Soundness test adaptor

martineire

Can anyone please tell me what is the name of the adaptor when doing a soundness test and the gas meter is removed there is an adaptor to screw up into the nut on hockey stick so that you can connect the rubber tube off of your manometer to do a soundness when pressurising pipework to 100/150mBar. Any help would be appreciated

items

martineire wrote: »

Can anyone please tell me what is the name of the adaptor when doing a soundness test and the gas meter is removed there is an adaptor to screw up into the nut on hockey stick so that you can connect the rubber tube off of your manometer to do a soundness when pressurising pipework to 100/150mBar. Any help would be appreciated

Their is none avail, not that I know of anyway, threads on hockey stick union nut are strange ones which only match meter union, Gas meter union size is not too regular either. Few years since I've worked with Gas, I salvaged an Old Gas meter and took it apart so I could use part of union to connect to hockey stick then bush it down to 1/2" for testing. You might be out of luck.

martineire

What size bush would i need so that i could reduce down off of the hockey stick union nut so i can connect the ruber hose off of my manometer? The meter connected to the union nut is a G4 meter Thanks

items

Before bushing down you'll need other half of gas meter union, I took other half of meter union off an old meter, bushed down female side (side that threads onto meter). Its not possible to bush down from hockey stick threads, from memory the threads are not BSP (British pipe standard). If you try and bush down from hockey stick you'll ruin threads on hockey stick union nut, seal will be lost when reconnecting meter.

I think your only option is to cut open 3/4 pipe, if you've got some soldering gear you can sweat off the solder 310 which connects house copper to hockey stick. Test from 3/4 pipe then you might have to leave hockey stick off until meter re fit, if you try and solder back on you might not have everything lined up.

martineire

Surely there must be an a simple way of doing it, what are all these gas fitter using every day, They are hardly taking the hockey stick out and then connecting on and testing and then reasembling and soldering it back in or do most gas fitters just test new or altered pipework from the test nipple at the meter and testing the pipework to working pressure 20mBar and not 100mBar what they should be testing to?

Micky Dolenz

martineire wrote: »

Surely there must be an a simple way of doing it, what are all these gas fitter using every day, They are hardly taking the hockey stick out and then connecting on and testing and then reasembling and soldering it back in or do most gas fitters just test new or altered pipework from the test nipple at the meter and testing the pipework to working pressure 20mBar?

Normally on a new installaton, the supply pipe would be capped where it entered meter box and then tested. The hockey stick would only come with the meter and not connected after this test was done.

Are you testing an existing line that had a working meter at one stage?

items

martineire wrote: »

Surely there must be an a simple way of doing it, what are all these gas fitter using every day, They are hardly taking the hockey stick out and then connecting on and testing and then reasembling and soldering it back in or do most gas fitters just test new or altered pipework from the test nipple at the meter and testing the pipework to working pressure 20mBar and not 100mBar what they should be testing to?

Nothing out there apart from Gas meter to connect to other half of union (hockey stick side) as its not really the norm to work off just the hockey stick. Its rare to have gas meter completely removed, normally valve is locked closed, meter stays. Gas fitters etc will use meter test point, the only time gas fitters really work with gas is when meter connected, if no meter is connected then pipe work is tested handy enough by using simple fittings to reduce for U gauge hose.

I'm not sure what your up to, if your not an RGII person then your not in a position to certify gas test soundness, if you happen to be working on an idol gas line best do all you can then leave it up to RGII person to look after testing.

JohnnieK

You can get the test tees at European Energy Skills in Finglas Co. Dublin, have one myself.

Are you an RGI?

Because I think they ask you for RGI number

Is it a new Gas installation you are Testing?

martineire

martineire wrote: »

Surely there must be an a simple way of doing it, what are all these gas fitter using every day, They are hardly taking the hockey stick out and then connecting on and testing and then reasembling and soldering it back in or do most gas fitters just test new or altered pipework from the test nipple at the meter and testing the pipework to working pressure 20mBar and not 100mBar what they should be testing to?

