How Men vs women view themselves

Mr Yellow

As per a thread in the lovely ladies lounge


Do us males look in the mirror & see something we trully are not?

Females look at themselves & most seem to flaw what they see, whereas we look at the mirror & think we look good??

Lets say I am the following:


But I see myself as:


Do we as males look at ourselves in a contrary way to what females do, & see the good & not the bad??

Herbal Deity

We definitely have much better self image in general than females.

I think I'm fúcking hot, would necessarily be arsed changing anything.

I've been skinny all my life and am quite wary of the fact that I've been putting on weight recently. I also hated how I looked when I had acne as a teenager, but that's gone now.

gonnaplayrugby

im very self critical but i think im realistic. i know how i look and what my physique is like...i have no delusions either way. its something i try not to concern myself with but its tough.

Thomas828

I'm not really worried about my looks. I'm more concerned about how I dress and appear in public. I suppose we men are generally fortunate because we're not constantly told on TV and in magazines about how men ought to look or behave. We're not always told that girls fancy someone who looks like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruise and we're not constantly told we should keep our weight down while at the same time being shown adverts for beer and junk food. Women, on the other hand, have a very different experience.

NothingMan

I'm 6", 14.5 stone, a bit jiggly, bad teeth and dry skin and I think I look pretty good..... Man, on paper I don't sound too good. But it proves your point that I am perfectly happy with how I look.

Giselle

http://www.crazyphotos.com/pictures/38da84f23caf8160a59fe031f97099a3.jpg

QFT.

kowloon

I weigh a little over eight stone at last count, have crooked chipped, tea stained teeth and generally look like a scruffy homeless person.
This has been confirmed repeatedly over the years: I get on well with friends girlfriends but single women treat me will contempt or outright hostility, these days premptively.
Still, I would never change, it makes me who I am, I like my outlook on the world, if people treated me differently because of different aesthetics I wouldn't have the same outlook.

L31mr0d

I don't think men really care as much about their appearance as they do about their prowess amongst men.

Men only seem to care significantly about their appearance when it is tied in some fashion to the source of their skill and competition. (appearing healthy when in the public eye or sales, appearing strong when involved in physical work or sports... etc)

Maple

One thing that has always puzzled me about the male pysche, and it's something that I can admire, is their ability to take a slagging in relation to their appearance.

I have been in the company of male friends and honestly as a woman if someone called me a porky git, balding baxtard, a weedy fcuk, I'd be reduced to tears or quite possibly to giving someone a smack in the mouth. And sometimes the guys draw attention to their appearance by making a joke too.

I'm well aware that men can sometimes have their "fat/bad hair/lock me in a bell tower i'm so ugly" days as women do but is physical appearance really so unimportant to you?? Or is it a case of well if I slag it off then everyone will believe i'm really ok with how I look and not realise that i'm as insecure as the rest?

Apologies if this is veering slightly off-topic.

gonnaplayrugby

its very important to me personally. inside i'd hate for someone to say something to me.

OldGoat

L31mr0d wrote: »

I don't think men really care as much about their appearance as they do about their prowess amongst men.

Men only seem to care significantly about their appearance when it is tied in some fashion to the source of their skill and competition. (appearing healthy when in the public eye or sales, appearing strong when involved in physical work or sports... etc)

I'm not so sure.
If every man here were told that they have to wear a suit, shirt & tie to go down the pub for a pint with you mates I doubt if you find many happy. They would rather be in jeans and tshirts. Thats because men DO care about their appearance.
Most in that situation would be happier with their very carefully selected tshirt, the one with the funniest logo. No matter how casual the look it's still chosen to for a reason.
Few of us go to the lengths that women go to when it comes to appearance but we all care. Everyone has a favourite look that they work at. 'Scruffy' is a contrived look just as much as haute couture is.

maple wrote: »

One thing that has always puzzled me about the male pysche, and it's something that I can admire, is their ability to take a slagging in relation to their appearance.

Outwardly we take the slagging because in the pack to show weakness is fatal. Dosen't mean that we arnt hurt by the comments.

amacachi

maple wrote: »

One thing that has always puzzled me about the male pysche, and it's something that I can admire, is their ability to take a slagging in relation to their appearance.

I have been in the company of male friends and honestly as a woman if someone called me a porky git, balding baxtard, a weedy fcuk, I'd be reduced to tears or quite possibly to giving someone a smack in the mouth. And sometimes the guys draw attention to their appearance by making a joke too.

