said,
"Whether I hit him, slapped him or whatever, I didn't punch him".
Denies pretty much everything, everyone in our class knows what she's like, but nobody will say anything and it puts me in a difficult position because once again, she can play the bully card. Ignoring her is virtually impossible, but when she's near me or in the same group I blank her. She's been moderate on the manipulative side recently, but even the little things are making me boil at this stage.

Once again thanks for the advice, really appreciated. Some of my friends have come up with a few theories of their own about it:
-She has no sense of humour (she really doesn't see the funny side in anything).
-She fancies me.
-She jealous and hates the fact I can balance a lot of things at once without freaking out, like she has on several occasions (I'm not blowing my own trumpet, but I have done very well for myself on the personal achievements and academic front in the last year).

Regardless, I'm just sick of her!

epgc3fyqirnbsx

Well if it's something that could affect grades or future employment prospects, I would notify you class tutor/deane. Not necessarily to take action but like the other poster said, everyone should be aware

Neyite

there is no way of dealling with her except to walk away. she is beyond any reasoning, and does not seem very stable either- even if the hatchet was buried, she would only be in a better position to learn more personal things to use against you.

firstly, though, you should not go abroad with her on placement - what if it escalates, there are no tutors around who know her etc to intervene. usually on foreign placements its common to share accomadation with your classmates - what if she accused you of something like rape or serious assault and its only your word against hers? by the sounds of it, she is manipulative enough.

talk to whoever coordinates the placement confidentially and explain the situation, you have already been assaulted by her, so i doubt very much the coordinator wants to risk something much worse happening far away. get her moved elsewhere, or you moved but do not go on placement with her.

ive had experience dealing with someone like her, and there is no resolution im afraid -she is dangerous. dont give her the benefit of the doubt, or underestimate her, and good luck.

tenchi-fan

I bought "In sheep's clothing" after I read the author's articles at
http://counsellingresource.com/features/tag/series-on-manipulation-tactics/

I really wasn't aware that my brother was using the same handful of tactics over and over again so his book was helpful for me.
http://www.drgeorgesimon.com/insheepsclothingbook.html

LegacyUser

@Techni-Fan:
Thanks a million, I'll look at all those links now, and I'll keep you updated. I really appreciate this.

@Neyite:
This is more of it, when we were on placement, we found out which unis we were being sent to, and she wanted the one I got put in for some reason. First of all she asked me to swap (REALLY WISH I DID NOW!) and I said I couldn't do anything, since it was the uni that picked it after all, etc. Then, she complained to the university, gave her reasons why she wanted to go there, etc and got it changed; at that stage it was too late to get out of it. I'm on study abroad with her now, like I said I'm just keeping my distance which is all I can do at best really.

She's cooled it down an awful bit because she knows that I'm gearing myself up for a confrontation/preparing myself to come head to head with her, should it happen. Like that, I'd rather be prepared to expect the unexpected. To be honest, I'd say something will end up causing a showdown, still plenty of time left in college and her mood changes in an instant. Best to be prepared. I'll keep you updated.

Miss Fluff

Cheap Thrills! wrote: »

She sounds mentally ill to be honest.

Completely agree. She sounds very like someone I used to work with who was a compulsive liar and a fantasist and used to spread really dangerous and vicious rumours about people. Do not rise to the bait. Do not allow yourself to be alone with her, i.e. where possible, always have a witness to any dialogue that ever takes place between the two of you. Because I can guarantee if you converse with her at all, that conversation will be twisted and regurgitated for her own ends. As difficult as it is in your circumstances, do not engage with her, ignore her as best you can, and clearly document any run-ins you have. She sounds like a loony.

cafecolour

Well, she's not actually affecting your rep that much since everyone knows she's crazy.

The problem is, 'having it out', with a crazy person is just going to make you seem crazy as well. She craves drama and the more you care the more it's going to feed her power trip.

I'd just try and keep ignoring her. You get worked up and you'll just get pulled down to her level in other people's eyes.

