The Frontline 1/03/2010

amdublin

Who is the guest???

Not the doctor bloke, the other fella

whippy

Niall Stokes - Hot Press

amdublin

Really??

Does Niall Stokes not wear glasses & mad curly hair?



Is he some other person from Hot Press?

itac

This could finally be an actual debate on the headshops, instead of hysteria & random facts. So far, so good methinks....

445279.ie

Think his name is Stuart Blake, from Hot Press

That auld one is just upset cause she snorted a whole bag of SNOWY SNOW SNOW and ended up getting that haircut.

df1985

So far its been very interesting, for a change the people know what they are talking about for once!

billymitchell

445279.ie wrote: »

Think his name is Stuart Blake, from Hot Press

Sorry, cant give it to you,Its stuart Clarke.

teddy_303

Luke ya mad Ming ya!

whippy

Yes of course - Stuart Clarke - sorry!

itac

teddy_303 wrote: »

Luke ya mad Ming ya!

That's who he is!! Was trying to figure out where I knew him from, tis Ming the Merciless from back in the day.....:D

Spiritoftheseventies

billymitchell wrote: »

Sorry, cant give it to you,Its stuart Clarke.

He is always talking about music on Last word. Good slot. Why do folks always turn back to Alcohol when there is a discussion about drugs. Not the same thing.

teddy_303

Yeah, fcuking mad thing him. a few substances were tested round his gaf in sligo RTC a while back no doubt. Lunacy it was.

Looks like the headshops have started payin FF off lads! Happy days!

itac

Must have been a few years back if he was in the RTC, haven't heard it called that in a long time..:D
I'm sure he went a on some electoral campaign trying to legalise certain narcotics at some point too, although that could be the memory playing up on me....?*





*this is not due to personal consumption of narcotics, just a dodgy memory...honestly...:)

df1985

What have the banks got to do with anything ffs! Some aul fella gets a stupid joke in and the other fools start cheering!

ArtSmart

df1985 wrote: »

What have the banks got to do with anything ffs! Some aul fella gets a stupid joke in and the other fools start cheering!

Ye see, the drugs drive em crazy - crazy i tells ye!!
There's even a movie bout them now.



Finally the scumbag banks - something worth talkin about!

Ronan|Raven

"Theres no kids sniffing glue in the hills of Roscommon"

Well they are certainly plenty consuming everything else legal and illegal which he seemed to forget.

teddy_303

itac wrote: »

Must have been a few years back if he was in the RTC, haven't heard it called that in a long time..:D
I'm sure he went a on some electoral campaign trying to legalise certain narcotics at some point too, although that could be the memory playing up on me....?*





*this is not due to personal consumption of narcotics, just a dodgy memory...honestly...:)

I used to go on sessions with him and a few of the other heads about back then (92-94ish). Serious banter & capers etc. Happy days as they say round them parts. I remember Luke strutting round the shop (not head shop) with a swastika shaved onto the back of his head. What the locals were thinking god knows.

TheDoc

I dont like how people avoid the main question you need to ask yourself in this debate, and the councilor there who was an admitted drug user said

If you had no choice, would you rather people bought their drugs from a backstreet dealer, or a legal shop that provides funding to the ecnomony. and for the various items mentioned like education, drug rehabilitation etc.

I think it funny how people assume that because they are legal, everyones going to jump on them. Theres a hemp shop in my area, I could go buy the stuff if I want, and I just dont.

And the people who are going into them now are just the people who bought of dealers beforehand.

And the underagers buying from them, well, didnt you stand around the corner asking people to go in and buy you drink, did you not ask your older brother? Same scenario. I think its pure dramatisation to say that hemp shops are selling their products to kids directly, very typically irish, slanting the story to make it as dramatic as possible.


If I ever decided to take drugs, I'd feel more comfortable buying from a legal regulated premises, rather then some bloke of the street. Also what happens when the drug dealer stats offering me some free samples? I know how that story goes, but what if some people dont, and they take and take, they get lured in. Or when a drug dealer offers you some stuff on credit and you cant pay.

A hemp shop wont lure you in with freebies. A hemp shop wont cut its product to make more money, while putting extra risk on the user, and a hemp shop wont spot you a bag then go break your face when you dont pay up.

I'm not a drug user, I dont like drugs, and never will use/like them. But I'd rather have a society where its regulated strictly and bringing severe finance back into the economny, rather then having it sold by dodgy ***** around corners.
I also have severe sympathy for the hemp shop owners, as I myself used to work in an airsoft shop which was also a contraversial subject matter of items for sale, and its a losing battle, when dealing with the over dramatic unrealistic irish society.

