Ireland's Electoral History

nesf

Not quite as bad as the Diet in Japan for one party Government but the image on this page is quite shocking in terms of how little time FG have spent in office: http://electionsireland.org/results/general/index.cfm

dvpower

Also interesting that FG have never been reelected into government.

Liam Byrne

dvpower wrote: »

Also interesting that FG have never been reelected into government.

It seems to me that a lot of the electorate are too greedy / self-interested.

FG seem to balance things better, not splashing out on ego projects (at least, not as much) and keeping an eye on the future, saving some cash when possible.

They don't buy elections with populist bull like "just maturing before the election SSIAs, either). So some voters don't seem to like that.

Before I'm flamed - I'm not saying FG are saints or the dog's b****x - just that they've slightly more cop on and integrity.

trapsagenius

FF get re-elected more often for the simple reason that they do a better job than FG, most of the time.Don't get me wrong, FF have led bad administrations and FG have led at least one good one, but in general FF tend to lead better administrations. History has also shown that FG and Labour are not entirely compatible on a lot of issues, which results in them often not offering a viable alternative when in opposition.Then if they get into power, neither side can give the voters all of what they promised, which tends to piss voters off.FG have also disastrously fvcked things up in the economy and in NI when in power(again, not saying FF haven't done this as well, its just FG have done it with more regularity)

conorhal

It's not surprising given FG's effortless ability to snatch defeat from the Jaws of Victory (Goerge Lee anybody?).
They lack FF's PR skills and have spent so long in opposition that the primary political platform they present to voters has consistantly been "vote for us, we're not Fianna Fail", and all this accomplishes is to make them look as if they are constantly playing catch up rather then presenting themselves as a competent political alternative.Even now after all that's happened there is an increasing element of 'better the devil you know' creeping into the public's psyche as they watch the opposition flounder and fail to offer an alternative path out of the current crisis we face, prefering instead to spout populist rhetoric and play political table tennis in the Dail.

As much as I and many others knock and dislike FF right now, it's fair to say that despite the gross incompetence, mismanagement and waste, after 70 years of FF government Ireland is a reasonably affluent and developed first world country to live in, which isn't bad for a post colonial nation with no real natural resources that had to drag it's self up from its position as a second world agrarian economy in the 1930's. I just can't decide if that's because of, or in spite of FF but I credit EU membership with at least 50% of our good fortune.

Liam Byrne

trapsagenius wrote: »

FG have also disastrously fvcked things up in the economy and in NI when in power(again, not saying FF haven't done this as well, its just FG have done it with more regularity)

???

How have they "done it with more regularity" if - as you say yourself - they're never voted in twice in a row in order to build on any foundations that they have laid ?

Coming in after FF and trying to right the wrongs must be a nightmare!

In my living memory, that's been Haughey, Ahern and now Cowen (Reynolds was decent enough, to be fair, especially when measured by FF standards) so unless you're going waaay back into history, I'd dispute that observation.

And if you are going waaay back, then my apologies. But if we're not even allowed (by some - not saying you) to judge the last 5 years, then we're hardly allowed go back to 1965 or whatever....those people are long gone!

Liam Byrne

conorhal wrote: »

Even now after all that's happened there is an increasing element of 'better the devil you know' creeping into the public's psyche as they watch the opposition flounder and fail to offer an alternative path out of the current crisis we face, prefering instead to spout populist rhetoric and play political table tennis in the Dail.

I haven't seen any evidence of this "better the devil you know", and while you do say that you hate FF, it's strange that you're claiming that the opposition are floundering.

Yes, they're certainly poor, but when compared to the corrupt, incompetent, petty fiasco that is the current Government, they're geniuses.

And they'll certainly do me until we're given a better option again.

trapsagenius

Liam Byrne wrote: »

???

How have they "done it with more regularity" if - as you say yourself - they're never voted in twice in a row in order to build on any foundations that they have laid ?

Coming in after FF and trying to right the wrongs must be a nightmare!

In my living memory, that's been Haughey, Ahern and now Cowen (Reynolds was decent enough, to be fair, especially when measured by FF standards) so unless you're going waaay back into history, I'd dispute that observation.

And if you are going waaay back, then my apologies. But if we're not even allowed (by some - not saying you) to judge the last 5 years, then we're hardly allowed go back to 1965 or whatever....those people are long gone!

I meant they've done it with more regularity when they're in power-they obviously can't be blamed when they're in opposition!

I'll admit that Haughey fvcked the economy up big time in the early 80s-but when Garret Fitzgerald came in he did nothing to deal with the situation-in fact imo he made it worse.Wasn't there something like 15% unemployment when that government left in 1987?Bruton, in the 90s, while he carried on the good work laid down on the economy by Haughey (in the late 80s)and Reynolds, he completely set back the peace process-under his tenure there was the canary wharf bombing and a breakdown in talks.Those were the 2 most recent FG Taoisigh and I don't think either of them did a magnificent job.

In future when we're dealing with a party's history however, I'll try not to go further back than around 1980.

conorhal

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I haven't seen any evidence of this "better the devil you know", and while you do say that you hate FF, it's strange that you're claiming that the opposition are floundering.

I think that the "better the devil you know" element is evident in the disillusionment you see when you read newspaper editorials that are pretty dismissive of Kenny and the opposition in general. Even on this board people realize, when they look at the opposition reaction to the government cuts, that perhaps the opposition might not offer a workable alternative policy.
You yourself called the opposition a piss poor 'better than nothing' alternative to the current government, which is hardly a ringing endorsement, and it's that lack of confidence in the face of a crisis that could well see many voters skulking back into the polling booth and voting for FF after saying 'never again', simply because they are a known quantity, taking a punt on an unproven opposition can seem scary to the rather conservative Irish electorate who see FG and Lab as two parties so ideologically divided that their only common policy it seems, is to remove FF from government and not much else, which could result in a potentially unstable FG/Labor government paralyzed by ideological divisions and unable to agree on any action.

Red_Marauder

I was sitting there drinking a protein shake and started thinking how much Fine Gael are like a protein shake. They keep you strong, you feel better after taking them, and it's better for you in the long run but my God they are boring.

But Fianna Fáil are a Cognac. You associate them with a day at the races, gambling, parties, drink, sex, moral corruption and fun. You might be broke at the end of it all, you might have the hangover from Hell, but often you don't really care.

Fine Gael are what we need. But, unfortunately, it's Fianna Fáil that we seem to want.

rightwingdub

FF and FG are both populist parties who have no ideological beliefs whatsoever, both parties try to offend as few people as possible and try to all things to all people. There are no ideological differences between FF and FG in terms of policy, there are a couple of differences however.

1) FF are more ruthless and streetwise when it comes to winning elections, FG sometimes carry on as if they are a 19th century gentleman's club.
2) FG have not won an election since November 1982 because they pander to Labour all the time, therefore a lot of Irish voters will choose FF over FG because there are no differences.
3) FF are the party in rural Ireland that are seen to get jobs for people through the nod and wink culture that dominates Irish life.

What FG need to do is become a proper centre-right and offend some vested interests instead of trying to appease everyone the whole time, FG should become the party of enterprise, low taxes, the private sector party, law and order and other solid conservative principles. Instead the Dublin liberals in FG always decide to engage in a bit of social democracy which has disillusioned a lot of voters.