Commercial Tax/Insurance

gerrowadat

Howdy, didn't find this in the faq, so said I'd ask here:

Thinking of buying a commercial van/4x4 -- wondering how it affects tax and insurance as a private person using the vehicle for pleasure.

I've heard everything from "It's illegal to own the vehicle" to "You have to set up a company", etc. I just want to own a vehicle with an assload of cargo space, and hopefully pay less tax because it's a commercial (not looking to dodge VAT or anything).

What tax will I pay? Where do I find out the rates? Not seeing anything for 4x4s on motortax.ie.

Do insurance companies in general charge more? Any quote sites I've plugged a reg of a commercial into have given me a 'call us' message.

Cheers.

kadman

gerrowadat wrote: »

Howdy, didn't find this in the faq, so said I'd ask here:

Thinking of buying a commercial van/4x4 -- wondering how it affects tax and insurance as a private person using the vehicle for pleasure.

I've heard everything from "It's illegal to own the vehicle" to "You have to set up a company", etc. I just want to own a vehicle with an assload of cargo space, and hopefully pay less tax because it's a commercial (not looking to dodge VAT or anything).

What tax will I pay? Where do I find out the rates? Not seeing anything for 4x4s on motortax.ie.

Do insurance companies in general charge more? Any quote sites I've plugged a reg of a commercial into have given me a 'call us' message.

Cheers.

Big old classic car. tax at 48 per year , no doe or nct. Plus low insurance rates, and multiple vehicles on the policy.

kadman

gerrowadat

Going to go 4x4, I think, need to go offroad the odd time. Something like a land cruiser or terracan commercial jeep.

Classic 4x4 I'm not really into. I want to spend more time in the car than under it, thanks :-)

kadman

gerrowadat wrote: »

Going to go 4x4, I think, need to go offroad the odd time. Something like a land cruiser or terracan commercial jeep.

Classic 4x4 I'm not really into. I want to spend more time in the car than under it, thanks :-)

But remember a commercial vehicle taxed for commercial use, is for commercial use. Its not for social and domestic at the weekend out with the family. You,ll have some fun explaining to a garda why you are driving into town for a bag of chips in a commercial vehicle:D:D

I know some who have been pulled over at a joint checkpoint ( sw, garda, customs), and quizzed up by sw , why they are driving a commercial wagon on commercial tax, and signing at the same time. So be aware of the issues if you are not working.

Reliability on any vehicle is down to its maintainence, not its year.

kadman

gerrowadat

kadman wrote: »

But remember a commercial vehicle taxed for commercial use, is for commercial use. Its not for social and domestic at the weekend out with the family. You,ll have some fun explaining to a garda why you are driving into town for a bag of chips in a commercial vehicle:D:D

I know some who have been pulled over at a joint checkpoint ( sw, garda, customs), and quizzed up by sw , why they are driving a commercial wagon on commercial tax, and signing at the same time. So be aware of the issues if you are not working.

Reliability on any vehicle is down to its maintainence, not its year.

kadman

Right, so am I able to tax the vehicle privately, and is it at the same rate as for the non-commercial version? I'm working btw, so am just concerned on what the legalities are.

Any ideas on insurance?

Tax it commercially. There are some here who say you have to tax it privately if you use it for anything other than commercial use but I don't know anyone (myself included when I had a carvan) who don't get commercial tax. I don't actually know anyone who uses their 4x4/car van only for commercial use and most just use them for commuting as they have much cheaper tax and never heard of anyone having an ounce of hassle over this.

After previous threads on this subject I mentioned I said it in passing to a few friends with vans/4x4 and was greeted with laughter. It appears to be only people on this forum who have heard of this rule for some reason.

You will pay an awful lot more to tax it privately.

When I was insuring a carvan I was with Quinn and it was insured under a commercial policy.

gerrowadat

Griffin Modern Lump wrote: »

Tax it commercially. There are some here who say you have to tax it privately if you use it for anything other than commercial use but I don't know anyone (myself included when I had a carvan) who don't get commercial tax. I don't actually know anyone who uses their 4x4/car van only for commercial use and most just use them for commuting as they have much cheaper tax and never heard of anyone having an ounce of hassle over this.

After previous threads on this subject I mentioned I said it in passing to a few friends with vans/4x4 and was greeted with laughter. It appears to be only people on this forum who have heard of this rule for some reason.

You will pay an awful lot more to tax it privately.

When I was insuring a carvan I was with Quinn and it was insured under a commercial policy.

Cheers, thought so. Since it's a different vehicle class I'd expect it.

Do I need a CRO number, etc. for taxing commercially? Can I do so if the car is personally owned by me, or does it need to be owned by a company?

gerrowadat

gerrowadat wrote: »

Cheers, thought so. Since it's a different vehicle class I'd expect it.

Do I need a CRO number, etc. for taxing commercially? Can I do so if the car is personally owned by me, or does it need to be owned by a company?

No, once the van was previously being taxed commercially you will just need to fill out the form and have your doe cert. They will not question it and you dont need any thing to prove you have a business or anything.