The only other attitude that could work is to treat it with an air of dismissive bemusement - ie "I've got an obsessive stalker and I think it's hilarious" or "I've got an obsessive stalker but it's just my cross to bear, what can ya do". You've got to tread carefully with this of course - it can be easily be turned so that you look like the obsessive one. Or it can be too successful and turn into a giant joke behind her back that is exactly the sort of bullying she claims is happening.

Really though, I'd just ignore her. As you said, she's annoying everyone. You get down in the mud with her and you could end up irrevocably linked with her.

kjl

You know, we don't have to get on with everybody, but interestingly enough some of my closest friends were once my enemy.

Why don't you try to make one last ditch effort to make amends with the girl. Perhaps there has been some severe wires crossing or something.

You guys obviously have things in common if you picked all the same subjects, perhaps she is not good at making friends and feels threaten by you.

Im not saying I am right, but you catch more flies with honey.

dan_d

Weirdly enough, there's a possibility that she might actually like you and doesn't know what to do with it......
Add it to being a bit of an intense person and you've got the odd behaviour.
Just a suggestion.

LegacyUser

Yes I would say it is quite likely she fancies you, she is obviously in some way drawn to you and is basically always seeking your attention through her antics. Or maybe she is jealous of you - how do you think you compare academically?

Anyway it's very annoying but all you can do is try not to feed her obsession, stay out of her way, act neutrally towards her when you have to interact and never rise to the bait. Your friends know what the real story is and as to what anyone else thinks is going on, that will just have to be your cross to bear.

And don't forget - living well is always the best revenge. Concentrate on your academics and getting the most out of your time abroad! Good luck.

unclecessna

I've unfortunately come across weirdos like this before and they can literally ruin your life if you let them - They are stalkers at the end of the day, she has become obsessed with you OP for whatever reason and her weird actions are a strange result of her trying to get her foot in the door of your life.

Like another poster said she is dangerous - you have dealt with this very well so far but to end it I dealt with my past experiences exactly like Cheap Thrills suggested. These people have tunnel vision and usually only see what they want but when the facts of what they have done are shown and highlighted to the people around them - the spotlight is then put on them, they can't handle it, crack and go away - presumably to eventually latch on to another target in time.

Good luck OP

profitius

OP just ignore her. You tried to ignore her but from the sound of things she has you rattled a bit. Thats what she wants. She wants power over you and she knows she has that whenever you react negatively to anything she does. Even if you're doing your best to ignore her your body language can give away how you feel.

The girl sounds like shes missing something from her life. She's not acting in a way to suggest shes a happy person. She is to be pitied really because she'll make life difficult for herself by the way shes acting.

dan_d wrote: »

Weirdly enough, there's a possibility that she might actually like you and doesn't know what to do with it......
Add it to being a bit of an intense person and you've got the odd behaviour.
Just a suggestion.

You're probably not too far off there. Theres something about the OP she finds fascinating.

tenchi-fan

kjl wrote: »

Why don't you try to make one last ditch effort to make amends with the girl. Perhaps there has been some severe wires crossing or something.

I disagree with this entirely. This sort of person relies on you to feel there is a misunderstanding so she can get away with the way she's acting. She's obviously being aggressive.. she might actually make a small concession after being confronted but mainly she will be p*ssed off and will go one step further to get the upper hand again.

Just keep your distance. You are on a completely different level to her.

Overheal

From much first hand experience: Its not entirely relevant if it happens on the Premises or off-duty or what. Kind of like Teachers and Bosses having relationships with their Workers/Students: Any Time, you have 2 colleagues in Conflict - location of incidents is virtually irrelevant. Nevermind that hitting you is Assault. It affects your work performance? Then its a work issue. Its really that simple.

What you need to begin doing from here on is create an ongoing documentation of these abuses. Your Human Resources manager (or Equivalent - in University this is likely the Counseling Staff) needs to be updated about it too.

