Training/Long cycles on fixed-gear

electrogrimey

Just wondering what people think of starting training (just for fitness, not competition) on a fixed-gear? I'd like to start some training, just with the aim of eventual long distance cycles, say from Dublin to Leitrim/Mayo. Is there any reason why this isn't possible on a FG/SS?

Lumen

I think it's a really bad idea.

rottenhat

Nope, it'll just make you stronger. Your fixed gear might be a bit uncomfortable for long distance stuff if it has track geometry but if it's a road bike conversion that shouldn't be an issue.

Lumen wrote: »

I think it's a really bad idea.

Go on, entertain me - why?

lukester

electrogrimey wrote: »

Just wondering what people think of starting training (just for fitness, not competition) on a fixed-gear? I'd like to start some training, just with the aim of eventual long distance cycles, say from Dublin to Leitrim/Mayo. Is there any reason why this isn't possible on a FG/SS?

These folks did PBP fixed.

No reason you can't do it, only thing to be aware of in my opinion (other than the standard advice for building up training gradually) is to build in hills even more gradually than you would on a geared bike. I say this after picking up a knee injury last year, partly attributable to trying to ride my fixed up every hill I could find.

My preference would be for fixed over SS, but YMMV. Flywheel effect of fixed makes hills easier than SS.

@Lumen: Why indeed?

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

Go on, entertain me - why?

Because physiotherapy is expensive.

blorg

Fixed will take more out of you in the hills, it certainly does in Wicklow.

On the flat it works very well; I did 205km last Saturday on my Bowery with Rottenhat and some others. Plan on doing Cork-Dublin fixed this year at some point.

There is a possibility that grinding in a low gear for too long can do knee damage, that is the main thing to be wary of.

Choose gearing and route appropriately and it is fine.

I think it is probably no harm to be used to long distances geared first before attempting them fixed, even on the flat it is easier with a geared bike as you can rest/freewheel which you can't fixed.

rottenhat

Lumen wrote: »

physiotherapy is expensive.

But hardly an inevitable consequence of cycling long distances on a fixed gear. Plenty of people do it (well, okay, a small minority of hardcore lunatics, but it's more than just Blorg.)

tunney

Lumen wrote: »

I think it's a really bad idea.

Agreed. injuries galore

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

But hardly an inevitable consequence of cycling long distances on a fixed gear. Plenty of people do it (well, okay, a small minority of hardcore lunatics, but it's more than just Blorg.)

True, however there is survivor bias there.

Anything you can do on a single geared bike you can do on a multi-geared bike (apart from fixie skids etc).

Of course you could just pick a modest gear and potter along at a snails pace, legs spinning like a clown. But again, why?

Fixies are great for riding around town, and for an experienced cyclist looking for something new they're interesting to ride, but I think that if you have to ask the question "am I strong enough to ride long distances on a fixie" then the answer is probably "no".

rottenhat

All the OP is asking is whether he can start training to do long distance stuff on a fixed gear, not whether he can ride the Wicklow 200 on one this weekend. I will further guess that the unstated part of the question is that a fixed gear is the only bike he has and that he does not have the wherewithal to spring for another bike right now. I'd still say the OP is fine to do so, with the usual provisos about building up slowly etc etc.

lukester

electrogrimey wrote: »

I'd like to start some training, just with the aim of eventual long distance cycles, say from Dublin to Leitrim/Mayo.

OP isn't asking if he's strong enough right now.

It's not everyone's bag, but it most defiinitely is some people's..err, bag.

If he does it gradually and sensibly, no reason for him to darken a physio's door.

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

All the OP is asking is whether he can start training to do long distance stuff on a fixed gear, not whether he can ride the Wicklow 200 on one this weekend. I will further guess that the unstated part of the question is that a fixed gear is the only bike he has and that he does not have the wherewithal to spring for another bike right now. I'd still say the OP is fine to do so, with the usual provisos about building up slowly etc etc.

Fair enough. From my own perspective, going up and down hills is the best thing about cycling. If I could only own one bike, and already owned a fixie, I'd sell it and buy a multi-geared bike.

I think fixies are great, just not as an only bike, and having to adapt one's cycling around derailleur denial based on some perverse sense of Zen-ness and aversion to complexity seems peculiar.

But that's just me.

electrogrimey

Cheers for the replies guys. Yep, the fixed is my only bike at the moment. Sold my old racer (Raleigh AirLite 300) as I'd grown too big for the frame, opted to the fixed as 90% of my cycling is 10/20 minute rides in and out of town.

My plan is to, over a good while, build up a bike using the stock parts on this as I upgrade, and then sell it when it's built, so I can buy I geared racer. I'd then use that bike when I get it for the long rides. So using the fixed for training is definitely an in-the-meantime thing.

Would training on a fixed for rides which may or may not be geared be benificial? Or would I be better using the fixed for the rides, seeing as I've trained on it?

