Irish Rail and bicycles

monument

Green TD, Ciaran Cuffe had a meeting with Irish Rail yesterday, he blogs about it here in full.

Regarding cycling and Irish Rail, he found:

Cycle to Work
230 applications have been made from the 4,500 staff who work for Irish Rail, or 5% of staff

Bikes on intercity trains
Irish Rail says there's space for three on three carriage sets, and six on six-car trains... Does three include the lockers??? On the high cost of bike carriage, they said the space must pay its way as it removes four seats.

Bike booking online
From June apparently

Bike parking at stations
Just improvements underway at Connolly, but no details.

Bikes on suburban trains
Good news: Cuffe says: "Mr. Fearn said he will introduce a pilot scheme on the Maynooth and Drogheda services shortly. I urged him to implement this recommendation on the DART as soon as possible."

I would go further and say that the bicycles on suburban rail (Dart and Commuter, plus future Metro, and Luas as well) was a statement of intent, not just a recommendation. As per the National Cycle Policy (which was part of the renewed programme for government, thus now government policy):

Bicycles and Sub-Urban Rail
We will permit the carriage of bikes on DART and other suburban rail services at off-peak times and on counter peak services at peak hour, following a more detailed study which will recommend suitable devices / facilities for the proper restraining of bikes on the trains. This will include all future Metro plans in Dublin (or anywhere else they may be planned).

Bicycles and LUAS
We will provide for the carriage of bikes on LUAS when services are of a frequency and at a capacity that allows for it. i.e. when it is considered possible to carry bikes on carriages when they do not interfere with the capacity for pedestrians.

It was only on Dublin Bus where pilot was mentioned:

Bicycles on Urban Bus Services
We will support the development of a pilot project for the carriage of bikes on urban bus services comparable to what is currently used on buses in Canada and US

Captain Havoc

I commute daily between Kilkenny and Carlow (Dublin-Waterford line), I can assure you the bicycle racks are not there all the time.

ROK ON

The bike lockers take three bikes and they ate locatedbehind the toilets usually in the 1st class carriage. I have used them from carlow to dublin. They didn't want to let me on but relented on the basis of the weather (it was p1ssing).
Kerry train or particularly mallow to kerry depends entirely on the whim of the guard.
It matters not to them how many bike racks are there, they will always makeit difficult for you to bring a bike on-board. I do not nave experience of any other lines.

blorg

monument wrote: »

Bike booking online
From June apparently

That is my main bugbear. I book online and then have to queue again in the station to buy the fecking bike ticket. I tried once to buy one at my local Dart station in advance but they couldn't do it.

My most recent bike ticket is stamped 17:58... for the 18:00 Dublin-Cork train (thank you to everyone who let me skip the queue.) This involved sprinting from the ticket office (I have learned before that cycling in the station is frowned upon) and vaulting the barriers, with said bike, to get on the train.

Captain Havoc

Instead of getting the train, couldn't you just cycle there? :rolleyes:

Mint Sauce

blorg wrote: »

That is my main bugbear. I book online and then have to queue again in the station to buy the fecking bike ticket. I tried once to buy one at my local Dart station in advance but they couldn't do it.

My most recent bike ticket is stamped 17:58... for the 18:00 Dublin-Cork train (thank you to everyone who let me skip the queue.) This involved sprinting from the ticket office (I have learned before that cycling in the station is frowned upon) and vaulting the barriers, with said bike, to get on the train.

had similar last time took the train from connolly to sligo, had my return ticket for me, queued at desk to get my bike ticket (was unable to buy a return ticket for the bike) only to be told when getting to the front i had to ask the station manager/inspectors permission to bring the bike on, even though it was a intercity car with bike racks on board, and advertised that bikes were allowed, thankfully i was able to retake my place at the front of the queue and then rush towards the gates and the train

was still getting people to move their bags from the bike rack whist the train was pulling out of the station

Chips Lovell

blorg wrote: »

That is my main bugbear. I book online and then have to queue again in the station to buy the fecking bike ticket. I tried once to buy one at my local Dart station in advance but they couldn't do it.

My most recent bike ticket is stamped 17:58... for the 18:00 Dublin-Cork train (thank you to everyone who let me skip the queue.) This involved sprinting from the ticket office (I have learned before that cycling in the station is frowned upon) and vaulting the barriers, with said bike, to get on the train.

I've succeeded in buying a bike ticket in advance. I got one in Connolly station for a train that left from Heuston to Kerry a few days later. However, I was told that having a ticket was no guarantee of getting your bike on the train. If there were already too many bikes on the train, you'd be turned away. Online booking is all well and good, but if this is still the state of affairs, it isn't that much of an improvement. If I book a seat I'm guaranteed it. Why can't it be the same with my bike?

