buying a golf

katie2

Hey all. New here!! I am driving a 00 peugeot 206 petrol at the moment. It has 150 thousand miles on it. It needs a new nct and it will cost me a lot of money to get it past the test so I am selling it without nct. I was looking at buying a golf and my brother said the petrol ones give a lot of trouble and i would be better off getting a diesel one. I was looking at about a 02-03 one with nice wheels and some kind of small body kit.
The problem i have is the more i look at ones the more confused i get. All the diesels ones are 1.9 but some are advertised with more horse power than others. Can this be right or are people just making it up?? I would like to know more about them before I go look at any and not look like a fool. I will be getting my brothers friend who is a mechanic to look at any one I am interested in buying but he is really busy and i dont want to drag him around to look at them all so I would like to know a bit about them before I go.
Can anyone give me some tips or advice please

ps Sorry for the long first post!!

colm_mcm

Firstly, the diesels are available in different powers, but diesel engines will usually have more mileage on them than petrols and will be more expensive, There is also more potential for trouble with turbo diesel cars than a simpler petrol.

Added to that you're looking at more road tax and insurance, but this could be offset by savings made on fuel.

Without generalising too much, any diesel Golf with a bodykit will be driven hard by a youngfella.

Maybe consider other options like a Corolla 1.4 (which has 25 odd bhp more than a Golf 1.4) or consider a 1.6 petrol Golf.

What's your budget?
What's your annual mileage?

Eoin

I had a 99 1.4 litre Golf, which I think is the same as the 02/03 model. It was as slow as a wet week on a good day, and nowhere near as bullet proof as the marketing would have you believe. I don't think they are good value for money.

The diesels do come with varying levels of power, which you are supposed to be able to tell by the colouring of the letters on the boot. TDI/TDI, TDI and so on. However lots of owners have bought a different badge from eBay, so you can't rely on that at all. Stay away from the SDI - it's a non-turbo engine and incredibly slow.

dizzydiesel

VW is generally very reliable.

The petrol will be fine unless you are doing high mileage.
The 1.9 TDI does comes with different turbos and mapping.
There is 105, 130bhp, 150bhp....a few more I think depending on age.

kazul

dizzydiesel wrote: »

VW is generally very reliable.

The petrol will be fine unless you are doing high mileage.
The 1.9 TDI does comes with different turbos and mapping.
There is 105, 130bhp, 150bhp....a few more I think depending on age.

Generally not as reliable as most people believe.
The Irish seem to have a fixation with VW and Toyota for some reason.

katie2

Thanks for the info so far! I am doing about 50 mile a day for work now hence i kinda want a diesel. The little peugeot is not able for it. It was grand when I was working closer to home. Is the tax more expencive for the higher horse power diesels or is it the same? I never seen a 150bhp advertised mostly 115 and 130.
I dont want something like a boy racer just nice alloys and a spoiler

Eoin

Tax will be the same regardless of the BHP (it's by engine size for pre-08 cars), but your insurance might change.

dizzydiesel

kazul wrote: »

Generally not as reliable as most people believe.
The Irish seem to have a fixation with VW and Toyota for some reason.

I've got a VW diesel in my Toledo. Almost 200k miles on it. Keep it serviced and oil changed regularly - its amazingly reliable.
Have friends with similar Octavia TDI, and VW Passat. Huge mileage and still running great.
The TDI's are great.

katie2

I was told that 100 thousand on a diesel is like 50 thousand on a petrol..

Tea 1000

katie2 wrote: »

I was told that 100 thousand on a diesel is like 50 thousand on a petrol..

No, not really. That's a tale from years ago. Modern diesels are operating at very high pressures and the fairly low grade diesel we get in this country takes it's toll. Fuel pumps, injectors, EGR valve problems are all a result of that. Petrols are simpler and under much less stress in general.
Having said that, the older VAG diesels were noisy and with a very narrow power band, but were reliable enough. By contrast their petrols of that era were pure shyte.
In 02 or 03 you'll be looking at either a 100bhp or 130bhp. Don't bother with the 150, they were bought to drive hard and will be expensive anyway. The 115 in a 02 is the old pre-PD engines, and I wouldn't bother with that either.
You might be better off finding a nice unmolested 10bhp and adding a small kit yourself. VW gearboxes are poor and won't take the punishment that most young fellas will give them.

kazul

I'm not saying that they're unreliable. Just for some reason the Irish have these 2 particular marques up on a pedestal for some reason.

