Clothing Collection Companies Masquerading as Charities

bugler

I was hoping I could get some clarification on the issue of the many companies that trawl Dublin dropping off leaflets and stickers about their collections of unwanted clothing or miscellaneous goods. I live in Drumcondra and I get several different stickers coming in my letterbox every week asking me for clothes or other goods. Most of these feature images designed to give the impression that this is a charitable enterprise, many include language to that effect, talking of helping those less fortunate and so on. Some feature biblical scripture or images. The reality of course is that most of these collectors are companies, who sell the goods you leave out for their own profit. Usually the stickers feature a company registered number, though they disguise it usually as a “C – Reg No.” so you might confuse it with a charity no.

1. Is it legal for a private company to ask unsolicited for items? There are laws against begging for individuals after all.
2. Is it legal for a private company to be deliberately misleading about its status as a company and not a charity? I’m mainly referring to the “C – Reg” issue mentioned above.
3. In the case of a sticker with no company or charity number at all, is this legal?
4. If any of the behaviour above contravenes any laws, who is it best to contact? The Gardai? Dublin City Council?


I object to their behaviour on moral and ethical grounds, and I also don’t particularly like the thought of these bottom-feeders sniffing around my house during the day. There’s a collection due tomorrow in my area who on their sticker list no company number at all. Is it worth contacting someone over this? Will anyone take action.

Thanks,

Cunsiderthis

bugler wrote: »

1. Is it legal for a private company to ask unsolicited for items? There are laws against begging for individuals after all.
2. Is it legal for a private company to be deliberately misleading about its status as a company and not a charity? I’m mainly referring to the “C – Reg” issue mentioned above.
3. In the case of a sticker with no company or charity number at all, is this legal?
4. If any of the behaviour above contravenes any laws, who is it best to contact? The Gardai? Dublin City Council?


I object to their behaviour on moral and ethical grounds, and I also don’t particularly like the thought of these bottom-feeders sniffing around my house during the day. There’s a collection due tomorrow in my area who on their sticker list no company number at all. Is it worth contacting someone over this? Will anyone take action.

Thanks,

I'm not sure you are right that there are laws against begging any more. there was a court case which seems to have made begging legally untouchable.

Of course its perfectly legal to ask someone else for their unwanted items, "C - reg" is not illegal and, while it might be economical with the truth, no claim is being made that the organisation is a charity. It's also not illegal for an individual to ask you for your unwanted items, and while you may find it distasteful, it's not illegal.

bugler

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054933493&page=4

The above thread is actually on the same matter, and pretty much confirmed my worst suspicions. I really think this is an area that should be monitored more closely. Time to hound the powers that be I suppose!

_JOE_

bugler wrote: »

I was hoping I could get some clarification on the issue of the many companies that trawl Dublin dropping off leaflets and stickers about their collections of unwanted clothing or miscellaneous goods. I live in Drumcondra and I get several different stickers coming in my letterbox every week asking me for clothes or other goods. Most of these feature images designed to give the impression that this is a charitable enterprise, many include language to that effect, talking of helping those less fortunate and so on. Some feature biblical scripture or images. The reality of course is that most of these collectors are companies, who sell the goods you leave out for their own profit. Usually the stickers feature a company registered number, though they disguise it usually as a “C – Reg No.” so you might confuse it with a charity no.

1. Is it legal for a private company to ask unsolicited for items? There are laws against begging for individuals after all.
2. Is it legal for a private company to be deliberately misleading about its status as a company and not a charity? I’m mainly referring to the “C – Reg” issue mentioned above.
3. In the case of a sticker with no company or charity number at all, is this legal?
4. If any of the behaviour above contravenes any laws, who is it best to contact? The Gardai? Dublin City Council?


I object to their behaviour on moral and ethical grounds, and I also don’t particularly like the thought of these bottom-feeders sniffing around my house during the day. There’s a collection due tomorrow in my area who on their sticker list no company number at all. Is it worth contacting someone over this? Will anyone take action.

Thanks,

Most of the clothes is actually sold on to third world countries at a profit...

To answer your question, the area is very badly regulated, and there's basically nothing the authorities can do at the moment...Though note change is on the horizon this year!
The legislation that you are referring to (i think) is the Street and House to House Collections Act 1962, which doesn't deal with the majority of today's charitable solicitation...It was established to regulate door to door charitable collection, and thus didn't contemplate today's solicitation methods such as the internet or even your local chuggers! (who by the way are unregulated at present until the below Part of the Charities Act is enacted!) So don't be fooled by the ID...

But as i said above, you will be glad to hear that s46ss2 of the 2009 Charities Act will be implemented this year and as you will see below deals with the deficiencies in the above legislation...

Whether or not it will be enforced is another question, but it'll be on the statute book in any rate!