Mint Sauce

el tonto wrote: »

I've succeeded in buying a bike ticket in advance. I got one in Connolly station for a train that left from Heuston to Kerry a few days later. However, I was told that having a ticket was no guarantee of getting your bike on the train. If there were already too many bikes on the train, you'd be turned away. Online booking is all well and good, but if this is still the state of affairs, it isn't that much of an improvement. If I book a seat I'm guaranteed it. Why can't it be the same with my bike?

most services you can reserve a seat, why not a space for your bike

ROK ON

el tonto wrote: »

.... However, I was told that having a ticket was no guarantee of getting your bike on the train. If there were already too many bikes on the train, you'd be turned away. Online booking is all well and good, but if this is still the state of affairs, it isn't that much of an improvement. If I book a seat I'm guaranteed it. Why can't it be the same with my bike?

Very simple. For some reason Irish Rail has taken a massive dislike to having bikes on their trains. My old man works for thw company and he couldny explain it.
The strange thing is, when I started going to kerry regularly (about 15summers ago) the trains used to be jampacked with touring cyclist. You would be hard pressed to find a touring cyclist using our trains now.
I would love ro know what caused this hostility to bikes and from when.

blorg

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Instead of getting the train, couldn't you just cycle there? :rolleyes:

Have done that both ways. Takes about 10 hours from Cork, generally longer from Dublin due to the prevailing wind. When the weather gets better that is indeed what I will be doing.

el tonto wrote: »

I've succeeded in buying a bike ticket in advance. I got one in Connolly station for a train that left from Heuston to Kerry a few days later. However, I was told that having a ticket was no guarantee of getting your bike on the train. If there were already too many bikes on the train, you'd be turned away. Online booking is all well and good, but if this is still the state of affairs, it isn't that much of an improvement. If I book a seat I'm guaranteed it. Why can't it be the same with my bike?

You can buy a ticket in advance for a bike at any "mainline station," I have done this before myself at Connolly on a Thursday for a Friday Heuston train. I tried before in Blackrock DART as that was reachable from work at lunchtime but no luck. In practice there is always plenty of room unless there is a sportive or such on. I think I was told the same at some point but have never been refused travel. The Cork train has a guards van (much smaller than the old ones mind) rather than bike cupboards.

Chips Lovell

I've gone down to Kerry twice this year with the bike, taking about five trains in total, between changing trains and what have you. Once there was a guards van. Every other train had slots for only two bikes.

blorg

ROK ON wrote: »

Very simple. For some reason Irish Rail has taken a massive dislike to having bikes on their trains. My old man works for thw company and he couldny explain it.
The strange thing is, when I started going to kerry regularly (about 15summers ago) the trains used to be jampacked with touring cyclist. You would be hard pressed to find a touring cyclist using our trains now.
I would love ro know what caused this hostility to bikes and from when.

I suspect it is just indifference. There is really no problem bringing a bike from Dublin to Cork (other than having to buy a ticket in person.) I do it regularly and it is hassle free. Cheaper and easier than the bus. But on other routes (Rosslare?) it is impossible.

blorg

el tonto wrote: »

I've gone down to Kerry twice this year with the bike, taking about five trains in total, between changing trains and what have you. Once there was a guards van. Every other train had slots for only two bikes.

Cork always has a guards van. Other services no.

poochiem

In fairness CIE workers are hostile to Bikes in the same way they are hostile to customers, change, the 21st century, questions, complaints, requests, timetables, cleaning, hot water or basic services, clearing ice off the platform, being helpful...its not an anti-bike thing. They're kind of the Father Jack of the transport world.

flickerx

I second that. Irish Rail employeers are generally a disgrace when it comes to generating goodwill. I like travelling by train, but whenever these days I hear about the rail workers engaging in a strike, I hope the workers lose and the strike is broken.

Run_to_da_hills

There is absolutely no need for commuter trains to carry any bicycle into the city center because you can hire a perfectly good bike from JC Decaux :pac:

Captain Havoc

blorg wrote: »

Have done that both ways. Takes about 10 hours from Cork, generally longer from Dublin due to the prevailing wind. When the weather gets better that is indeed what I will be doing.

I was waiting for that

blorg

poochiem wrote: »

In fairness CIE workers are hostile to Bikes in the same way they are hostile to customers, change, the 21st century, questions, complaints, requests, timetables, cleaning, hot water or basic services, clearing ice off the platform, being helpful...its not an anti-bike thing. They're kind of the Father Jack of the transport world.

Haha, I've actually had a few nice ones. Most recently one saw me jumping over the railings with my bike and ran down to the guard's van to open the door for me. Just as well too as the train was pulling off, I think they actually held it (all the other doors had beeped closed.)

penexpers

ROK ON wrote: »

The bike lockers take three bikes and they ate locatedbehind the toilets usually in the 1st class carriage. I have used them from carlow to dublin. They didn't want to let me on but relented on the basis of the weather (it was p1ssing).
Kerry train or particularly mallow to kerry depends entirely on the whim of the guard.
It matters not to them how many bike racks are there, they will always makeit difficult for you to bring a bike on-board. I do not nave experience of any other lines.

The lockers only take one bike. On a six car set, there's two lockers (one at either end of the train) and one rack that can fit two bikes (at the opposite end the first class), so that gives a maximum of four.

penexpers

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I commute daily between Kilkenny and Carlow (Dublin-Waterford line), I can assure you the bicycle racks are not there all the time.