I'd have a focus over a golf any day of the week, unless we're talking GTi

OP, as with any car, service history is worth a lot.
Also, if you're planning on spending big money, have somebody qualified give your car of choice a once over.
Good Luck

katie2

Just being doing some looking around. i think the pre 02 cars came with 90 and 110 horsepower engines and the newer ones had 100 115 130 and 150 pd engines which I take were a bit better??

katie2

I dont like the shape of the focus..

Fiskar

Go for a PSA 1.6 litre Diesel. It will save you on road tax and insurance especially if you are buying a pre july 2008 car.
The road tax alone on a 1.9 litre car is between 584 to 614 euro per year!
A 1.6 litre would be 445 to 471 € /yr.

PSA diesels are fitted to Ford Focus, Peugeots, Citroens, Mazda 3 and Volvo S40.

better still if you could go for a scrappage deal and get a cheap diesel it will only cost you 104€ /yr road tax as we did recently. Insurance is a lot cheaper on lower CC of engine.

katie2

Ok just to make it clear I want a golf not a focus or a peugeot or any other make. If i cant find one or find out they are crap i will stick to my 206

Fiskar

Just to say the 1.6 litre diesel we bought recently was a Golf !, insurance just 55€ dearer and 104€ road tax. Happy days.

If money is no object and you want a golf the road tax and insurance will set you back at least 500 + € on a pre July 2008. Its your play.

Tea 1000

katie2 wrote: »

Just being doing some looking around. i think the pre 02 cars came with 90 and 110 horsepower engines and the newer ones had 100 115 130 and 150 pd engines which I take were a bit better??

You're right except for the 115, which as I explained above isn't really the new type PD units, it's kind of a temporary engine that they used, probably to get rid of a few old 110 units lying around. The 100 and 130 were the main ones of the PD variety throughout the VAG, with the 150 in the Golf as an option, or it was 163bhp in the Seat Ibiza.

katie2

I have about 8-9 thousand to spend. I have come across a few GTTDI golf. Are these a sports version of the golf or what??

Tea 1000

Fiskar wrote: »

Just to say the 1.6 litre diesel we bought recently was a Golf !, insurance just 55€ dearer and 104€ road tax. Happy days.

If money is no object and you want a golf the road tax and insurance will set you back at least 500 + € on a pre July 2008. Its your play.

But the difference between a brand new Golf and one she's looking for is around €15,000. So you're suggesting she spends an extra €15k to save herself €480 per year? She'll have to keep the Golf 31 years to make the difference worthwhile.

Tea 1000

katie2 wrote: »

I have about 8-9 thousand to spend. I have come across a few GTTDI golf. Are these a sports version of the golf or what??

No. The GTI is the only "sports" version, which was a 1.8 turbo petrol with 150bhp (or 180bhp in the anniversary version), and was about as sporty as a fat man having an asthma attack.
The "GT TDI" was more of a badge special really. Never sold here as a GT TDI, it just offered some of the features of the GTi. Guys selling these are referring to the 130 or 150 versions, the UK dealer probably stuck on the badge when new. You should avoid ones driven by young fellas who use terms like "serious weapon" and "pulls like a train". Some owners are under the illusion that these cars are very quick, and hence drive them flat out all the time.

katie2

Thanks for that. I more than likely buy from a garage

GTE

I have a 1.9 TDI Golf from the year 2000. 160,000 miles. I bought it less then a year ago.

To clear up the power things (well, almost totally clear)
Around the year 2000 the engine in the TDI golfs were known as VE's.
These came in 3 or 4 power outputs.
90 (mine), 110, 130.

In 2002ish a new breed of TDI's were being fitted into Golfs. The PD's.
110ish hp, 115, 150.

The VE's and PD's do seem to overlap so its easy to get confused.
Basically if you look at cars from 2000 to 2003 you are seeing TDI's with around 6 different power outputs.

I may be wrong with the exact powers, in fact I think I may be quite wrong but the point Im trying to make is that they got different power outputs from the same basic 1.9 engine.
What you need to look for is a sticker in the boot under the carpet with the KW rating. KW can be converted to Horsepower.

http://www.convertunits.com/from/kW/to/hp



This is a list of problems I have had with the car in the 9 months I have owned it.

Coolant Temp Sensor. The original sensors are very bad and should be replaced by the uprated green sensor if it hasnt been already.
Problems associated with the sensor include things like, bad but not horrible fuel consumption, bad cold starts, no glow plugs in the morning, irregular idle speeds. This goes for the older VE engines and the newer PD engines. Chances are its been replaced anyway.

Crankcase oil seal needed to be replaced. From research its a very rare problem.

