Can't Decide Between 2 Amps

MadMardegan

I'm in the market for a high-ish end amp for recreational playing and am kinda stuck between a Marshall JCM2000 DSL401 or a Marshall Modern Vintage 2266C.

The tone on the MV 2266 is great but the thing that throws me off is that it only has 1 channel. I suppose a pedal board will sort this out though.

I have a Gibson Les Paul Standard. Everything is standard on it atm but am hoping to upgrade the pick ups to SD Alnico Pro II Humbuckers shortly.

I play a lot of different kind of music from GNR to Led Zep to Pink Floyd to Pantera and BLS. And a lot of other things.

I'm looking for an amp that can handle all these genres with ease.

My pedal board is going to be something like;

(in no particular order atm)
Wah
Phaser
Tuner
ISP Decimator
Overdrive
Chorus
Maybe volume pedal for swells.
Possibly a Digitech Whammy
10 band EQ

Anyone got any input?

Sandvich

JCM2000 DSL401 can be got generally for under €400 second hand, not exactly very high end. The amp itself has problems over heating, and can be more difficult to get a good sound out of(especially since it uses EL84s, which are meant for the Vox sound not Marshalls, though given JCM2000s have practically no power tube distortion it's probably not the main issue).

The Modern Vintages are meant to be great, but obviously, a bit pricey.

Does it have to be a Marshall? The influences you list are:

Marshall(modded JCM), a bunch of different amps, fuzz pedals through a Hiwatt, old Solid State Randall, Marshall(JCM).

So it would seem to be the best choice, however many amps and even pedals are capable of nailing the Marshall sound. Handling all those bands with ease is going to be difficult; while most fall into the "Classic Rock" territory there's still a lot of Variance and Pantera is a totally different sound.

I would nearly recommend a good modelling amp - the new Spider Valve IIs look great, much better than the old ones, the Vypyr Tube as well. These have really started to respond a lot like proper tube amps.

I would definitely consider going second hand if you want to get that kind of versatility from a "Real" Tube amp, and investing in some pedals. I have a Barber Dirty Bomb, with an EQ pedal and a noise gate you couild probably get the Pantera kind of tone, it's style somewhat after the tone of those old cascading FET based Randalls(Which in turn sound a bit like the Boogie Mk II C+ at least to my ears). http://www.youtube.com/watch#v=Z_w0xhl6V4o&feature=related

landsleaving

I'd say if you like the tone and have a good pedal board then go for the single channel. Your OD pedal can create a second channel anyway, so better tone should be your preference, unless you can think of a situation where you'd need a second channel.

Sergio

Arite mate ive got a 2nd hand JCM 200 DSL 401 combo forsale on adverts.ie at the moment if your interested.Its in great condition with footswitch and user manual included.

pm me if you want more info.

Myrddin

The Vintage hands down. Combined with your Alnico's its gonna give you one sweet sound with the right ovd/dist unit.

Ive ALWAYS found DSL/TSl JCM2000 amps never quite have enough crispness...ie always found them muddy.

MadMardegan

Cheers for reply lads.

I'm leaning towards the VM 2266C with the guitar setup and pedal setup I have listed.

Anyone else have any input?

Mataguri

Have you tried the Marshall JMD1? I tend to be skeptical about modelling amps but reviews so far are saying this is a great amp. Also, you can store upto 128 presets which is handy for someone who is looking for a wide variety of tones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hod6VHVLMc

MadMardegan

Mataguri wrote: »

Have you tried the Marshall JMD1? I tend to be skeptical about modelling amps but reviews so far are saying this is a great amp. Also, you can store upto 128 presets which is handy for someone who is looking for a wide variety of tones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hod6VHVLMc

To be honest man, I'd rather steer well clear of modelling amps.

Sandvich

http://www.thomann.de/ie/marshall_2266c_vintage_modern.htm

To be honest for this kind of cash you could get something REALLY awesome. Or like, two Peavey 6505s.

I'd actually consider looking into some of the Bugera stuff - these days it's actually real quality.

MadMardegan

Sandvich wrote: »

http://www.thomann.de/ie/marshall_2266c_vintage_modern.htm

To be honest for this kind of cash you could get something REALLY awesome. Or like, two Peavey 6505s.

I'd actually consider looking into some of the Bugera stuff - these days it's actually real quality.

Gotta be marshall, man :P

SirLemonhead

Sandvich wrote: »

http://www.thomann.de/ie/marshall_2266c_vintage_modern.htm

I'd actually consider looking into some of the Bugera stuff - these days it's actually real quality.

