Roundabouts - where should they be used?

munchkin_utd

just taking inspiration from a Motors thread on the confusion of trying to negotiate Irish roundabouts.

it strikes me that roundabouts in Ireland are used indiscriminately as a solve all for nearly every junction in the country, whether low volume or ultra high volume traffic.

Does the NRA actually have design guidelines as to when roundabouts are absolutely inneffective and another solution, like freeflow or a stopgap like signalled roundabouts, come into play?

It just seems like lunacy to build a roundabout on a heavily trafficed road that needs signals to cope with the traffic.
If you need a signal controlled junction, then WHY don't they build a signal controled junction rather than a signal controlled roundabout?
If you have the place for a massive roundabout, then you can also do a proper junction with plenty of lanes to stack up the traffic going in the various directions on red (eg, 1 lane for left, 2 for straight on, 1 for right etc.) and then on green they can all shoot off without needing to cross each others paths and get in each other way.

Hogzy

What pi***s me off are the roundabouts where people dont yield coming from certain directions. When you pull out then there honking their horn as if they have right of way.

I only wish we had more 4way Stop Sign junctions like they have in the states. They work wonders and people ALWAYS obey them. People in Ireland havnt got a clue how to use them

jd

Hogzy wrote: »

What pi***s me off are the roundabouts where people dont yield coming from certain directions. When you pull out then there honking your horn as if they have right of way.

I'm not sure what you mean here. Traffic already on the roundabout has right of way. Sorry if I misunderstand what you are saying here.

Zoney

Hogzy:

Here in Limerick a number of crossroads on Catherine Street and the grid-layout Georgian Quarter generally (off the main thoroughfares) are stop signs on one street and straight-through on the other. In my experience it's confusing for pedestrians and motorists, and I think if the straight-through street had no priority, it would be even more confusing. As it is people who have priority (the straight through) often stop (in case of lunatics flying through on the other street) and those who do stop at the other street are then unsure whether to go or to let the other person continue again. This is actually worse where people are trying to be polite. And often pedestrians are at the same time trying to cross so it turns into a three or more way guessing game. Lights for pedestrians were recently installed by the People's Park (just off one of these crossroads) and it has made things a lot easier for pedestrians.

Hogzy

jd wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean here. Traffic already on the roundabout has right of way. Sorry if I misunderstand what you are saying here.

Yeah i think you got the wrong idea of what i was saying. I agree with what you are saying tho. What annoys me are the people who dont realise that whoever is on the roundabout first has right of way. Eg in Rochestown in Cork coming off the link road onto a roundabout people just fly straight through thinking they have right of way, You're meant to yield to on coming traffic. So people are forced to stop when they see a car doing 40mph off the slip road to avoid an accident. Basically your options are let the idiot fly past the yield sign to avoid the accident or force him to SLAM on the brakes which may result in an accident and him hooting his horn at you and you LOOKING as if your in the wrong. God it annoys me so much
Im prob explaining that really badly.

Zoney wrote: »

Hogzy:

Here in Limerick a number of crossroads on Catherine Street and the grid-layout Georgian Quarter generally (off the main thoroughfares) are stop signs on one street and straight-through on the other. In my experience it's confusing for pedestrians and motorists, and I think if the straight-through street had no priority, it would be even more confusing. As it is people who have priority (the straight through) often stop (in case of lunatics flying through on the other street) and those who do stop at the other street are then unsure whether to go or to let the other person continue again. This is actually worse where people are trying to be polite. And often pedestrians are at the same time trying to cross so it turns into a three or more way guessing game. Lights for pedestrians were recently installed by the People's Park (just off one of these crossroads) and it has made things a lot easier for pedestrians.

Yeah which is why i said it is annoying that people in ireland dont know how to use them . In the states they are used in quiet suburban areas. Of course they wouldnt work on a large main road. But i have to say there are alot of places in Cork where a 4 way stop junction would be a much better solution to a roundabout or traffic lights.

Its simple enough, say there are 4 cars coming from 4 directions. Which ever car arrives first stops and has right of way to go through first, whoever arrived second goes through after the guy who went first. It would be fairly hard to implement as people in Ireland are TOO courteous which can be dangerous at times and you also have people who dont have a clue. It results in a much more fluid flow of traffic aswell as its almost timed where as some traffic lights may hold up 20 cars only to leave one car go. Very frustrating at night time when lights go red for a minute to leave one car out of a housing estate.

To tackle the pedestrian issue all you have to do is place the crossing away from the junction. I think it is crazy having Ped X-ing's at roundabouts as you are constantly checking your blind spots when coming off the roundabout. Someone has gone into the back of me because of this, Was coming off a roundabout and a person decided to walk out on the X-ing before it was safe to do so. I had to stop, car behind me didnt see me stop till the last minute and bang!

Zoney

Hogzy wrote: »

To tackle the pedestrian issue all you have to do is place the crossing away from the junction. I think it is crazy having Ped X-ing's at roundabouts as you are constantly checking your blind spots when coming off the roundabout. Someone has gone into the back of me because of this, Was coming off a roundabout and a person decided to walk out on the X-ing before it was safe to do so. I had to stop, car behind me didnt see me stop till the last minute and bang!

Well, this is not a problem specific to roundabouts or crossings. People should *always* be driving far enough back to stop in time if the car in front stops. And yet you see morons feet away from the car in front in the inside lane of motorways, doing well over the speed limit and in driving rain!

As for roundabouts - well, just what speed do people need to be doing? And regardless of the speed, they just need to keep a sufficient distance from the car in front - not hard at the low speeds you have on a roundabout (even managing the urban speed limit is still generally speaking a "low speed" that you don't need miles in front to be clear of the car in front).

In summary I do not agree with locating crossings further away. Sure further away people *do* genuinely have cause to be driving faster - at least at exits they are supposed to not have reached normal travel speed yet. People just need to learn to drive properly.

Despite our poor road signage at times, dedicated zebra crossings (and we should have more of them - at most junctions basically) not only have clear road markings, but have advance warning signs, signs at the crossing, belisha beacons *and* flashing amber lights. If people can't behave properly at such road features they shouldn't be on the roads.

Hogzy

Zoney wrote: »

If people can't behave properly at such road features they shouldn't be on the roads.

In a perfect world yeah! But...