I'm well aware that men can sometimes have their "fat/bad hair/lock me in a bell tower i'm so ugly" days as women do but is physical appearance really so unimportant to you?? Or is it a case of well if I slag it off then everyone will believe i'm really ok with how I look and not realise that i'm as insecure as the rest?

Apologies if this is veering slightly off-topic.

Generally men can take a slagging far better than women. In secondary school my mates and I basically spent lunchtimes and breaks slagging each other off more than anything else, very little was off limits for any of us. And no-one got hurt.
It's one of the theories why there are so few successful comediennes, males go up and take the piss out of the audience, themselves, their family, anyone. If women make fun of themselves a lot of people (both men and woman equally) tend not to find it funny and feel sorry for them in a way.

Maple

amacachi wrote: »

Generally men can take a slagging far better than women.

See I can take a slagging, and I can give as good as I get. I work in a male dominated industry and it's a type of stress relief to take the mick out of one another all day long.

I'm regularly called a dozy cow for asking some questions and I can laugh it off and return the jibe. Because I know on a fundamental level that I'm not stupid, I have confidence in that fact. Sure i'm not an expert on everything but I'm still not stupid.

Whereas I wonder if the reason I'd consider slagging someone off about their appearance off limits is that there are times where I feel insecure about my own physical appearance?

So I guess I just wondered if men were the same and did feel vulnerable and not that confident about their appearance despite the ribald comments? My own leaning towards commenting on a person's appearance would be to remark in a positive manner, to build someone up rather than slag them off.

Wibbs

I dunno. I'd take kinda the middle path on this one. Firstly it depends on the man of course, but I would say in general men do care less about that aspect of their social interaction than women do. A lot less. Now I take Old Goats point about scruffy being a contrivance at times, but I know considerably more men who are actually scruffy(not dirty) than women. More men wear a uniform type deal too. Helps them fit in and also means less effort.

Body image they definitely have less insecurity and are less precise about the insecurity too. So you'll hear men say "I'm a fat git" or Im a skinny git", but outside guys into gym type body sculpting, you wont hear one say "my arse/thighs/calves are too big" too often. "big gut" you hear more though. Baldness would be a big one for men though. More a virility thing IMHO. Hence you hear bald guys claim bald blokes have more testosterone(they dont. Many have less than average).

The biggest difference of all that I can see, is not so much women outside the very narrow range of what is considered "perfect" by the cultural standards of the day, but women who possess "perfect" bodies are still insecure about their appearance. So the flat chested boy shape and the very heavy shape are on a par with their perfect 10 sisters in insecurity.

I think men also have more avenues to show off their social prowess. The scrawny specky four eyed geek running the multinational software company is more attractive to the opposite sex than the sculpted gym bunny in the 9 to 5er. That doesnt hold nearly so true for women. While men are socially competitive and more competitive in general*, I dont think in the same way or in the same arena as women are with each other. So as well as other pressures women get pressures from their own gender.

Obvious and obviously general example. PARTY: INTERIOR: NIGHT: Two women arrive. In exactly the same outfit. This will be noticed. Both by the women themselves and other women. Men will barely register it unless its pointed out. There may be noses outa joint. Both will look at the other and wonder which looks better in it. The social competition thing. IMHO women dress as much if not more for other women as for men.

Same party. Two men arrive in the same outfit. Highly unlikely to be noticed. If it is, then big joke about same.

Further on the clothes front. Men could wear the same shirt jacket to a monthly work party for a year before it would be noted. Women couldnt.

Yes big generalisations but in the average I would say much of this holds true.

*competitive slagging being one way and being funny too. Read a great article which looked at humour in men, that found humourous men had more testosterone than men not considered funny by peers. One theory holds that as well as being a competitive thing among men socially, humour also attracts women, by showing high test levels, intelligence and social prowess and stability(though the best comedians are often not too stable ). Though "good sense of humour" as a requirement by women is more to do with emotional stability and easy going nature than the ability to tell jokes.

L31mr0d

OldGoat wrote: »

If every man here were told that they have to wear a suit, shirt & tie to go down the pub for a pint with you mates I doubt if you find many happy. They would rather be in jeans and tshirts. Thats because men DO care about their appearance.

