Why do African women have big butts?

0verblood

I'm looking for a scientific explanation if soembody can help me out. Is it used as a fat/water store? Or did it come about as a result of sexual selection ie. the men just preferred a nice round bum? I'm in Uganda now and I'm just amazed at how many of the women have "ghetto booty" !

Calibos

Pretty sure its sexual selection. In a continent where there has always been hardship, a 'heavy' wife is a sign of wealth. ie. you can afford to feed her well.

Sexual selection would have kicked in here were it not for fake tan. Before the early 18th century, snow white skin was a sign of wealth because it meant you lived a life of leisure and did not have to work in the fields under the Sun. Hence the fashion of faking it with white makeup. Even the blokes. Then with the advent of international travel(pre air travel) where it was fashionable to do grand tours of Europe, the opposite became true. A tan became the sign of wealth because it showed you could afford to travel to sunnier climes. Cheap air travel and fake tan meant the rich had to show their wealth differently. Hence poncy posh gourmet restaurants charging a fortune and Chelsea wagons(SUV's)

Bodhisopha

Calibos wrote: »

Pretty sure its sexual selection. In a continent where there has always been hardship, a 'heavy' wife is a sign of wealth. ie. you can afford to feed her well.

Sexual selection would have kicked in here were it not for fake tan. Before the early 18th century, snow white skin was a sign of wealth because it meant you lived a life of leisure and did not have to work in the fields under the Sun. Hence the fashion of faking it with white makeup. Even the blokes. Then with the advent of international travel(pre air travel) where it was fashionable to do grand tours of Europe, the opposite became true. A tan became the sign of wealth because it showed you could afford to travel to sunnier climes. Cheap air travel and fake tan meant the rich had to show their wealth differently. Hence poncy posh gourmet restaurants charging a fortune and Chelsea wagons(SUV's)

Excuse me if this is a stupid question. But, if ghetto booty is a product of men favouring a heavy wife, how does nature pick up on this to the point of making it prevalent? How does that work?

GLaDOS

Bodhisopha wrote: »

Excuse me if this is a stupid question. But, if ghetto booty is a product of men favouring a heavy wife, how does nature pick up on this to the point of making it prevalent? How does that work?

Fairly simple natural selection. Lets say there are 2 sets of genes coding for ass shape, one for "normal" and one for "large". If the large one is preferred sexually, it is going to have more chance to pass on it's gene, as men will mate with that woman more often, thus leading to more children with the "large ass" gene. As the gene is getting passed on more, it will become more and more prevalent in the society.

Bodhisopha

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Fairly simple natural selection. Lets say there are 2 sets of genes coding for ass shape, one for "normal" and one for "large". If the large one is preferred sexually, it is going to have more chance to pass on it's gene, as men will mate with that woman more often, thus leading to more children with the "large ass" gene. As the gene is getting passed on more, it will become more and more prevalent in the society.

I guess my question is, how does nature pick up on preferences and trends, what decides "society prefers big asses, so let's go with the big ass gene"?

I can understand there is a design, both genders forms are made to attract the other, but beyond that if society creates it's own preferences, how does nature pick up on this to alter the physical form?

Surely then, every woman in the world should be a stone cold stunner!

taram

Bodhisopha wrote: »

Surely then, every woman in the world should be a stone cold stunner!

We'd bring in more social preferences then, like not attractive man (but rich!) marries attractive woman (who likes money), and of course, humans being what they are will be attracted to people that might not be conventionally attractive, or even attractive to that time period, but could be considered beautiful 200 years later. The genes are still there! Then we have to include drunken one-time sex leading to pregnancy where either or both partners are selecting for 'relatively attractive, into me, let's go' rather than attractivness in their offspring.

Nature will pick up trends for humans in different ways than for other creatures, because we have things like contraception and free will, ie. if I'm "in heat" I won't just allow myself to be mated with :P To make trends visible (like big butts) you'd need a lot a time for it to become apparent, and a localised population. It's bloody tricky though for the reasons in my first paragraph, this is why I study plants not humans

fontanalis

African eh? ISn't there more genetic diversity within Africa than outside it?