Furthermore Self-Defense entitles you perfectly, to defend yourself if you're being Assaulted. Often all it takes is one good hit, to be rid of one of these bullies forever. Don't go looking for a fight though. Its Defense.

Millicent

Overheal wrote: »

From much first hand experience: Its not entirely relevant if it happens on the Premises or off-duty or what. Kind of like Teachers and Bosses having relationships with their Workers/Students: Any Time, you have 2 colleagues in Conflict - location of incidents is virtually irrelevant. Nevermind that hitting you is Assault. It affects your work performance? Then its a work issue. Its really that simple.

What you need to begin doing from here on is create an ongoing documentation of these abuses. Your Human Resources manager (or Equivalent - in University this is likely the Counseling Staff) needs to be updated about it too.

Furthermore Self-Defense entitles you perfectly, to defend yourself if you're being Assaulted. Often all it takes is one good hit, to be rid of one of these bullies forever. Don't go looking for a fight though. Its Defense.

Overheal, very good advice except I'd probably advise against the self-defence advice. Not because I think the OP shouldn't defend himself- he absolutely should- but because this is the kind of girl who will allege that you're a woman beater to anyone and everyone (possible to the college/ gardai). And unfortunately, even though it's not true that he is one, mud sticks, even the mud thrown by obvious mentallers.

As others have said OP, keep records and try to avoid her company whenever you can. Good luck with it and I hope you get some kind of resolution soon.

Overheal

Oh by all means, have witnesses. This is the kind of conniving person they warn us about in Shakespeare playwrights.

cafecolour

Overheal wrote: »

Furthermore Self-Defense entitles you perfectly, to defend yourself if you're being Assaulted. Often all it takes is one good hit, to be rid of one of these bullies forever. Don't go looking for a fight though. Its Defense.

A guy hits a woman, even in 'self-defense', and his reputation is f**ked.

Nevyn

You need to go and make reports about her asap, she is damaging your reputation and your career and employment prospects with her behaviour.

Kep a diary of her behaviour, speak to your course co ordinator, to your head of dept and
do go to the welfare officer in the SU. By the way there are ways to have a class rep election, go find out what the rules for that are.

LegacyUser

OP here again, thanks a million for the replies!

Have a bit of an update, about two weeks ago a girl in my class confronted her about a lot of issues (she had problems with her in the past, I've overtaken her now)that they had with one another. She asked her straight out why she was saying such things, behaving in this manner, etc. She was all stuttery and lost for words, and asked her what her issue was with me as well. She had no reason as to why she acted like that towards me, etc and said,
"I don't know why to be honest". She also has no intentions of trying to make it up with me, and to be honest don't think "making up" would really cut it at this stage. They are apparently "friends for life" according to this girl (although nobody is really convinced) now.

Anyway I've cut myself off from her as much as is possible, although personally it's not enough. It's still very obvious that she wants to have control of every situation, for example her hand was even twitching the other day when we all had to meet up to discuss what we were doing for a project because she wasn't the one writing. Also she cut across the others when they were trying to explain what we were going to do, etc.

Still though, I can see her being a leech and it bugs me. I'm probably going to sound slightly psychotic here but I started a new job and made friends with a guy at work and we went to the pub after work last weekend, she was there and spoke to him for about 2mins. Then when I was working today she tried to make conversation with me, I just gave yes/no answers, she was apparently "late" for whatever she had to do and then proceeded to go up and approach my new work friend and talk to him for a good ten mins after!
Even as I try to create a circle of friends away from her she tries to claw herself in.

Anyway, the advice is much appreciated

LegacyUser

Hi everyone,

Just to update you on all of this, since my last post I've ignored her completely, any time she asks me a question I give a one word answer and I don't have any interactions with her unless I'm in the same class as her, and then I stay away from her.

Anyway, I'm after messing up big time on the "playing it cool" front. A group of us went out last week, and I ended up getting too drunk too quickly. I was good at ignoring her for the most part, then on one or two occasions she'd be finishing my sentences for me when I'd be talking about something, I'd look at her and say,
"Really?" and pause, immediately she'd be like, "I saw it on Facebook, it was on the newsfeed, REALLY!"