46.— (1) A person who holds out a body that is not registered as being registered shall be guilty of an offence.
(2) A body (other than a registered charitable organisation) that, in any notice, advertisement, promotional literature or any other published material, describes itself or its activities in such terms as would cause members of the public to reasonably believe that it is a charitable organisation shall, subject to subsection (6), be guilty of an offence.
(3) A person who holds out a body that is not established under the law of the State as being so established shall be guilty of an offence.
(4) A person who holds out a body whose seat of management or control is outside the State as being a body whose seat of management or control is in the State shall be guilty of an offence.
(5) Without prejudice to the generality of subsections (3) and (4), a body that is publicly described as being an “Irish charity” or a “registered Irish charity” shall be regarded as being held out—
(a) as being registered, and
(b) as being a body—
(i) established under the law of the State, or
(ii) whose seat of management or control is in the State.
(6) It shall be a defence to proceedings for an offence under subsection (2) for the defendant to prove that—
(a) it is established under the law of a place other than the State,
(b) under that law, it is entitled to be described as a charity or charitable organisation,
(c) its centre of management and control is outside the State,
(d) it does not—
(i) occupy any land in the State, or
(ii) carry on any activities in the State,
and
(e) the notice, advertisement, promotional literature or other published material containing the description of which the offence is alleged to consist also contains a statement as to its place of establishment.
(7) A registered charitable organisation shall, in all public documents and such other publications as may be prescribed, including on television or the internet, state in legible characters—
(a) that it is a registered charitable organisation, and
(b) provide such other information as may be prescribed, including the names of the charity trustees and the address of its principal office.
(8) Regulations made for the purposes of subsection (7) may provide—
(a) for the exemption of charitable organisations belonging to a particular class from any of the requirements of the regulations, or
(b) that, in the case of a statement or information that is in a language other than the Irish language or the English language, the statement or information be in the Irish language or the English language or both of those languages.

dermot_sheehan

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2009/en/act/pub/0006/sec0041.html#sec41

dermot_sheehan

gabhain7 wrote: »

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2009/en/act/pub/0006/sec0041.html#sec41

Just noticed it was posted above

time lord

Our local authority stopped a couple of these collections by stating they were collecting "waste" without a waste collection permit.

They confiscated one curtin walled trailer full of clothes after a particular collection.
The practice of confiscation was discontinued. I think their top bosses attitude was "set your sights a little higher lads" It caused a huge manpower issue to offload truck and sort out disposal of items which all had to be bagged etc.

I was not part of the team but the waste enforcement officers legal reasoning was accurate I thought.

johnfás

Previously there was little that could be done as a consequence of the House to House Collections Act 1962 (the applicable legislation) limiting the definition of "collection" to cash collections.

However, the Charities Act 2009 provides for an expansion of this definition to include the collection of non cash items.

As stated above, the Charities Act 2009 will also establish a Charities Regulation Authority, a database of registered charities and an offence to carry on activities either expressly or implicitly with a charitable purpose without being registered with the CRA.

To this date, the CRA has not yet been established. We can expect movement on this in the coming months.

In future fraudulent collections will be liable under two headings, first where they are not a registered charity they will be guilty of an offence for holding themselves out as being; second, they will be liable if collecting without a licence. As stated, to this date there have been no licencing requirements relating to such collections, irrespective of whether they hold themselves out to be charitable (possible to collect without holding oneself out to be charitable). The same situation arises in respect of "Chuggers" - those guys on the street who try to get your bank details for a charity. Until the 2009 Act they were entirel unregulated ast the 1962 Act did not include a promise to donate, which is what they in effect are. One suspects, aside from the benefits of planned giving for cashflow, this was one of the reasons charities often engaged in this practise.

Cunsiderthis

Personally I don't see what's wrong with someone offering to take away your unwanted items and using or selling them on to someone else who needs them.

No one is forced to give them anything, and there is no coercion involved, and I think its enterprising of these guys to do this and make a business out of it and reduce teh dole queues.

Where is the problem?

johnfás

Cunsiderthis wrote: »

Personally I don't see what's wrong with someone offering to take away your unwanted items and using or selling them on to someone else who needs them.

No one is forced to give them anything, and there is no coercion involved, and I think its enterprising of these guys to do this and make a business out of it and reduce teh dole queues.

Where is the problem?

No problem provided:

1. They do not hold themselves out to be a charity - which is a fraud - and now an offence under the Act.

2. That they are properly licensed to collect, as provided for under the Act, which requires the consent of the local Garda superintendent. If not a charity they would also have to comply with the casual trading legislation.

Aside from simply being fraud to pretend that you are something you are not, doing so damages the reputation or properly registered and accountable charities - particularly if their is a controversy arising as a result of such a collection where a proper charity may unwittingly be embroiled. For example, a bogus organisation doing such a collection in favour of "Breast Cancer Research" may end up using abusive behaviour towards a person who then publicises this and blames it on a reputable charity such as Cancer Research. Even if it is subsequently shown that it was not the charity in question, reputational damage can be difficult to repair. This is why we regulate such things.

thebiglad

Cunsiderthis wrote: »

Personally I don't see what's wrong with someone offering to take away your unwanted items and using or selling them on to someone else who needs them.

No one is forced to give them anything, and there is no coercion involved, and I think its enterprising of these guys to do this and make a business out of it and reduce teh dole queues.

Where is the problem?

So long as they only take away that which is left out for them - there is a major suspicion they also take the opportunity to size up properties.

Anything which is unregulated leaves the way open to misuse or use as a cover.

There are clothing collection banks in many locations for the disposal of unwanted garments etc.

_JOE_

Cunsiderthis wrote: »

Personally I don't see what's wrong with someone offering to take away your unwanted items and using or selling them on to someone else who needs them.

No one is forced to give them anything, and there is no coercion involved, and I think its enterprising of these guys to do this and make a business out of it and reduce teh dole queues.

Where is the problem?

Actually, this is common practice in the US...not the door collections, but offering up clothes or cars to your local charity...and you actually get tax back, depending on the value of your donation!