They're not going on fire anymore? :pac:

rcaz

MadMardegan wrote: »

Gotta be marshall, man :P

If you'd rather pay for a name than the right amp, then go for it...

i57dwun4yb1pt8

El Pr0n wrote: »

If you'd rather pay for a name than the right amp, then go for it...

may be hes considering resale value later ? maybe he just wants a marshall, like some people just want a fender strat ?

cold up there on yer high horse ?

rcaz

DaDumTish wrote: »

cold up there on yer high horse ?

Not at all :rolleyes:

Resale value is great, but I don't think you should prioritise it over the right sound to suit your wants/needs. Nobody wants an amp that constantly makes them think, "it sounds okay, but I'll be able to sell it and get minted" or something. Do they??

And 'just wanting a Marshall' is a bit silly, isn't it? If you had a great sounding amp that didn't look exactly the way you first wanted, that disappointment would wear off after a few days after you realised you've got a savage guitar tone. But if you buy an amp that looks really cool and doesn't sound very good, there'll always be a little bit of regret in your mind. I can say this from experience.

And don't get me wrong, there are great Marshall amps, and the OP may very well find the perfect amp for their needs that happens to be a Marshall. But the "It's a Marshall!" part should be the very last box to be ticked on the list. As we all know, Marshall also make a whole load of awful amps, and are only too keen to get in on the "write Marshall on it and bump up the margin" business model. I would hate to see anyone getting sucked into that trap.

Surely the people who post on this forum looking for gear advice want to get the very best equipment they can. I thought we were supposed to offer advice that would help make that happen? So my advice is to think with your ears first and foremost. The name behind the gear just does not matter.

-=al=-

as an owner of a tsl ..not quite the dsl, but id say go with the VM out of the two

i also find myself only using the clean channel on the tsl also

i57dwun4yb1pt8

if the guy wants a marshall let him buy a marsahll- who are we to judge.

rcaz

DaDumTish wrote: »

if the guy wants a marshall let him buy a marsahll- who are we to judge.

I'm not judging, I'm encouraging them to get the best-sounding amp they can find. Anything wrong with that?

Myrddin

El Pr0n wrote: »

I'm not judging, I'm encouraging them to get the best-sounding amp they can find. Anything wrong with that?

Since he stated its got to be a Marshall, then we should be helping him find the best sounding Marshall for him. I never got that whole anti-Marshall thing, yeah they make some **** amps - but show me a company who doesnt...

rcaz

EnterNow wrote: »

I never got that whole anti-Marshall thing, yeah they make some **** amps - but show me a company who doesnt...

Er, I'm not anti-Marshall, I've said that already :rolleyes:

Sandvich

EnterNow wrote: »

Since he stated its got to be a Marshall, then we should be helping him find the best sounding Marshall for him. I never got that whole anti-Marshall thing, yeah they make some **** amps - but show me a company who doesnt...

Saying that there might be something better for his needs than a Marshall isn't "anti-Marshall". Especially for the list of influences, there may be a better option that's more versatile than most Marshalls.

Personally I don't believe in babying misconceptions about gear.

darrenw5094

The Marshall JVM would be a big step up from the 2000 range. Also the price is a step up.

Also the Marshall 30th Anniversary 6101 amp is possibly their best combo ever. Could get one of those for around 400 nicker.

-=al=-

the 30th anniversary marshalls sound great

people like the sound of different things, if a marshalls good to someones ears then that be that!

darrenw5094

-=al=- wrote: »

the 30th anniversary marshalls sound great

people like the sound of different things, if a marshalls good to someones ears then that be that!

Very versatile too. Clean channel, crunch channel with JTM45, JCM800 and JCM900 modes in there and finally channel 3, with all the overdrive you need. All 3 channels have their own EQ too. Power amp options too, 100w, 50w or 25w modes.

So great all rounder. Sounds great with some NOS valves. But they are a secret, so i didn't say that.;)

Myrddin

Sandvich wrote: »

Saying that there might be something better for his needs than a Marshall isn't "anti-Marshall". Especially for the list of influences, there may be a better option that's more versatile than most Marshalls.

Personally I don't believe in babying misconceptions about gear.

No, saying that isnt anti-Marshall...but the chap stated its gotta be a Marshall didnt he? If he said what kind of amp can give me this sound, then yeah fair enough. But shooting down his preferred choice of amp isnt exactly helpful either.

What exactly is the misconception about gear here? Nobody said Marshall are the be-all and end all did they? But seeing as he wants one, lets try help him get the right one for him, no?

As stated, the Vintage would be the decider between the two (JVM/JCM2000).

Sandvich

darrenw5094 wrote: »

Very versatile too. Clean channel, crunch channel with JTM45, JCM800 and JCM900 modes in there and finally channel 3, with all the overdrive you need. All 3 channels have their own EQ too. Power amp options too, 100w, 50w or 25w modes.

