Production / Live Controllers

ironclaw

Hi Folks,

Been in the market for a while for a controller for Ableton. I've decided to go that route for a number of reasons, chief amoung them it seems the best package on Mac. The problem is I have no clue as to controllers for it. I'm looking for one to produce on (spare time sort of thing) and also to do live loops, effects etc (the main reason). I know there isn't a one size fits all but my short list was along these lines:

M-Audio Trigger Finger - http://www.decks.co.uk/products/maudio/Trigger_Finger

Akai APC40 Ableton Controller - http://www.decks.co.uk/products/akai/APC40

JazzMutant Lemur (Dream Machine :pac: ): http://www.jazzmutant.com/lemur_overview.php


I amn't much of a keyboard user so I'd prefer to keep it in the effect pads / trigger style. I'll be using mainly loops. Budget is around €500 but I'd be willing to buy a few pieces of kit with that. Not much of an idea in production but eager to learn.

Any advice for a production newbie?

ironclaw.

electrogrimey

The Trigger finger and the Akai are popular, so I'd say they'd both be a good bet. How about the NI Maschine? It's along the same lines as the other two.

Jev/N

How about this?

The Shadowdancer lads were using it last night and recommended it -

http://www.novationmusic.com/products/midi_controller/launchpad

electrogrimey

The Vestax VCM-600 was also just released:

ironclaw

Jev/N wrote: »

How about this?

The Shadowdancer lads were using it last night and recommended it -

http://www.novationmusic.com/products/midi_controller/launchpad

I saw that aswell and read the reviews. Seems like a great piece of kit.

A newbie question, but would I be buying one, or more than one controller based on what they did? For instance the Akai APC40 has triggers and faders, while the M-Audio Trigger Finger is more of a control surface (like the LaunchPad)

Anyone give a small bit of guidance on that one?

What I would like to do is buy a small bit of kit, within a €500 ish budget, to get the best feel of live and production.

electrogrimey

For live use, just the launchpad, or the AKAI, or the trigger finger, or a Monome is grand, NT89 was just using a single launchpad last night. I assume you'd route it through the mixer with an external soundcard and use those faders and EQs.

For production, I think you would need a keyboard, it'd just be hassle without one.

Jev/N

For the two of them, they were also using an Evolution UC 33-E.

I suppose it's up to personal preference as to what you want to have - either one big control surface or a couple of smaller ones for use at home and then just one on the road.

As electrogrimey said, production pretty much necessitates a keyboard, preferably a 49 key one

ironclaw

Jev/N wrote: »

For the two of them, they were also using an Evolution UC 33-E.

I suppose it's up to personal preference as to what you want to have - either one big control surface or a couple of smaller ones for use at home and then just one on the road.

As electrogrimey said, production pretty much necessitates a keyboard, preferably a 49 key one

Thanks for the advice folks. So a LaunchPad, a AKAI APC 20, a reasonable soundcard and a keyboard. Would that be a basic set up to last me til I get the hang of things?

electrogrimey

ironclaw wrote: »

Thanks for the advice folks. So a LaunchPad, a AKAI APC 20, a reasonable soundcard and a keyboard. Would that be a basic set up to last me til I get the hang of things?

Depending on the quality of the soundcard and keyboard, that sounds like a fairly professional set-up, you could stick with that for a good while.

ironclaw

So who wants to recommend me a keyboard and soundcard? USB or FireWire is an option.

seannash

ironclaw wrote: »

So who wants to recommend me a keyboard and soundcard? USB or FireWire is an option.

any midi keyboard will do.like you said your not a keyboard player so you wont need the keys to be too precise.

pick up a second hand one.as for soundcard the options are just as vast.get a list together of the ones in your price range

Quiggers

i'd go with a usb2 soundcard, firewire has better specs for through put but
it suffers from chipset issues and to be honest its not on as many computers or macs,
i think its dying out, plus usb3 has just been released, its backward compatible, and extremely fast. also a usb lead is a usb lead, firewire has too many different lead types.
when gigging always try to buy gear that can be put together using "borrowed in a emergency" leads.

m-audio, focusrite, NI, edirol and motu all make great gear, look for one with 4 outputs
and tailor the inputs to suit what you want to record, ie vocals, external synths etc.
if you budget can stretch try get one with adat inputs, this will allow future expasion if needed.

ironclaw

Quiggers wrote: »

i'd go with a usb2 soundcard, firewire has better specs for through put but
it suffers from chipset issues and to be honest its not on as many computers or macs,
i think its dying out, plus usb3 has just been released, its backward compatible, and extremely fast. also a usb lead is a usb lead, firewire has too many different lead types.
when gigging always try to buy gear that can be put together using "borrowed in a emergency" leads.

m-audio, focusrite, NI, edirol and motu all make great gear, look for one with 4 outputs
and tailor the inputs to suit what you want to record, ie vocals, external synths etc.
if you budget can stretch try get one with adat inputs, this will allow future expasion if needed.

Thanks for all the reply's folk. Not much interest or knowledge in soundcards, so can anyone make a recommendation? Want to cover production and VDJ in one, which I presume is possible, 4 outs? Maya44 or similar?

electrogrimey

ironclaw wrote: »

Thanks for all the reply's folk. Not much interest or knowledge in soundcards, so can anyone make a recommendation? Want to cover production and VDJ in one, which I presume is possible, 4 outs? Maya44 or similar?

Be careful that 4 outs generally means 2 stereo outs, so a soundcard with 4 outs is actually a 2 channel soundcard. Ean Golden has 2 good videos on youtube about soundcards.

ironclaw

electrogrimey wrote: »

Be careful that 4 outs generally means 2 stereo outs, so a soundcard with 4 outs is actually a 2 channel soundcard. Ean Golden has 2 good videos on youtube about soundcards.

Thanks again. The most common one I've come across is the Maya44, although this one:

http://www.hercules.com/us/DJ-Music/bdd/p/102/deejay-trim-4-6/

Has started to crop up. Really want to keep the quality up but the cost down, as the rest of the gear is already in the €400 range all in. So €100 is the max I would like to spend.


If it came to it, would the LauchPad and APC20 be equal? i.e. Could I buy one and do without the other?

electrogrimey

ironclaw wrote: »

Thanks again. The most common one I've come across is the Maya44, although this one:

http://www.hercules.com/us/DJ-Music/bdd/p/102/deejay-trim-4-6/

Has started to crop up. Really want to keep the quality up but the cost down, as the rest of the gear is already in the €400 range all in. So €100 is the max I would like to spend.


If it came to it, would the LauchPad and APC20 be equal? i.e. Could I buy one and do without the other?

The NI Audio 2 DJ is the same sound quality as the Audio 8 DJ, but it's only €99, it's cheaper because it's only 2 channel. I have it and it works great, the only reason I'd upgrade is if I wanted 4 channels.

ironclaw

electrogrimey wrote: »

The NI Audio 2 DJ is the same sound quality as the Audio 8 DJ, but it's only €99, it's cheaper because it's only 2 channel. I have it and it works great, the only reason I'd upgrade is if I wanted 4 channels.

Thanks for the heads up on that one. The Hercules is only about €80 more and has a 4 more channels. But then again, I'm only really going to need two outputs