I don't think that comes down to appearance but rather comfort and practicality. I wouldn't wear a suit to a building site, and I don't wear a suit to the pub. I expect that if I'm in my local, jeans and tshirt will be the most comfortable for me and I wouldn't care if a cigarette butt burnt into them or some beer got spilt on them.

Now, obviously, men looking to attract women are going to dress better. But my initial point was regarding physical appearance mainly, rather than clothing, and a man's general motivation for changing and working on their physical appearance, which is usually to compete with other men.

Snowie

I to a degree, see my self as neather of the above Im skinny really skinny I've a 32 inch waste and weigh just over ten stone. Tbh its something I dont really like I hate being this skinny Ive thaught about, taking weight gainer's and, what nots but I dont really understand it... all.

comfortably Id like to be about 12 stone. I do intend on getting my self to that weight and seeing how I look. Im not so much self conous of it I just feeel kinda dweeby at times but like dress a little more chunky and i dont....

I've got good mussel tone tho very defined.. just I dont carry a lot of weight... so yeah at times I feel like a skinny dweeb but then again, Some days i dont kinda like a skinny day....

gonnaplayrugby

that is because u have low body fat. zac efron has good muscle tone becoz he has low body fat.

Star Lord

I don't think I have EVER looked in a mirror and thought I looked good... but at the same time, I don't obsess over it or worry too much about it. I'm me, and if people like me they like me, if they don't, they don't and there's really nothing much to care about if they don't.

With regard to what Maple said about slagging, I really don't get bothered by slagging! I know that I'm short, I know I'm a bit overweight, I know I am short sighted, so someone calling me a tubby speccy shortarse (or something to that effect!) is really not going to bother me! If it's one of my friends or someone I know, then I know that any slagging/ribbing is done in a good natured way, if it's someone that I don't know at all, then the fact that they are doing it only reflects their ignorance. The only time I would possibly be hurt by it is if someone I cared about said these things spitefully, deliberately trying to hurt me. If I don't care about the person, then I don't really care about what they think!

opinion guy

DamoElDiablo wrote: »

I don't think I have EVER looked in a mirror and thought I looked good... but at the same time, I don't obsess over it or worry too much about it. I'm me, and if people like me they like me, if they don't, they don't and there's really nothing much to care about if they don't.

This to me sums it up. I think when you have this "I am what I am if you don't like me its your problem not mine attitude" it basically comes across as self-confidence. And true self-confidence (as opposed to arrogance or over-confidence), in either sex, is massively attractive.

Personally, I can be self-critical - i coudl do with losing a stone or two for example. But a funny thing happens. If I'm going out and I make an effort to spruce myself up a bit, I invariably get no attention. However if i don't make such an effort and I'm just enjoying my time with my friends, i get far more attention. its frankly bloody weird. If I go out in my lounge about the house clothes with stubble and messy hair i get way more attention than if i shave, gel the hair and put on a shirt say. But I think it has f*ck all to do with one look being better than another and everything to do with me being more comfortable and self-confident in myself when I'm not trying to impress anyone than when I am.

PrettyBoy

I think most men focus more on the positive side of their looks rather than the negative. When I look on a mirror I find myself focusing on my good features and sometimes looking from certain angles. I think, over time, I've subconsciously learned overlook any flaws as soon as I see a mirror. Then, I see pictures of myself and they are suddenly more apparent.

For example, I have a dimple in my chin which I sometimes wish I didn't have. When I look in the mirror I will immediately ignore my chin and focus more on my eyes and cheekbones. I focus more on good points rather than what I see as bad ones.

opinion guy

With a username like PrettyBoy I'm not sure how objective you can be on this issue:p

Wibbs

Nor how you can have an opinion on the matter

OldGoat

opinion guy wrote: »

With a username like PrettyBoy I'm not sure how objective you can be on this issue:p

Wibbs wrote: »

Nor how you can have an opinion on the matter

Are ye implying only ugly men have an objective opinions? If thats the case then I'm gonna have to delete my previous posts cos I'm fupping garrgous - Offical - with prizes n'everyting!

PrettyBoy

opinion guy wrote: »

With a username like PrettyBoy I'm not sure how objective you can be on this issue:p

Wibbs wrote: »

Nor how you can have an opinion on the matter

I would consider myself good looking and confident, but everyone has insecurities.