It ain't rocket science, the fact you got to ask Say's a lot.

martineire

I have got the meter adaptor i was after from bes.co.uk Lads when altering pipework on an existing domestic gas installation the meter has to be removed completely for a number of reasons (1) if you did not remove the meter and just closed the ECV and it was letting by and you went to solder in a tee piece for whatever reason you would get a flashback and blow the meter off the wall. (2) When soundness testing altered pipework on natural gas installations the pipework has to be tested to 100mbar reason being flux on soldered fittings can hold a soundness test done to working pressure (20mbar) with the meter in situ if not soldered properly but wont hold 100mbar and you cant pressure to 100mbar off the test nipple on the meter because you could damage the meter for those reasons you have to remove the meter, and there is a lot of john waynes out there that dont soundness test installations properly:eek:

items

Unless their has been a recent change existing gas lines don't require 100mb testing, you might be going a bit over board although their is nothing wrong, test is a test.

Not many will take off a meter, not even sure if your allowed disconnect meter yourself, what if something happens? You drop it and break something, Bord Gas will wrap your knuckles over it.

Most test existing gas lines by using meter gas pressure, opening meter valve allowing gas into pipework then closing meter valve while monitoring meter numbers, once numbers don't go up, pipe is sound. Another is to soapy all joints under gas pressure, no bubbles, pipe is sound.

If your altering gas pipe work without being RGI if something happens later down the line works can be traced back, if works not completed by RGI no insurance policy will cover any damages.

Martineire is right, altered pipework would need to be tested as a new installation.
Martineire you go on about dodgy gas fitters and then do a wright up about regs, wouldn't it have saved a lot of fafing around if you said you were RGII and what you needed it for, most fitters i know, know where to get the fitting from and you coming on asking, to me was like a ice cream man asking where to get his ice cream, it's because of all the dodgyness i don't reply to some posts, Gary.

JohnnieK

martineire wrote: »

When soundness testing altered pipework on natural gas installations the pipework has to be tested to 100mbar reason being flux on soldered fittings can hold a soundness test done to working pressure (20mbar) with the meter in situ if not soldered properly but wont hold 100mbar and you cant pressure to 100mbar off the test nipple on the meter because you could damage the meter for those reasons you have to remove the meter, and there is a lot of john waynes out there that dont soundness test installations properly:eek:

Iv seen fluxed fittings holding on 3bar so I wouldn't take that as gospel. And I agree about the cowboys some of them dont even soundness test on a boiler service.
I serviced a boiler today, 2 year old mynute HE. The lady said that I was a little bit more expensive but she couldn't get the last guy. While I was servicing it she was asking me what was I doing this and that for. I told her this is what a service involves. She then went on to tell me that the other guy done none of this. When I took the analyser out her jaw dropped. The last guy who I will not name (even left his sticker on the boiler) cleaned the outer casing and hoovered the inside of the boiler (not the burner). The CO2 count was 10.5 and should have been 9.8. I asked her how much he charged €70. This ****er is probably living comfortably while the rest of us are scrapping by. I think RGII need to educate customers in what exactly is involved to root out these ****ers. Please excuse the language but it is a tender issue with me. :mad:

I have spent many years as a gasman in the UK blowing joints on gas supplies and the UK test pressure was the standing pressure of the gas, not testing to high pressure had no impact on the safety of the installation as every fitting would be blown properly and checked. i would advise to follow the regs, but i would rely on skill/common sense first and the gauge second, Gary.

items

So whats the craic now, has their been a change meaning a standard meter test is not allowed anymore after altering an existing gas line?

Any changes to gas line means treat as if brand new gas line, test at 95/100 mb?

What happens when its just a cooker or hob installation, do installers have to do same as Martin. The fitting required to test at hockey stick was never readily available during my time with gas thats why I found it odd in way Martin was testing.

What do the regs state on alterations?