That was fine anyway until we went out and I was extremely drunk, (I vaguely remember this bit) I stole a drink from another table and poured it into mine, she started telling me to stop, and I started telling her to shut up. Then I said, "well ***** is clearly a ****** anyway."

I've no recollection of saying it, and I apparently made her cry, she's been ignoring me ever since. I'm not going to say what I called her, but it's something that'd really hit a nerve with her (which it did) and to be honest I feel really bad about what I said, and I intend on apologising. Of course once again I'm going to look like a príck (which I am in this case) but I'm just wondering what is the best way to go about it? I have a feeling that she's going to assume that I'm apologising for everything I've apparently said/done but I just want to get the point across that it's just for this drunken incident.

Yes I know what I said was bad, but I'm being the bigger person by apologising and I am going to mean it when I say it.

LegacyUser

hi op why dont you just apologise..but dont make a big deal over just act as if its nothing dont look pensive just say your peice and move on. Still keep your distance from her and dont let her hold this over you be open about what happened if anyone asks but as i already said dont let it become abig deal act as if nothing happened

sickofwaiting

heavyonmymind wrote: »

Hi everyone,

Just to update you on all of this, since my last post I've ignored her completely, any time she asks me a question I give a one word answer and I don't have any interactions with her unless I'm in the same class as her, and then I stay away from her.

Anyway, I'm after messing up big time on the "playing it cool" front. A group of us went out last week, and I ended up getting too drunk too quickly. I was good at ignoring her for the most part, then on one or two occasions she'd be finishing my sentences for me when I'd be talking about something, I'd look at her and say,
"Really?" and pause, immediately she'd be like, "I saw it on Facebook, it was on the newsfeed, REALLY!"

That was fine anyway until we went out and I was extremely drunk, (I vaguely remember this bit) I stole a drink from another table and poured it into mine, she started telling me to stop, and I started telling her to shut up. Then I said, "well ***** is clearly a ****** anyway."

I've no recollection of saying it, and I apparently made her cry, she's been ignoring me ever since. I'm not going to say what I called her, but it's something that'd really hit a nerve with her (which it did) and to be honest I feel really bad about what I said, and I intend on apologising. Of course once again I'm going to look like a príck (which I am in this case) but I'm just wondering what is the best way to go about it? I have a feeling that she's going to assume that I'm apologising for everything I've apparently said/done but I just want to get the point across that it's just for this drunken incident.

Yes I know what I said was bad, but I'm being the bigger person by apologising and I am going to mean it when I say it.

I would say '**** apologizing'. Don't give her an excuse to take the moral high ground. Big deal, you made some inappropriate remark when you were hammered drunk. She has behaved far worse towards you. She has been a complete bitch to you for the last few years, she has MUCH more to apologize for than you. Has she ever she apologized to you for all the crap and rumours she has been spreading behind your back? Did she apologise for hitting you? She had you wound up to the last and you eventually came out with a cutting remark when you were drunk, that is nothing compared to what she had been doing - non-stop interference in your life, spreading false rumours that you were saying such a thing about such a person which is an extremely nasty thing to do as it can cost people friends and relationships.

You are playing right into her hands if you let her portray herself as a victim. You should use this incident as an opportunity to put further distance between yourself and her as it you say she is now ignoring you which is actually what you ultimately would like - no interaction. She sounds like a nasty piece of work and the way to deal with people like that is not to appease them it's to tell them to go and **** themselves and that you want nothing to do with a person like them - that is what I recommend if she trys to interact with you in future - tell her exactly why you want nothing to do with her and then tell her to **** off out of your life.

Des Carter

Im probably going to get slated for this and probably rightly so but I kind of feel sorry for your class mate as it seems to me that she doesnt really know how to act in social situations and it seems she has a hard time making and keeping friends (for obvious reasons).

