Undertaking Buses

Micilin Muc

I'm well aware of all the warnings about situational awareness around a HGV, but I'm not quite so sure about situational awareness around the different kinds of buses (e.g. Dublin Bus single-deckers, double-deckers, coaches etc.)

Do you treat buses the same as HGVs, or is there a need for the same level of vigilance?

Hagar

Picture Helen Keller driving the bus and take it from there.

Mr. Presentable

Don't do it.

They have a big blindspot. Cyclists are also bound by the rules of the road - you may not overtake to the left of a vehicle.

RobbieTheRobber

nipplenuts wrote: »

Don't do it.

They have a big blindspot. Cyclists are also bound by the rules of the road - you may not overtake to the left of a vehicle.

How does this affect cycle lanes to the left of stationary traffic?

niceonetom

It's best to proceed under the assumption that bus-drivers (of any stripe) are actively out to kill you. Act accordingly and you'll be fine.

Nietzschean

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

How does this affect cycle lanes to the left of stationary traffic?

Rules of the road do provide for overtaking on the left in slow moving lanes of traffic, which would seem to provide for allowing overtaking while in the cycle lane...

ten speed racer

nipplenuts wrote: »

Don't do it.

They have a big blindspot. Cyclists are also bound by the rules of the road - you may not overtake to the left of a vehicle.

You can overtake on the left when the vehicle on the right is turning right or in slow moving traffic, which pretty much covers all the situations where a bike would be passing cars.

As for buses, if the bus is stationary, there is ample room, and you see the traffic stopped ahead of it, then I'd overtake the bus--buses cannot move sideways. It is also a good idea to have a bail out option.

However, coming up to any junction, it is best to stay well behind the bus.

Mr. Presentable

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

How does this affect cycle lanes to the left of stationary traffic?

If you know the rules of the road, you will know that it is OK for any vehicle to undertake stopped/queueing at low speed (whatever that is) vehicles

ten speed racer

Nietzschean wrote: »

Rules of the road do provide for overtaking on the left in slow moving lanes of traffic, which would seem to provide for allowing overtaking while in the cycle lane...

Beat me to it...

jaqian

niceonetom wrote: »

It's best to proceed under the assumption that bus-drivers (of any stripe) are actively out to kill you. Act accordingly and you'll be fine.

Not to hijack the thread or anything but I was cycling down Suffolk Street in the right-hand lane when the bus driver looked out at me then turned the bus into the curb blocking my passage... very strange. Must have a problem with cyclists.

morninwood

undertaking buses isn't advisable in most circumstances and haven't you heard? they are commandeered by busdriving bullying nazis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRytf6gaM7M

Jawgap

Sometimes - unless its a JJ Kavanagh bus or an Aircoach - their drivers are waaaaaay to aggressive for me to want to get near them!:)

Lumen

I do it frequently, in the right circumstances.

Micilin Muc

Thanks for the comments.

Do buses have as many blindspots as HGVs?

In my 10 years cycling across Dublin city centre, I've rarely come across a dangerous bus driver, apart from JJ Kavanagh and Aircoach as Jawgap said!

tomasrojo

Jawgap wrote: »

Sometimes - unless its a JJ Kavanagh bus or an Aircoach - their drivers are waaaaaay to aggressive for me to want to get near them!:)

Bus Eireann drivers can be inconsiderate too, but I agree that most caution is required around those two.

DirkVoodoo

Just apply some common sense. If you are moving up a junction where traffic is stopped and you see the light turn green before you pass the bus, slow down and move off with the bus.

Don't go near anything big that looks like it might be turning left. And don't pass between two large vehicles either. There is nothing wrong with stopping and behaving like traffic, you don't have to hop kerbs or act like an idiot.

Harrybelafonte

I go between busses pretty often. Usually plenty of room, otherwise I wouldn't do it.

briano

I'd avoid undertaking buses while they are stopped, you never know when a ped is going to blindly launch themselves from either door.

superrdave

briano wrote: »

I'd avoid undertaking buses while they are stopped, you never know when a ped is going to blindly launch themselves from either door.

This.

This is also the reason I avoid going between buses in traffic, because pedestrians will appear from nowhere right in your path.

There is one place this always used to happen me, right at the bottom of wexford street. Here, in fact. Pedestrians will walk right across without looking as the traffic is regularly stopped in both directions there.

Hagar

briano wrote: »

I'd avoid undertaking buses while they are stopped, you never know when a ped is going to blindly launch themselves from either door.

I thought passengers could only alight at bus stops? Are drivers routinely letting them off in traffic and risking their jobs? You're not passing inside busses at stops are you? That would be asking for grief.

markpb

69 wrote: »

I thought passengers could only alight at bus stops? Are drivers routinely letting them off in traffic and risking their jobs? You're not passing inside busses at stops are you? That would be asking for grief.

Some drivers will let passengers off if they can't pull into the bus stop. Others will let passengers alight with careless abandon. A suburban BE bus regularly lets passengers off at the Frederick St / Denmark St traffic lights even though there is a turning left lane on his inside.

Hagar

That's madness, they will get someone killed doing dumb stuff like that.

concussion

nipplenuts wrote: »

If you know the rules of the road, you will know that it is OK for any vehicle to undertake stopped/queueing at low speed (whatever that is) vehicles

This is a bit ambiguous. The first two reasons you can overtake on the left are if the car in front is turning right or if you are turning left

Road Traffic Act wrote:

(
4) Notwithstanding paragraph (3) of this bye-law, a driver may overtake on the left—

(a) where the driver of the vehicle about to be overtaken has signalled his intention to turn to the right and the driver of the overtaking vehicle intends, after having overtaken, to go straight ahead or to turn to the left,

(b) where the driver of the overtaking vehicle intends, after having overtaken, to turn left at a road junction and has signalled this intention,

Nothing mentioned about traffic lanes.

The third one, slowly moving traffic, specifically mentions:

Road Traffic Act wrote:

(c) in slow-moving traffic, when vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver's right are moving more slowly than the overtaking vehicle.

Does this mean that the traffic has to be in the lane to the right of the drivers lane, or traffic to the right of the driver in the same lane? I suspect that traffic has to be in at least 2 lanes (going the same direction :pac: ) but having said that I filter on the left all, safely and with respect to other road users (criminal alert!!).
I'd love this to be definitively nailed down though.

blorg

concussion wrote: »

Does this mean that the traffic has to be in the lane to the right of the drivers lane, or traffic to the right of the driver in the same lane? I suspect that traffic has to be in at least 2 lanes (going the same direction :pac: ) but having said that I filter on the left all, safely and with respect to other road uses (criminal alert!!).

I think right now it needs to be separate lanes. So in a cycle lane you can legally undertake slowly moving traffic. I think this as the minister for transport recently stated his intention to make filtering (e.g. same lane) explicitly legal:

transport.ie wrote:

The Minister also hopes to make legal the common practice of cyclists overtaking slow moving traffic on the inside. In this case, however, the cyclists' responsibility to have regard to their own safety will be reinforced by not allowing this type of overtaking, where a left-hand turn has been indicated by the vehicle to be overtaken and, where that vehicle will reach the corner before the cyclist.

So one can only presume it is currently illegal.

http://www.transport.ie/pressRelease.aspx?Id=155

concussion

That was my understanding all right.