Ironically if you did try to tax it privately they would most likely refuse as its a commercial vehicle.

joewicklow

I have a commercial Land Rover Defender. I just tax it as if I was taxing any other vehicle (commercial tax). I only use it at the weekends or the odd evening as I also have a company car.
I have never been questioned by the Guards or anyone else for that matter.

kadman

Griffin Modern Lump wrote: »

Tax it commercially. There are some here who say you have to tax it privately if you use it for anything other than commercial use but I don't know anyone (myself included when I had a carvan) who don't get commercial tax. I don't actually know anyone who uses their 4x4/car van only for commercial use and most just use them for commuting as they have much cheaper tax and never heard of anyone having an ounce of hassle over this.

After previous threads on this subject I mentioned I said it in passing to a few friends with vans/4x4 and was greeted with laughter. It appears to be only people on this forum who have heard of this rule for some reason.

You will pay an awful lot more to tax it privately.

When I was insuring a carvan I was with Quinn and it was insured under a commercial policy.

Its not a forum belief that the law exists. It does exist, and its being used in particular to stop benefit to those who are driving a commercial taxed vehicle, and signing. SW theory is that if you are signing , you cant possibly be driving a commercially taxed vehicle, as that is used for commerce/business, and you say you are not employed. Any way thats another thread:)

All commercial vehicles insured, are insured under a commercial policy, as there is no private policy for commercial vehicles. Its the filling out of the commercial policy form that seperates the use of a commercial for business use, or a commercial for private use. If its for private use, the check boxes on the form for social and domestic, are flagged. If its for commercial use, they are not. Flagged for social and domestic equals high tax, not flagged equals low commercial tax.

Whether your friends are taxing commercially, and using it for social and domestic is immaterial. But it is illegal, and any garda station will confirm that. And illegal activities should not be advocated here, even if they are widely used:D

kadman

kadman

I suppose another issue is exactly what your insurance says you can use the vehicle for, private , commercial or both. I,ve seen so many views on it on the net, its confusing to say the least.

For the legalities of the tax issue, its best to contact the tax office or garda office.

I do know for a fact that drivers of commercial vehicles being used for social and domestic, were quizzed over it at checkpoints. I personally dont know the outcome though.

kadman

kadman

kadman wrote: »

I suppose another issue is exactly what your insurance says you can use the vehicle for, private , commercial or both. I,ve seen so many views on it on the net, its confusing to say the least.

For the legalities of the tax issue, its best to contact the tax office or garda office.

I do know for a fact that drivers of commercial vehicles being used for social and domestic, were quizzed over it at checkpoints. I personally dont know the outcome though.

kadman

I will use an example I have used before on this topic. If this law was being enforced then every farmer in the country would be getting hassle all over the place as they would use their car-vans/4x4 for everything from collecting kids from school to going to the hardware shop to going into town shopping. Now I can tell you there is not one farmer taxing a commercial 4x4 or car-van privately and being from the country I know a lot of farmers add to this lots of block layers/carpenters etc who use their vans for everything and of course all the new drivers who usually start out driving in a van as its cheaper to tax and insure. Thats a hell of a lot of people who have never had hassle.

Also if you tax a commercial vehicle privately you cannot doe or nct it.

Basically anybody willing to take a tiny risk of at worst getting a bit of hassle will get commercial tax and anybody with less than a tiny bit of cop on will pay 3 or 4 times more for private tax.

kadman

Griffin Modern Lump wrote: »

I will use an example I have used before on this topic. If this law was being enforced then every farmer in the country would be getting hassle all over the place as they would use their car-vans/4x4 for everything from collecting kids from school to going to the hardware shop to going into town shopping. Now I can tell you there is not one farmer taxing a commercial 4x4 or car-van privately and being from the country I know a lot of farmers add to this lots of block layers/carpenters etc who use their vans for everything and of course all the new drivers who usually start out driving in a van as its cheaper to tax and insure. Thats a hell of a lot of people who have never had hassle.

Also if you tax a commercial vehicle privately you cannot doe or nct it.

Basically anybody willing to take a tiny risk of at worst getting a bit of hassle will get commercial tax and anybody with less than a tiny bit of cop on will pay 3 or 4 times more for private tax.

Just because the law is not enforced it does not make something legal. As the op has asked in his original post. Even though its a wide spread practice:D

Right, so am I able to tax the vehicle privately, and is it at the same rate as for the non-commercial version? I'm working btw, so am just concerned on what the legalities are.

Any ideas on insurance?

I think its best to advise him to contact the garda or tax ofice for the legalities. The Boards forum is not the place to give legal direction.

kadman

Titan Warrior

gerrowadat wrote: »

Howdy, didn't find this in the faq, so said I'd ask here:

Thinking of buying a commercial van/4x4 -- wondering how it affects tax and insurance as a private person using the vehicle for pleasure.

I've heard everything from "It's illegal to own the vehicle" to "You have to set up a company", etc. I just want to own a vehicle with an assload of cargo space, and hopefully pay less tax because it's a commercial (not looking to dodge VAT or anything).

What tax will I pay? Where do I find out the rates? Not seeing anything for 4x4s on motortax.ie.

Do insurance companies in general charge more? Any quote sites I've plugged a reg of a commercial into have given me a 'call us' message.

Cheers.

Generally you can't get a comparitve quote for a commercial on the inteternet - Insurance companies rates commercial vehicles generally on carrying capacity - Your occupation and use of the vehicle normally is relevant - However once they quote for you as say - Carpenter - If it's a commercial vehicle ( i.e 2 seater) then you have use for commercial (i.e as a carpenter) and Social Dmestic & pleasure -- This is general advice but should be the case unless there's more to your story !!!