Cheers.

The regs states: new pipework, or any pipework that has been modified in it's routing and/or materials and components blah, blah, blah cannot be put back in to service till the specified tests are carried out and successful.

In respect of a hobs/cookers then i would suggest(as with any appliance change) testing the installation before going hands on to prove tings are sound, then disconnecting the hose from bayonet fitting, then afterwords reconnect and test again, you are not modifying installation pipework , if you run a new supply to a appliance then you would be altering the supply and would have to do the big test, for boiler servicing i would suggest whole installation soundness test wouldn't be necessary as the regs look for a test for appliance soundness, which for a boiler is from the test point on the gas valve back to the isolation valve, for the normal test for soundness i would advise getting the most up to date IS813 because the fruitloops who do the regs are so far up there own backside they have ruined the soundness test to the point where i don't know what is their correct procedure anymore, Gary.

Micky Dolenz

gary71 wrote: »

The regs states: new pipework, or any pipework that has been modified in it's routing and/or materials and components blah, blah, blah cannot be put back in to service till the specified tests are carried out and successful.

In respect of a hobs/cookers then i would suggest(as with any appliance change) testing the installation before going hands on to prove tings are sound, then disconnecting the hose from bayonet fitting, then afterwords reconnect and test again, you are not modifying installation pipework , if you run a new supply to a appliance then you would be altering the supply and would have to do the big test, for boiler servicing i would suggest whole installation soundness test wouldn't be necessary as the regs look for a test for appliance soundness, which for a boiler is from the test point on the gas valve back to the isolation valve, for the normal test for soundness i would advise getting the most up to date IS813 because the fruitloops who do the regs are so far up there own backside they have ruined the soundness test to the point where i don't know what is their correct procedure anymore, Gary.

Just to confuse things further, this has changed since RECI took over. Entire system must be tested to operating pressure prior to and after any service/repair of an applaince.

Micky Dolenz

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Just to confuse things further, this has changed since RECI took over. Entire system must be tested to operating pressure prior to and after any service/repair of an applaince.

I wouldn't mind except i took my GID six months ago and i went out and checked the regs in the book i got then.
You know RGII are telling installers on inspection to do the let-by at 10mbar so the meter will lock out and you must blow the pressure in instead of opening the main cock, so you would have to purge afterwords.
It will be interesting when the domestic appliance is on the same supply as a bank of commercial boilers, a commercial kitchen or any specialist gas equipment and you have to confirm there safe before you relight them, also when the twenty year old water heater with a dodgy thermocouple won't relight and you can't get parts, thats why i think it a bad idea, Gary.

martineire

I am a plumber who is currently undertaking my GID course in metac at the moment and the way i explaned is the way we are being taught to soundness test installations. This is the way it has to be done nowadays! There is a lot of lads out there not complying with the way it should be done but the way i explaned is the way it should be tested nowadays.

They were selling soundness test kits at Metec.

martineire

You could be very well right, i have another 2 weeks left so they might be selling them come the end of the course. Our instructor has advised me to get all the gear at bes.co.uk its alot cheaper and they sell almost everything you will need

If the fella who is teaching you is called Tony, he can tell you a good story about a site in Ashbourne that had been passed by Board Gais and over the years had numerous services by different engineers, what nobody noticed was that the boilers which were balanced flue were converted illegally to open flue, taking the air for combustion from a utility which had a extractor in it and no permanent ventilation, long story short this was very naughty and Tony had to turn off the whole site.
When you come out as a RGII you will have to be in a position to identify these things or you could be fecked, it's just a good example of the stupidity of installations here, and without boring you the whole reason for the dangerous installation was the installers drilled the wrong size flue hole and were to lazy to drill it again to get the right flue in, i told them it was dangerous during installation years before, but who is going to listen to the plastic paddy, it was lucky for Tony i remembered the job and it shows you how easy these things are missed, so be careful out there, if it's not Tony teaching you ignore the above:D, Gary.