I mean you said yourself everyone knows what shes like - From her prespective everyone thinks shes a bitch (again not saying that shes not I dont know her). she also seems to be having a hard time as she was reported already she has had numerous arguments with you and had a confrontation with another girl in the class.

Im just saying that all this is probably getting her down and she feels angry frustrated and bitter she even said herself she didnt know why she acts the way she does.

It also seems that she really actually likes you as she is always trying to get a response out of ya, she wants to be friends with your friends, she changed the Uni she was going to to go to the same one you were, she looks at your facebook, she finishes your sentences and gets really hurt and starts crying when you insult her.

I really dont think she means to be as evil as she acts and is probably having a hard time I would advise you to apologise for your remarks as you do feel bad just dont make a big deal out of it I also dont see the harm in talking to her - as long as its only small talk in a social setting like a bar and shes not being too aggresive/controling I mean maybe all she needs is... well I dont know but if your talking to her and you dont like where the conversation is headed you can always end it - You know what they say: Keep your friends close and your enemies closer - you will be living abroad with this girl for a couple of months so if you did manage to clear the air (even just a bit) it may really help.

gandalf

I think the best piece of advice here is the one where you limit your interaction with this person to the bare minimum and ensure you always have others around when you are in their presence. You will in future have to deal with people like this in working environments (we all have) and tbh the best way to deal with them is in a professional but detached manner. Be polite but distant and unfamiliar.

Good luck and try and not let this person monopolise what should be a very good experience for you studying abroad.

Oh and as Thaed said keep a diary of any incidents as well, recording what happened, when it happened and any others who were present.

sickofwaiting

I mean you said yourself everyone knows what shes like - From her prespective everyone thinks shes a bitch (again not saying that shes not I dont know her). she also seems to be having a hard time as she was reported already she has had numerous arguments with you and had a confrontation with another girl in the class.

Arguments that she caused because of her disgraceful behaviour.

Im just saying that all this is probably getting her down and she feels angry frustrated and bitter she even said herself she didnt know why she acts the way she does.

Your entire post is about excusing someone who is behaving terribly and implying that people should be feeling sorry for her. Its like in the courts these days and someone is up for violent assault and their lawyer comes out with the big sob story. It's BS, if someone is acting like a dick of their own free will well they have to face the consequences of that and shouldn't be expecting sympathy.

It also seems that she really actually likes you as she is always trying to get a response out of ya, she wants to be friends with your friends, she changed the Uni she was going to to go to the same one you were, she looks at your facebook, she finishes your sentences and gets really hurt and starts crying when you insult her.

She has a fixation on the OP, I dont see how you could say she really likes him though. She was saying he said things about other people that he didn't, she falsely accused him of bullying her in their work placement, she hit him. I see fixation, not affection.

Des Carter

sickofwaiting wrote: »

Arguments that she caused because of her disgraceful behaviour.

Your entire post is about excusing someone who is behaving terribly and implying that people should be feeling sorry for her. Its like in the courts these days and someone is up for violent assault and their lawyer comes out with the big sob story. It's BS, if someone is acting like a dick of their own free will well they have to face the consequences of that and shouldn't be expecting sympathy.



She has a fixation on the OP, I dont see how you could say she really likes him though. She was saying he said things about other people that he didn't, she falsely accused him of bullying her in their work placement, she hit him. I see fixation, not affection.

i actually agree with the majority of what you said I just dont bye the whole idea that she is some sick twisted psycho who does what she does just cause shes a bitch. Yes her behaviour is unacceptable and I think the OP calling her a name was good enough for her but theres 2 sides to every story so I was just trying to give an alternative view on the situation.

After all the op will be spending time abroad with this person and so it will be impossible for him to cut contact. It will also be difficult for him to keep ignoring her as she could see this as bullying behaviour.

As for the whole sob story point I 100% agree that it is BS but the fact is shes not going to face any consequences as shes class rep and is manipulative etc and at the end of the day just ignoring her is clearly not working.