Handsome Bob

Thomas828 wrote: »

I'm not really worried about my looks. I'm more concerned about how I dress and appear in public. I suppose we men are generally fortunate because we're not constantly told on TV and in magazines about how men ought to look or behave. We're not always told that girls fancy someone who looks like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruise and we're not constantly told we should keep our weight down while at the same time being shown adverts for beer and junk food. Women, on the other hand, have a very different experience.

Ironically enough, I would have the opposite view. I do think there is massive pressure on young men to be as perfect as possible. Take for example the Twilight franchise, where armies of women are worshipping the physical image of two young men. These two guys in their own way are physically perfect.

If you look at movies in general, the guy that the women all want or who gets the girl in the end are mostly perfect physical specimens. The likes of Will Smith, Johnny Depp, George Clooney and Brad Pitt are all box office gold who regularly gain the praise of women throughout the world. In comparison the likes of Paul Giamatti and Phillip Seymour Hoffman, while better actors than Pitt and co are not box office gold and always play the murky and dodgy characters.

Women aren't interested in seeing these two guys in leading men roles. Hollywood execs aren't interested in putting them in big budget movies. Why? It's not because of their ability, it's because of their appearance. It's a terrible message to send out to young men. Personally speaking the pressure does take its toll on one's confidence.

SugarHigh

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Ironically enough, I would have the opposite view. I do think there is massive pressure on young men to be as perfect as possible. Take for example the Twilight franchise, where armies of women are worshipping the physical image of two young men. These two guys in their own way are physically perfect.

If you look at movies in general, the guy that the women all want or who gets the girl in the end are mostly perfect physical specimens. The likes of Will Smith, Johnny Depp, George Clooney and Brad Pitt are all box office gold who regularly gain the praise of women throughout the world. In comparison the likes of Paul Giamatti and Phillip Seymour Hoffman, while better actors than Pitt and co are not box office gold and always play the murky and dodgy characters.

Women aren't interested in seeing these two guys in leading men roles. Hollywood execs aren't interested in putting them in big budget movies. Why? It's not because of their ability, it's because of their appearance. It's a terrible message to send out to young men. Personally speaking the pressure does take its toll on one's confidence.

+1

But even more than looks is the pressure of how a man should act. It's like everyman is expected to be an alpha male type character who is always in control and confident. If your not the leader then you're a loser.

Wibbs wrote: »

Body image they definitely have less insecurity and are less precise about the insecurity too. So you'll hear men say "I'm a fat git" or Im a skinny git", but outside guys into gym type body sculpting, you wont hear one say "my arse/thighs/calves are too big" too often.

Agree with this too. The more I go to the gym the more conscious of how I look I become. So even though I look better I'm also more critical.

Handsome Bob

SugarHigh wrote: »

+1

But even more than looks is the pressure of how a man should act. It's like everyman is expected to be an alpha male type character who is always in control and confident. If your not the leader then you're a loser.

That's true in a way, look at all the threads on boards asking women what they want in a man, and nearly all of them say confidence and assertiveness. Which is fair enough, there's not much appeal of a guy who doesn't believe in himself. However I think that often introvertness and quiet confidence is often mistaken for having a lack of confidence or being insecure. If you're not controlling a conversation in a group of people then people see you as a quiet weirdo whereas in reality you're just not interested in wrestling with dominating personalities and talking over each other.

Herbal Deity

LZ5by5 wrote: »

the pressure does take its toll on one's confidence.

I don't really find that, personally...

Maybe it's just cos I'm so beautiful...

But really, I feel that the pressure on guys is much more to do with social status, exhibiting confidence etc.

EDIT: This:

SugarHigh wrote: »

But even more than looks is the pressure of how a man should act. It's like everyman is expected to be an alpha male type character who is always in control and confident. If your not the leader then you're a loser.

(didn't read before posting originally)

Davidius

I don't really care about my physical appearance. Days can go by where I just am not arsed to have a look at myself. When I do look at myself I generally think that I'm not ugly and I'm satisfied with that.

I worry the odd time about how my lack of proper exercise is effecting me. Think my body looks a bit wretched after a while but I normally think of it as a health issue.

"Dressing up" is something I simply don't do. I wear my everyday clothes in just about every situation I can get away with because they're comfortable. They don't even look good at all but it's a lot easier to relax in them. I also value practicallity. Mainly because I secretly like to carry around nerd-equipment like calculators with me.

I'm not a fan of that "A man must be as assertive and outwardly-confident as possible". I'm generally quite confident in myself and like to think that I'm capable but I prefer to keep to myself. I don't go around trying to be in anyway controlling if I don't need to be so it annoys me that people mistake being an introvert as being somebody with confidence issues.