JonathanAnon

unconsciousnaba ba table.. ?

bonerm

Fat fúcking FF goon.

ArtSmart

bonerm wrote: »

Fat fúcking FF goon.

? I assume you don't mean Lucey?

billymitchell

WTF What ate stuart clarke????? :eek:

bonerm

ArtSmart wrote: »

? I assume you don't mean Lucey?

O'Brien. Fat smarmy cúnt.

ArtSmart

In terms of the drug thing - the choice is hand billions to criminals or control it and tax it, and generate income. Course the nutters do scream loudly, but money talks louder. wont surprise me if it's all legalised soon

itac

TheDoc wrote: »

....I think it funny how people assume that because they are legal, everyones going to jump on them. Theres a hemp shop in my area, I could go buy the stuff if I want, and I just dont.

And the people who are going into them now are just the people who bought of dealers beforehand.

And the underagers buying from them, well, didnt you stand around the corner asking people to go in and buy you drink, did you not ask your older brother? Same scenario. I think its pure dramatisation to say that hemp shops are selling their products to kids directly, very typically irish, slanting the story to make it as dramatic as possible.
....

+1
So easy to attack the legal sellers of these things. (most) people aren't stupid, they know the risks they're taking when they take things like this. They also know the risks they're taking when they buy from street dealers.

Many of the people I've heard speaking against headshops over the last few weeks seem to have the "well, I don't understand it, but I know they're wrong" kinda attitude. They're also usually people who are over a certain age, or know someone who's had a bad experience from said products. I doubt they berate their friends who have the DTS/are incapable of moving for a day or so after consuming several pints/bottles of wine/12 shots of random alcohol in a night.

The biggest problem I can see from the general discussions is that many of the ingredients in the "plant food" react in ways that Doctors/hospital staff aren't used to yet-they know how to treat alcohol/certain drug o.d.'s, but this seems to be a new thing to them. How true that is, I don't know...but certainly more reasoned debates on them should be welcomed!

And Teddy, I'd say back then he would've gotten a few looks alright....Sligo's got a small-town mentality now, back then it was more a small-village mentality-still, sounds like happy days indeed then

teddy_303

itac wrote: »

+1
So easy to attack the legal sellers of these things. (most) people aren't stupid, they know the risks they're taking when they take things like this. They also know the risks they're taking when they buy from street dealers.

Many of the people I've heard speaking against headshops over the last few weeks seem to have the "well, I don't understand it, but I know they're wrong" kinda attitude. They're also usually people who are over a certain age, or know someone who's had a bad experience from said products. I doubt they berate their friends who have the DTS/are incapable of moving for a day or so after consuming several pints/bottles of wine/12 shots of random alcohol in a night.

The biggest problem I can see from the general discussions is that many of the ingredients in the "plant food" react in ways that Doctors/hospital staff aren't used to yet-they know how to treat alcohol/certain drug o.d.'s, but this seems to be a new thing to them. How true that is, I don't know...but certainly more reasoned debates on them should be welcomed!

And Teddy, I'd say back then he would've gotten a few looks alright....Sligo's got a small-town mentality now, back then it was more a small-village mentality-still, sounds like happy days indeed then

I know well horse, I'm from there.

epgc3fyqirnbsx

Luke is meant to be a fantastic counsellor, locals love him because he will really go above and beyond for them now.

Lately he's the champion of the bog! Seriously, they're trying to stop people cutting turf, he's opposed as its many poor and elderly peoples only way of getting fuel plus the bogs haven't been decimated in the west like the have by bord na mona in the midlands

He's widely tipped to get an independent seat at the next general election. I would so f*ckin love to see that man up there!

teddy_303

Emmeline Few Printer wrote: »

Luke is meant to be a fantastic counsellor, locals love him because he will really go above and beyond for them now.

Lately he's the champion of the bog! Seriously, they're trying to stop people cutting turf, he's opposed as its many poor and elderly peoples only way of getting fuel plus the bogs haven't been decimated in the west like the have by bord na mona in the midlands

He's widely tipped to get an independent seat at the next general election. I would so f*ckin love to see that man up there!

I bet he is the agitator in the meetings, saying the unpopular comments the others wouldn't dare, even if secretly they agree with them fully. Good luck to him I say too, he'll be a **** load more beneficial to the marginalised than any of the "party line" towers who fcuk up all before them all too willingly.

itac

teddy_303 wrote: »

I know well horse, I'm from there.

ahh..the penny finally drops (slowly!) with me!

It'd be interesting to see how he'd do if he got in....rare to find someone who'll actually stick to their principles once they get in....but I think he might!