Rear window washer pipe had to be bodged. They tend to pop their joints and soak the car.
Associated with this (if you let it go on and on before realised you have a leak) is that the boot lid electronics will fail. My lock still works but the motor to open the boot is broken so I have to use the key.

The starter motor got stuck on one time. Only one time and I think I caused it by keeping it engaged for rather longer then it should have been.

Drivers side door lock broke. I had to get a kit off ebay to fix it. If you are in anyway DIY inclined its an easy fix, as is the coolant temp fix and the window washer fix. Its a common problem, but since its common there are kits all over ebay. I found one in 5 minutes and it took about 20 mins to fix.

Thats it really. The service history doesnt seem to throw up anything odd and the car runs great.


The timing belt (as I assume in all cars) needs to have been replaced religiously.

On the PD engines (so around the year of car you are looking at) the wrong oil may have been used for the engine. The oil is meant to conform to VW 505.01 standard but some people and mechanics fill it with VW 505.00 which IS NOT suitable for the PD engines.

So, if you can find a car has been serviced by a good dealer that would be a better bet. Id even go as far to call up the dealer it was serviced at most regularly and see what they say when you ask what exact oil they use for servicing.

The reason its a big deal is that the wrong oil can cause engine wear which can start causing problems now. Eventually anyway.


If you can find a good example of a well cared for TDI I think you will have a great car.

If you are looking for a pure workhorse of an engine (so, not so much speed, more a tank factor to the car) Id take a look at the SDI engine. Its slow, it has no turbo but I have seen 200,000 mile and 250, 000 mile SDI's and they are going strong. Less electronic gubbins to go wrong.

I have read about problems with the 115 horsepower PD TDI's about stalling when slowing down. Apparently VW have fixed this with an ECU update, but the problem is meant to be popping back even with the ECU fix.

Manual Gearboxes also are meant to give some trouble on the 110 and 115 horsepower PD's.


Now, thats not to say that these cars are all lemons. There are a lot of these cars around and I rarely hear of a lot of problems with a TDI.

GTE

Tea 1000 wrote: »

You're right except for the 115, which as I explained above isn't really the new type PD units, it's kind of a temporary engine that they used, probably to get rid of a few old 110 units lying around. The 100 and 130 were the main ones of the PD variety throughout the VAG, with the 150 in the Golf as an option, or it was 163bhp in the Seat Ibiza.

You sure?

1.9 litre 4-cylinder 115hp "PD" - again similar to the A4-type engine but with the "pump-nozzle" injection system. Although the peak power is only slightly more than the 110, maximum torque is much higher and the engine has lower exhaust emissions. VW intends to gradually replace the 110hp models with this engine.

From TDI club.

I have never read of a 115 VE TDI. I have only ever seen a 115 PD being talked about.

Below isnt that important for the thread

From a bit of research the PD's (across all VAG's) seem to have come in (but not all sold in all territories)
100, 105, 115, 130, 150, 160

There was even a 90hp one that was put in a Skoda. Allegedly

bazz26

Surely on a budget of €8k or €9k you should be looking at a MkV not a MkIV?

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201005196820092

http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201005196825473

stevenmu

katie2 wrote: »

I have about 8-9 thousand to spend. I have come across a few GTTDI golf. Are these a sports version of the golf or what??

The GT TDI is also an uprated version of the newer 2.0 litre diesel engine which produces 170bhp compared with the standard 140.

Omega28

I have the GT TDI 170 BHP myself, Im young but dont drive it like a mad thing. Its a seriously fast car, and there hard to come by.

I had a good few golfs, mk 4s and mk 5s, petrols and diesels and this has been the best, looking back though for what ur payin for there not worth it, there fairly basic spec in most of the golfs especially in the mk 4, even some of the mk 5s aint great, luckly mine came with sports seats, sat nav etc

I know u ruled out the Focus but it is a great car, or maybe look at a 307 with the 1.6 HDi engine, great car Iv heard.

With 50 miles a day do u really need a diesel? Or just a bigger petrol engine thats economical too

with your budget I def wouldnt be looking at a mk 4 anyway, with some patience you'll pick up a nice mk 5 out there for example:

its a petrol but its a 06, 1.6 FSi, decent spec, mileage is good, full VW serice history, slight over budget but you could easily get this down
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Golf/FSI/201006196838327/advert?channel=CARS

here's a 05 diesel, more expensive, higher mileage, a yr older
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Golf/1.9-TDI-/201005196820092/advert?channel=CARS

here's a 08 307 with a 1.6 HDI engine, nice spec too, mileage is a bit high but your gonna have to expect this with diesel cars, there going to be driven!
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Peugeot/307/1.6-HDI-/201002196553234/advert?channel=CARS
worth havin a look.