That or people think keeping to yourself must mean you're some sort of all-knowing wise one. People seem to assume I know things I'd have no clue about an awful lot. :pac:

Giselle

LZ5by5 wrote: »

However I think that often introvertness and quiet confidence is often mistaken for having a lack of confidence or being insecure. If you're not controlling a conversation in a group of people then people see you as a quiet weirdo whereas in reality you're just not interested in wrestling with dominating personalities and talking over each other.

To a lot of girls, the guy who's used to controlling the conversation and asserting his point of view as being more right or important, is a complete turn off.

Usually it really is the quieter ones who aren't interested in the shouting down or combatative type of interaction that are miles more interesting. Noise doesn't = appearing confident, as some guys seem to believe.

And I'd personally be much more interested in seeing Philip Seymour Hoffman in the lead role than Will Smith.

I'm sure I'm not alone.:)

Otis Driftwood

We in general have a much easier time when it comes to body image.As someone else posted,there is an immense of pressure on women to look a certain way,whereas that garbage isnt been forced down mens necks every time we turn on the tv or pick up a magazine.

Personally speaking Im carrying a bit of chubb,I dont stop traffic with my looks nor would I be the life and soul of a party,invariably Id be one of the ones not saying much and taking everything in rather than being the centre of attention yet I have to say Im pretty damn happy with myself.I dont feel the pressure of conformity that many women do plus Ive always been pretty individual anyway.

Just on the slagging thing,I have a couple of very close friends,my best mate in particular,and we absolutely slate eachother when ever we go out for a few pints but not once have I ever felt even remotely insulted.We insult eachother about everything from putting on weight,to them losing their hair,our clothes,everything is fair game,and you know what,I wouldnt want it any other way.

beegirl

Giselle wrote: »

And I'd personally be much more interested in seeing Philip Seymour Hoffman in the lead role than Will Smith.

I'm sure I'm not alone.:)

You are definitely not alone there! I think he is an amazing actor - but the guys are right, particular actors are always cast in the "heart-throb" or "action-hero" role, whereas Philip Seymour Hoffman always plays the alternative/interesting/different type of character. I wonder if that is by choice, I'd imagine maybe it is in his case? But in general, I think the major blockbuster action-hero roles go to the Brad Pitts etc... All in all, I think there is probably as much stereotyping about the way men "should" look as there is for women!

Otis Driftwood

Ya but the difference is most of us dont care.

Handsome Bob

Herbal Deity wrote: »

I don't really find that, personally...

Maybe it's just cos I'm so beautiful...

But really, I feel that the pressure on guys is much more to do with social status, exhibiting confidence etc.

EDIT: This:

(didn't read before posting originally)

That must be the difference so.

Herbal Deity

Giselle wrote: »

To a lot of girls, the guy who's used to controlling the conversation and asserting his point of view as being more right or important, is a complete turn off.

Usually it really is the quieter ones who aren't interested in the shouting down or combatative type of interaction that are miles more interesting. Noise doesn't = appearing confident, as some guys seem to believe.

And I'd personally be much more interested in seeing Philip Seymour Hoffman in the lead role than Will Smith.

I'm sure I'm not alone.:)

But probably not in the majority...

CDfm

i am absol****inlootly gorgeous and getting better with age.

entropi

I've learned over time that its not really the guy who is totally perfect in a girls/mans eyes that is attractive to them, it is what he has done with his life, how he comes across and portrays his personality traits that makes him a winner. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule, whereby one party will be totally superficial and just not care...all they want is someone "hot" to be seen with.

Myself, well I personally am happy enough with who I am. I think myself that my legs would be my best feature by far, but my upper body needs another 3-5kg of weight in muscle before I'd be totally happy with my appearance...and I would also see a need to have that because upper body size helps when you're a hurler:p

As for the main thread question though, when I look in the mirror I just see me, nothing more, nothing less yet I do have some days where I really just can't be bothered with effort, throw on my tracksuit (yes one lol) and laze about. The only reasons needed to get dressed up are for going to a nightclub as it's part of the dress code, or to a special occasion. Normally I'd love to just walk around in a hoodie, t-shirt, jeans and my converse:)

gonnaplayrugby

ye lol i mean i just wear hoodie, cantos and runners lol. i mean a girl either likes u r she doesnt.