So great all rounder. Sounds great with some NOS valves. But they are a secret, so i didn't say that.;)

.

That sounds class. I wish it had a JCM2000 mode though

darrenw5094

Sandvich wrote: »

.

That sounds class. I wish it had a JCM2000 mode though

JCM2000 range were the worst Marshalls ever built. Quality of components and workmanship were at an all time low with that range. Although, some people like it's tone. Maybe after a valvecheck and maybe a decent speaker.

Thankfully, Marshall have made the new JVM range, much higher standard than the previous effort.

The 2 most versatile combos Marshall have released are the 30th 6101 and JVM410c. 30th being more old school and the JVM more modern style. Both are fairly high quality.

-=al=-

theres a handy option of switching the amp to 25w on the tsl100 too, pretty nice feature i dont think ive ever taken it off, nice cleans on it, and i love the tone i can get, but yeah awsome feature when u can do that

Sandvich

I love the JCM2000 tone though because it sounds like a JCM800 only a bit more "metal" voiced, and you can get some insane growls out of it. If I could get an amp that sounds like that it'd be great. I'm considering a Peavey Bandit, the High Gain channel sounds very JCM2000-ish, was really impressed with a blind test for such a cheap SS amp.

darrenw5094

Sandvich wrote: »

I love the JCM2000 tone though because it sounds like a JCM800 only a bit more "metal" voiced, and you can get some insane growls out of it. If I could get an amp that sounds like that it'd be great. I'm considering a Peavey Bandit, the High Gain channel sounds very JCM2000-ish, was really impressed with a blind test for such a cheap SS amp.

Marshall DSL401 for around €400 or less all over adverts.

Sandvich

darrenw5094 wrote: »

Marshall DSL401 for around €400 or less all over adverts.

The combo isn't the greatest though, I hear it has some problems overheating, uses EL84s in the power section too which are more of a voxxy thing and the effects loop only does 50% mix which is incredibly annoying.

darrenw5094

Sandvich wrote: »

The combo isn't the greatest though, I hear it has some problems overheating, uses EL84s in the power section too which are more of a voxxy thing and the effects loop only does 50% mix which is incredibly annoying.

Still be better than Peavey Bandit. The Marshall 30th 6101 is still my #1 choice. Some have gone for under €400 on adverts.

Sandvich

darrenw5094 wrote: »

Still be better than Peavey Bandit. The Marshall 30th 6101 is still my #1 choice. Some have gone for under €400 on adverts.

That thing weighs nearly 70 pounds, no way I could cart that around. Even the Bandit is a bit too heavy for me.

The newer Peavey Bandits are actually surprisngly good too.

Here's a shootout with the JCM2000

http://www.netmusicians.org/files/98-Amp%205.mp3

http://www.netmusicians.org/files/44-Amp%206.mp3

I can't remember which is which offhand, see if you can guess. That's with a proper JCM2000 too not the combo. Just because it's tube doesn't mean it's automatically better.

Eoin Madsen

There's plenty of decent solidstate amps I'd take over a JCM2000.

rcaz

Sandvich wrote: »

the effects loop only does 50% mix which is incredibly annoying.

Why would they design that??

darrenw5094

El Pr0n wrote: »

Why would they design that??

I suppose you get what you pay for.

The Marshall 30th Anniversary 6101 is great bang for buck.

Sandvich

darrenw5094 wrote: »

I suppose you get what you pay for.

The Marshall 30th Anniversary 6101 is great bang for buck.

And more than 20 pounds heavier than the 2000 combo, may as well get a 2x12 then.

Grolschevik

darrenw5094 wrote: »

I suppose you get what you pay for.

The Marshall 30th Anniversary 6101 is great bang for buck.

I was looking into buying one last year. Decided against it based on stuff I heard about overheating issues.

And just cos someone on the first page mentioned Bugeras, I see from a recent issue of Guitarist that Vernon Reid (from Living Colour) has been using them...

darrenw5094

Grolschevik wrote: »

I was looking into buying one last year. Decided against it based on stuff I heard about overheating issues.

And just cos someone on the first page mentioned Bugeras, I see from a recent issue of Guitarist that Vernon Reid (from Living Colour) has been using them...

Vernon has probably been offered a big wad of cash to be seen in photos and youtube videos with them. They are Behringer amps, so i don't think relialblity would any better than other budget amps.

Grolschevik

Possibly, but I didn't get that impression. The pics showed them in a corner of his home studio surrounded by loads of other stuff. I'd say he got 'em free alright, but he said he'd used/tried them but was currently between amp setups...

MadMardegan

It's gotta be a Marshall because I love Marhsall, most of my favourite guitarists use Marshall and also because I love the look of em.