In my opinion golfs in general are over priced, pretty poor spec etc unless ur buyin the GTI or GT TDI 170BHP;-), completely different car. BUT if your mind is made up well good luck and I hope u find a nice one
hope this helps

Tea 1000

bbk wrote: »

You sure?


From TDI club.

I have never read of a 115 VE TDI. I have only ever seen a 115 PD being talked about.

Below isnt that important for the thread

From a bit of research the PD's (across all VAG's) seem to have come in (but not all sold in all territories)
100, 105, 115, 130, 150, 160

There was even a 90hp one that was put in a Skoda. Allegedly

The 100 and 130 were the introductory ones across the VAG range, the Passat was the first to get them in 2001. In 2005 the B6 Passat lost the 130 1.9 in place of the 2 litre 140, and the 100 1.9 base model was mildly tuned to 105. Around the same time the A4 base 1.9 was mildly tuned to 115. (both obviously PD)
The early 115 that exists in the 2001/2002 Golfs for a very short time is either a slightly higher tuned 110 old engine or a old 110 modified with the PD injection system, I'm not too sure, I think the former, but either way it was a temporary installment.

antomorro-sei

Fiskar wrote: »

Go for a PSA 1.6 litre Diesel. It will save you on road tax and insurance especially if you are buying a pre july 2008 car.
The road tax alone on a 1.9 litre car is between 584 to 614 euro per year!
A 1.6 litre would be 445 to 471 € /yr.

PSA diesels are fitted to Ford Focus, Peugeots, Citroens, Mazda 3 and Volvo S40.

better still if you could go for a scrappage deal and get a cheap diesel it will only cost you 104€ /yr road tax as we did recently. Insurance is a lot cheaper on lower CC of engine.

Sorry, but eh, whats a PSA Diesel?

GTE

Tea 1000 wrote: »

The 100 and 130 were the introductory ones across the VAG range, the Passat was the first to get them in 2001. In 2005 the B6 Passat lost the 130 1.9 in place of the 2 litre 140, and the 100 1.9 base model was mildly tuned to 105. Around the same time the A4 base 1.9 was mildly tuned to 115. (both obviously PD)
The early 115 that exists in the 2001/2002 Golfs for a very short time is either a slightly higher tuned 110 old engine or a old 110 modified with the PD injection system, I'm not too sure, I think the former, but either way it was a temporary installment.

Interesting stuff.
Id say its the former too. Sure, my 90hp VE can be remapped to 120.
VAG are very funny with all these tunings and maps.

Id say if I had the 1.6 with 90 horse power instead of the 1.9 it would do my insurance a bit of good. Ahh well.

katie2

Thanks again folks. I'm not gone on the newer shape golfs.. They just look very high or something. I dont want to spend too much. If I was to hand over 9000 i would want a car with all the extras like sunroof, alloys, leather, spoiler, full tax and nct etc.. It would be the max i would hand out. I would much rather spend about 5-7 thousand. I have seen two that i like..
1 is a 03 red 5 door 130bhp 6speed with a sports interior 17inch alloys and a spoiler. it has full service history with 90k miles done

2 is a 02 black 3door 115bhp 6speed with leather interior, sun roof, fog lights 18inch alloys and it is lowered. looks spotless and well minded. it has 110k miles with full service history but it was imported from the uk?? dose this make a differance??

Donnelly117

katie2 wrote: »

2 is a 02 black 3door 115bhp 6speed with leather interior, sun roof, fog lights 18inch alloys and it is lowered. looks spotless and well minded. it has 110k miles with full service history but it was imported from the uk?? dose this make a differance??

a lowered golf on 18 inch wheels will have terrible ride quality and the odds are its been rallied, and there could still be VRT to be payed on it if its been imported recently

Leonard Hofstadter

1.4s are ridiculously unreliable, basically they stop working after 100,000 miles. And with only 75 bhp they are bound to be very slow(haven't driven one so can't be sure). The 1.6 is much better as well as obviously having a lot more power, probably the best bet if you want a petrol(or else the 1.8 GTI, those engines are good apart from the coil pack which is nothing major to put right when if it goes). The 2.0 is utterly pointless because the 1.8 has more power and is cheaper to tax as well.

I'd be looking at a TDI tbh, although like all modern diesels it has the dreaded DMF and it sounds very well diesely it is commendably reliable otherwise and there is no complicated common rail injectors or anything like that to worry about, once you don't go for a very high output one(because of the "it's faster than an M5" crowd, these will have been trashed); old school diesels ftw;)!