Spiritoftheseventies

Have to ask. The head shops supposedly sell "above the counter" stuff. But if you get behind the wheel having consumed one of these concoctions and were in an accident Im guess it wouldn't be.
Drugs are drugs are drugs.

MaceFace

How interesting that all the comments are alleuding to the anti-brigade being the lunatics and the pro-brigade being the sensible ones.........

I didn't see any of the usual brigade from the Clondalkin drug rehab centers to give their opinion. Surely they would be better to speak on the subject than a hippy councillor or an A&E doc.

BaZmO*

TheDoc wrote: »

Also what happens when the drug dealer stats offering me some free samples?

TheDoc wrote: »

Or when a drug dealer offers you some stuff on credit and you cant pay.

I can guarantee that those two scenarios won't happen.


I enjoyed the show last night but the debate on headshops was so one sided it was unfunny. Stuart Clarke came across really well and didn't get drawn into a ridiculous back and forth debate on the rights and wrongs of drug taking, he just presented the facts as they are. The aul lad screaming, "won't somebody please think of the children!!!" was typical of the level of debate you get when discussing drugs. Even though he started talking about kids ending up under trains or buses due to taking level highs :rolleyes: he still got the biggest round of applause.

itac

MaceFace wrote: »

How interesting that all the comments are alleuding to the anti-brigade being the lunatics and the pro-brigade being the sensible ones.........

I didn't see any of the usual brigade from the Clondalkin drug rehab centers to give their opinion. Surely they would be better to speak on the subject than a hippy councillor or an A&E doc

I'm not saying I think these shops are good idea, I'm just welcoming some "reasoned" debate. Personally, I'd be happier if these products were all gone from the streets. I'd also be a lot happier if the scumbag dealers were gone too. Yet at the moment, nobody seems to be coming on air to give yards of abuse to the dealers.

My biggest annoyance with the most recent comments is that the anti-brigade (whilst meaning well) do come across as people on a mission, unwillingly to listen to what their opposing speaker is saying, which, when used as it was on the programme last night, makes them seem like "lunatics".

While hearing a personal story from someone affected can help drive a point home, when the message of the story gets lost in hysterics, you have to wonder is it worth having them there? I wish they'd actually brought someone in who just speak about the problems these drugs have caused calmly, like you suggested, someone who actually dealing with the problems these things cause.

I'd love to say I have every faith in the Gov't to help sort this out, but ehhh....something tells me that's not going to happen any time soon...:rolleyes:

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Have to ask. The head shops supposedly sell "above the counter" stuff. But if you get behind the wheel having consumed one of these concoctions and were in an accident Im guess it wouldn't be.
Drugs are drugs are drugs.

Alcohol is a drug. Granted, it's far more socially acceptable to abuse alcohol than it is cocaine/heroin, but it is still a dangerous drug, no matter how harmless people think it is. I don't know if we have laws that state if a person is under any drug related influence, they shouldn't be driving, but if we do, why aren't they being advertised like the recent don't-drink & drive campaigns?

p.s. if we do have, I'm completely open to correction on that...!

BaZmO*

itac wrote: »

I don't know if we have laws that state if a person is under any drug related influence,

We do

transylman

Had to laugh at the oul lad reading his notes off the back of a paddy power betting slip. Then this other one banging on about "these drugs are memetic pshychotics, they reproduce insanity"

Teddy Chips

transylman wrote: »

Had to laugh at the oul lad reading his notes off the back of a paddy power betting slip. Then this other one banging on about "these drugs are memetic pshychotics, they reproduce insanity"

You will always have a couple of loons on debates like this. I thought Kenny balanced the argument quite well.

fcussen

I'm aware my comments are a day too late, but I've just watched the man on Frontline reading his sob story from the Paddy Power docket being applauded while the four or five people before him who made their points in a cogent manner were met with wilful misunderstanding and disapproving headshakes, and I have this is the most utterly depressing example I have ever seen of how wrongheaded so many people in this country are.

rovert

Im sure Stuart Clarke's defence of Head Shops has nothing to do with the amount of adverts for them in the publication.

fcussen

Hot Press carries ads for head shops because the magazine is aimed at the same demographic as head shops.

I really doubt the Irish Times/Independent/Examiner would carry head shop ads no matter how much money the shops offered them.

I'm not sure exactly what you're saying. Because he is protecting his financial interests by defending head shops, any points he makes are therefore completely invalid?

rovert

fcussen wrote: »

I'm not sure exactly what you're saying. Because he is protecting his financial interests by defending head shops, any points he makes are therefore completely invalid?

Just questionable, Hot Press ran a big cover story an issue or two back favouring Head Shops and a few pages on there was a half page ad for one.