The training I'm talking about would just be say, 30km round trips to Howth etc.

blorg

Training on a fixed gear can transfer very well to a geared bike, it will force you to develop a high cadence going down hills and power going up them. IMHO.

30km round Howth is certainly fine.

With the very long stuff (e.g. 150km+) I think it is better to try these first on a geared bike or failing that at least just stick on a freewheel which should be easy enough. Most people find their first 160 or 200km ride hard enough as it is never mind doing it fixed. Gearing lets you make it easier going up hill and a freewheel gives your legs a rest.

When you are comfortable doing 200km geared/freewheel I think then is the best time to consider it fixed.

niceonetom

Lumen wrote: »

Because physiotherapy is expensive.

tunney wrote: »

Agreed. injuries galore

See, that's what I say about running.

Compare a fixed gear forum and a running forum for how many threads are about physios. OK, the fact that runners actually run while fixie owners just look at their bikes might be a factor, I'll admit, but my point stands!

Ryder

'found' fixed gear about 3 years ago and was an embarassingly vocal proponent of its fitness benefits - not anymore. A dose of patellar tendonitis has cured me.
As others have said, to ride safetly up even moderate hills requires a ridiculously low gear on flat ground. the fixed seems harder when riding largely because you dont coast, but when i ressurected my winter bike the adjustability of gears lets me work at the level i want for the conditions....as lumen said physio is expensive

That all said the fixed is a really enjoyable ride, just one i wouldnt rely on (as i did) for all fitness riding

DirkVoodoo

I have no Blorg like distances, most I have done is 130km on singlespeed over mostly flat terrain. It's fine, but I can't see how going up hills would be good unless you have massive strength like the aforementioned lunatic or Greyspoke. Be prepared for a lot of slow mashing which can hurt your lower back and knees.

Russman

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the point of a fixie ?
Genuinely curious, no offence to fixie riders.

electrogrimey

Cheers, think I've a decent idea by now. I'm starting more or less from scratch fitness & long riding wise, so it'll be a while before I could tackle 150km, so hopefully by then I'll have a geared bike anyway.

As Blorg said, if I get to the stage where I can happily handle 50km fixed, then I should be in a good position to go longer with gears.

I imagine for simply building fitness, a fixed would nearly be better than geared as it would mean pedalling the whole way, instead of cruising half the time, which wouldn't help build any fitness.

blorg

Russman wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the point of a fixie ?
Genuinely curious, no offence to fixie riders.

It's a zen thing.

rottenhat

Russman wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the point of a fixie ?

Cheap, low maintenance, looks cool in a minimalist way.

blorg

rottenhat wrote: »

Cheap, low maintenance, looks cool in a minimalist way.

Indeed

electrogrimey

Russman wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the point of a fixie ?
Genuinely curious, no offence to fixie riders.

1. For urban cycling, most people (me included) rarely change gears anyway, basically rendering the gears & derallieurs nothing but unnecessary weight and maintenance.

2. For short distances like those around cities you'd probably be pedalling non-stop anyway, so having a fixed-gear isn't much different.

3. Much easier & cheaper to build up a fixed-gear from scratch then it is a geared bike

4. The wishy-washy zen/amazing feeling riding stuff. Which is actually true :pac:

Russman

blorg wrote: »

It's a zen thing.

Ahh I see.........fair 'nuff I guess.

And I thought it was going to be a complex answer

rottenhat

rottenhat wrote: »

can look cool in a minimalist way.

FMP.

it's mick

i think fixies look cool, that's why i cycle one. [/honesty]

it's mick

well that was the reason at first anyway. now i love my bike

fixie

cant believe you just said that mick:eek:
russman you should give a fixed gear a go,just a total different feeling and perfect for in and out to town etc...

Russman

Yeah maybe someday, at the moment I kinda like the idea of being able to coast when the legs are feeling it !

Greyspoke

Russman wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the point of a fixie ?
Genuinely curious, no offence to fixie riders.

Simplicity and the challenge would be big reasons. A few years ago I moved out to the flatlands of Kildare and quickly discovered that I was using very few gears on a conventional road bike. I then sold that bike and bought a Langster, really as a cheap interim measure until I built up a carbon superbike that I'd been accumulating parts for. I rode that for a year as a singlespeed and then switched to fixed and I've just stuck with it to the point that when I finally built up the carbon bike I gave it to the wife! I'm now contemplating a carbon superfixie!
That doesn't really answer the question though. To look at it another way, gears are for making cycling easier and making it easier to optimise your average and max speed and unless you're into racing, as far as I'm concerned, that doesn't really matter. If however, you enjoy a physical challenge then riding a fixed wheel can be very satisfying. Unlike on a geared bike when you are little more than a passenger for quite a bit of the time (when you're coasting), on a fixie you are very much part of the machine - either you're driving it or it's driving you. Without getting into any Zen nonsense, there is very much a sense of oneness with the bike.
Obviously not for everyone but definitely worth a go if you want to try something different.

blorg

Greyspoke wrote: »

I'm now contemplating a carbon superfixie!