Most (all?) six car sets have the racks now. Some three car sets don't have them.

I've been taking my bike from Newbridge to Heuston on a regular basis for three months now. I have never bought a ticket and no-one bats an eyelid.

L'Enfer du Nord

Wouldn't they be able to fit more bikes is instead of being lenght wise the bikes were suspened at right angles to the carriage. Not sure if I can explain it properly but I mean like this | not this --. That the way it is on SNCF.

serendip

I plan to take my bike on the train to Cork this Saturday, returning a week later. Could someone with experience of this please confirm the following:

1. Show up at Heuston a couple of trains before the one I REALLY NEED to be on (in case the platform is swarming with passengers with bikes).

2. Purchase a month return ticket for me and a ticket (one way) for the bike.

3. Load the bike into the guards wagon at the back of the train (Dublin end).

4. And on the return from Cork, buy another ticket for the bike.

Can I leave panniers on the bike on the train? Or does all baggage have to come off and into the carriage with me?

Is there a better (cheaper?, more reliable?) way of doing this? I note that El Tonto states in an earlier post that he managed to buy ticket for his bike in advance. Is that normally possible?

Is it necessary to lock the bike while on the train?

Any other advice?

Many thanks!

monument

serendip wrote: »

1. Show up at Heuston a couple of trains before the one I REALLY NEED to be on (in case the platform is swarming with passengers with bikes).

I never use it but the Cork train has more room than on other routes.

And, yes, it luggage compartment on the driving car end -- the snazzyer looking, not the locomotive end.

2. Purchase a month return ticket for me and a ticket (one way) for the bike. ...

4. And on the return from Cork, buy another ticket for the bike.

If returning with the bike ou can buy a return bicycle ticket -- it won't save you money but will save queuing and time.

Can I leave panniers on the bike on the train? Or does all baggage have to come off and into the carriage with me?

You should be able to leave them on the bike, but I think its unsecured storage.

07Lapierre

monument wrote: »

I never use it but the Cork train has more room than on other routes.

And, yes, it luggage compartment on the driving car end -- the snazzyer looking, not the locomotive end.



If returning with the bike ou can buy a return bicycle ticket -- it won't save you money but will save queuing and time.




You should be able to leave them on the bike, but I think its unsecured storage.

This is just a thought. (from someone who rarely travels by train, so i'll apologise now )

Why pay to bring your bike on the train? If possible, why not put you bike in a bike bag and carry it onto the train as "hand luggage"? Do Irish rail have a hand luggage policy/limit?

Captain Havoc

07Lapierre wrote: »

This is just a thought. (from someone who rarely travels by train, so i'll apologise now )

Why pay to bring your bike on the train? If possible, why not put you bike in a bike bag and carry it onto the train as "hand luggage"? Do Irish rail have a hand luggage policy/limit?

They can tell you that you're bag is too big yes.

07Lapierre

Captain Havoc wrote: »

They can tell you that you're bag is too big yes.

Getting more like Ryanair every day! :rolleyes:

Blowfish

serendip wrote: »

3. Load the bike into the guards wagon at the back of the train (Dublin end).

That bit depends on the type of train that happens to show up. A lot of the newer ones don't actually have a guard's van, they just have a carraige where 4 seats have been removed and replaced with bike racks. It's quite a nice way to have it, as you can just take the seat beside the racks and leave everything on the bike itself.

ROK ON

I have used a bike bag on Irish Rail many times. Only useful if you have a car at both ends. But I have never been questioned about it getting onto the train.

jimm

serendip wrote: »

I plan to take my bike on the train to Cork this Saturday, returning a week later.

I brought my bike down to Cork last month and returned 10 days later from Killarney. Travelled on off peak trains both trips (booked online) and had no problems with bike. You buy the bike ticket in Heuston, plenty of room in the guards van. On return leg there was no guards van, but a bike rack in one of the carriages which could fit 3 bikes. Had to change trains at Mallow and there was a guards van on this one. You should be ok if return is from Cork. No need to lock bike either.

blorg

I have travelled Dublin-Cork regularly. I generally show up 5-10 minutes before the train is due to leave, frantically queue (sometimes asking to skip) for my bike ticket as you can't buy that online and then dash for the train. I have never had a problem. Dublin-Cork has a guards van so there will never not be room for your bike.

ktz84

As regards the ski type bike storage flat bar bikes and drop bars do not fit well side by side and the situation is made even worse with loaded panniers.

Not a problem yet getting my bike on a train however I've had a few trains try to take off with it still on board. Not the first time I've had to shout at them to stop the train from moving off as the doors were being sealed. Particularly bad at Newry when travelling from Dublin to Belfast as they seem to always be in a hurry to get moving off again. Now that's panic when you think your bike is about to be heading off without you :eek:

Victor

serendip wrote: »

2. Purchase a month return ticket for me and a ticket (one way) for the bike.

It may be substantially cheaper to book on-line.

You could hire a bike: http://www.irishrail.ie/your_journey/bicycle_information.asp

It is planned to have an on-line bike space reservation system.