Jumpy

Fat storage as well, desert survival. We learned this about the Kalahari Bushmen in school a good while back, their women apparently have large backsides.
The guys are tiny and very fast though, natural selection at its finest, hunters are lean and fast, gatherers are storers.

Capt'n Midnight

taram wrote: »

To make trends visible (like big butts) you'd need a lot a time for it to become apparent, and a localised population.

Depends on the selective pressure. Elephants have generation times similar to ours and in only a few generations they are shedding their tusks in order to survive. Or rather the ones with tusks are less efficient at passing on their genes because they have been poached for ivory.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/180301.stm


On the other hand even when there is no selective pressure random genetic drift can cause some genes to become more popular on the same basis that if you flip lots of coins sooner or later you will get runs where one side predominates for a while.

taram

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Depends on the selective pressure. Elephants have generation times similar to ours and in only a few generations they are shedding their tusks in order to survive. Or rather the ones with tusks are less efficient at passing on their genes because they have been poached for ivory.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/180301.stm


On the other hand even when there is no selective pressure random genetic drift can cause some genes to become more popular on the same basis that if you flip lots of coins sooner or later you will get runs where one side predominates for a while.

Very true, I always forget other animals have long generation times also. We're not that special

Prof.Badass

Africa is quite a warm place. Caucasians and asians have evolved a more even fat distribution because it helped their ancestors keep warm during cold winters. As a result, in african's a higher proportion of the fat is sent to the special fat storing areas, which coupled with the fact that there is less fat in the other areas makes them look bigger.

It's also why it's harder for caucasians and asians to have arms that look as toned as an african's, regardless of how much they build themselves up (unless they're quite skinny).

tony231974

ligertigon

Might also explain why the indigenous males have a long penis:)

I mean, before the missionary people arrived.

ToniTuddle

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Depends on the selective pressure. Elephants have generation times similar to ours and in only a few generations they are shedding their tusks in order to survive. Or rather the ones with tusks are less efficient at passing on their genes because they have been poached for ivory.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/180301.stm

Wow! :eek:

That is really interesting yet also sad

Frei

Not all African women have "big ghetto booty". Africa is very genetically diverse and body shapes vary widely. The difference between one country and another can be huge.
http://scienceblogs.com/geneticfuture/2009/04/massive_study_of_african_genet.php

The Khoisan carry the genetic susceptibility of steatopygia. Saartjie Baartman was a woman of this tribe who was exhibited around Europe becuase of her very large bum and began the obsession and stereotyping of all African women as having large bottoms.

Genetics and environment do play a part in body composition but it is complex and can't be explained in a few sentences.The Masai tribe of Kenya for example, are very tall thin slender people, whereas in the Igbo people of Nigeria people are smaller and heavier set.

Master and commander

0verblood wrote: »

I'm looking for a scientific explanation if soembody can help me out. Is it used as a fat/water store? Or did it come about as a result of sexual selection ie. the men just preferred a nice round bum? I'm in Uganda now and I'm just amazed at how many of the women have "ghetto booty" !

jeez man, they're women, not friggin hump butt camels. But all the same we all know how black men likey bootilicios big bootys.

On a serious not though, there are names for this phenomenon and it is prevalent among certain ethnic african groups such as the Khoikoi from sub saharan africa. There was one woman, sarah baartman, in the 1800 who was brough to europe as a freak show exhibit due to the size of her butt. When she died, the butt, vulva and brain were pickeld and exhibited in a museum. That was the good old days of paternalistic imperialism.

The following links to wikipedia give a good insight into the characteristic, which is called steatopygia, or simply BIG BOOTY to the lay man

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steatopygia,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saartjie_Baartman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoisan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoikhoi

Master and commander

Since its all to do with natural selection where the men folk choose to mate with the larger butted women, it with an improved quality of offspring it woiuld be an interesting experiment if one were to attempt to "breed" the largest butt possible by selective breeding - i wonder what would the maximum possible size for a butt be, bloody great big enormous BOOTY rollin'.

sometimes reading these articles gets you wondering if some ethnic groups/populations should be considered as a separate or sub-species of homo sapiens-sapiens. Indeed, i just read that the Khoisoi have a significantly different genome than the rest of the population. Maybe there 's something in it!