With the dry weather this week I finally got this on the road- still tweaking the position but I reckon I just about have it comfortable now. It is very light and fast. Disadvantages for long distance would include no bottle cages... other than that a very capable audax machine.

electrogrimey

Greyspoke wrote: »

Unlike on a geared bike when you are little more than a passenger for quite a bit of the time (when you're coasting), on a fixie you are very much part of the machine - either you're driving it or it's driving you.

I really like this description.

Post up a few pics of your bike and the carbon bike please

oflahero

Greyspoke wrote: »

If however, you enjoy a physical challenge then riding a fixed wheel can be very satisfying.

I have to add a bit of perspective here. I distinctly remember one day grinding my way up the Wicklow Gap in my lowest gear, red-faced and panting, finger desperately clicking away on the shifter for another gear that wasn't there, whereupon Greyspoke glided past on his fixie, seemingly effortlessly, and was still gentlemanly enough to explain sheepishly over his shoulder as he receded that, with his gearing, he couldn't go any slower than he was. I've started doing squats in the gym since then.

Greyspoke

blorg wrote: »

With the dry weather this week I finally got this on the road- still tweaking the position but I reckon I just about have it comfortable now. It is very light and fast. Disadvantages for long distance would include no bottle cages... other than that a very capable audax machine.

Yes, I really liked the look of that bike when I first saw the pics. I'm thinking of trying to get Dolan to adapt their new Seta frame for road use to include rear brake cable guides and bottle cage mounts. You can get Zefal mounts that zip tie to the frame to take bottle cages but of course they wouldn't look so neat. If it works out, I'll let you know!

Greyspoke

electrogrimey wrote: »

Post up a few pics of your bike and the carbon bike please

I'll try and do that shortly though the carbon fixie would be a little way off yet.

rottenhat

blorg wrote: »

Disadvantages for long distance would include no bottle cages... other than that a very capable audax machine.

Behind the seat tri-style maybe? You're not much of a man for the saddlebag anyway, are you?

Lumen

rottenhat wrote: »

Behind the seat tri-style maybe? You're not much of a man for the saddlebag anyway, are you?

If you're going to abandon all sense and look like some sort of hipster/triathlete/randonneur frankenstein's monster, an aerobar-mounted bottle would do it, perhaps with a nice stitched leather cover and a "crazy" straw.

blorg

Greyspoke wrote: »

Yes, I really liked the look of that bike when I first saw the pics. I'm thinking of trying to get Dolan to adapt their new Seta frame for road use to include rear brake cable guides and bottle cage mounts. You can get Zefal mounts that zip tie to the frame to take bottle cages but of course they wouldn't look so neat. If it works out, I'll let you know!

You don't really need cable guides, you can get ones that zip-tie and they work fine (the likes of the Cannondale Capo come this way.) What you DO need though is the frame drilled for a rear brake, that would be the bigger issue I think. I'm finding the front brake only not as much of an issue as I thought it would be but then I haven't taken the bike out in wet weather. I've heard of the zip-tie bottle cages but not sure if they would work so great on my frame due to the size/shape of the tubes... the other obvious option is something that goes between the aero bars or one of those saddles that lets you put one behind you.

Greyspoke

blorg wrote: »

You don't really need cable guides, you can get ones that zip-tie and they work fine (the likes of the Cannondale Capo come this way.) What you DO need though is the frame drilled for a rear brake, that would be the bigger issue I think. I'm finding the front brake only not as much of an issue as I thought it would be but then I haven't taken the bike out in wet weather. I've heard of the zip-tie bottle cages but not sure if they would work so great on my frame due to the size/shape of the tubes... the other obvious option is something that goes between the aero bars or one of those saddles that lets you put one behind you.

How do you find the track angles on the road? I was thinking of going for a road fork with a little more rake to soften it a bit. Dolan said they could drill the rear bridge and I'd go for guides for the sake of neatness.
The Zefal bottle mounts appear in the Zyro catalogues that seem to be available in most bike shops and they come in different sizes so might well fit large tubes.

Greyspoke

@ oflahero Ha! I can assure you it was anything but effortless - it's funny , you can usually hear me a mile away my breathing tends to be so loud!
Realistically, I guess you'd want to be doing most of your riding on flatish terrain to not get completely burnt out riding a fixed wheel. The occasional excursion into the hills is a grand challenge but doing it frequently - I'm not so sure!

blorg

Greyspoke wrote: »

How do you find the track angles on the road? I was thinking of going for a road fork with a little more rake to soften it a bit. Dolan said they could drill the rear bridge and I'd go for guides for the sake of neatness.

Fine so far but then I have it set up with TT bars, AFAIK a TT bike would have similar angles to the track bike anyway. Haven't tried with drop bars on the road but I suspect it could be made to work fine.