advise on letter of appeal after refusal of jsa

deemy

Hi. I was hoping someone could help me on where to start with writing a letter of appeal.
I received a letter last week stating that i had been refused jsa after my having a means test back in nov '09. My other half is self employed and according to them he is making too much per week for me to qualify. I havent a clue where they are getting their figures from cause every penny goes back into the business and he is barely holding his head over water as it is.
They based the means test on 2008 figures as they were the only set of audited accounts available. 2009 sales were down by 15% at least plus we had a baby last july so an extra mouth to feed now too.
I really dont get it. The amount he is supposed to have as disposal income or whatever they call it is approx €370 which is less than 2 people on the dole as it is.
I am not looking for handouts and the last thing we want to do is wind up the business as hope things will improve next year or year after. We are just looking for some help until a job turns up for me or until the summer when weather improves and hopefully dps work situation will improve also.
Ive been to citizens advise and we are not intilted to FIS as dp is self employed. She did give me a few a few pointers on what to write in letter but I was hoping someone out their might have been in a simuliar situation and could give me a few pointers on how to word my letter or perhaps know of somewhere online there might be some sort of a template.
Any anvise would be so much appreciated.
Tanx a mill
sorry for the waffle. as ye can see I find it hard to get words to paper without blabbing

mirror mirror

i was in same situation,refused jsa so i appealled it...i got my accountant to do the figures for 09 and also brought letters form bank showing missed mortgage payments,etc .when appeal time came i met with person from appeals board and also the person who called to house to do means test..to cut along story short i got a reduced payment because my wife was still working [less hours]..........go to citizens advice they are very helpful. any paperwork you have to show incomings and especially outgoings bring to appeals hearing.......hopefully you will meet an understanding person and state your case. just wondering how if they are so inflexible now ,how was there people on live register during this BOOM. fu?king astounds me

Balagan

deemy wrote: »

Hi. I was hoping someone could help me on where to start with writing a letter of appeal.
I received a letter last week stating that i had been refused jsa after my having a means test back in nov '09. My other half is self employed and according to them he is making too much per week for me to qualify. I havent a clue where they are getting their figures from cause every penny goes back into the business and he is barely holding his head over water as it is.
They based the means test on 2008 figures as they were the only set of audited accounts available. 2009 sales were down by 15% at least plus we had a baby last july so an extra mouth to feed now too.
I really dont get it. The amount he is supposed to have as disposal income or whatever they call it is approx €370 which is less than 2 people on the dole as it is.
I am not looking for handouts and the last thing we want to do is wind up the business as hope things will improve next year or year after. We are just looking for some help until a job turns up for me or until the summer when weather improves and hopefully dps work situation will improve also.
Ive been to citizens advise and we are not intilted to FIS as dp is self employed. She did give me a few a few pointers on what to write in letter but I was hoping someone out their might have been in a simuliar situation and could give me a few pointers on how to word my letter or perhaps know of somewhere online there might be some sort of a template.
Any anvise would be so much appreciated.
Tanx a mill
sorry for the waffle. as ye can see I find it hard to get words to paper without blabbing

The maximum payment, without any means testing, for your family if both of you were eligible to claim would be €196 + €130.10 + €29.80 (if your baby is your only child) = €355.90.

deemy

tanx guys.
Mirror we still havent paid the accountant for 2008 as havent the money so there isnt a chance he is going to do 2009 unfortunatly. I do the books myself - as in vat returns ect so am hoping that these will do and ya I wonder too how there were people on registar during boom with all the work that was out there and were allowed to carry on signing. I went to citizens advise alright and she was really helpful and gave me a few pointers so am going to have a stab at it now. Said there could be up to a 6month wait:eek: god knows what we are going to do. Just hope i can find work but there is nothing out there. hell most of the business are going out of business. Its so weird to go from going to interviews and always being offered the job to not even being called for an interview. Over qualified it seems. Jesus Ill scub toilet if it means I have a job. disheartning.

balagan I just took it as if it would be 2 x €196. Dp is only 15€ over this yet we dont qualify for medical card, fuel allowance, FIS rent allowance/relief as we have our own house and whatever other benefits there are when on the dole. Just seems to be the system is totally geared to encourage u not to work and live of the state
Think a badger would do a better job at running the country.

deemy

mirror can I ask - maybe u might know as have been down this road. Do u know when they did their 1st means test where did they get the final figure on earnings. Did they take into account all vehicles, insurances, running costs such as phone ect as well as diseal costs ect related to the business into account??
tanx

Balagan

This, from the http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/social-welfare/social-welfare-payments/unemployed-peo
may be helpful:



Income from self-employment and the means test
The earnings from your business will be assessed in the means test for Jobseeker’s Allowance. The assessment must reflect the income you may reasonably be expected to get from your business over the next 12 months. Income for the last 12 months will be taken as a guide but allowing for any factors which it is known will vary. You should be prepared to discuss these factors when you are assessed for Jobseeker’s Allowance.

Earnings are assessed as gross income less work related expenses over 12 months. Your expected annual earnings from self-employment is divided by 52 to find your weekly means from self-employment.

Any ‘drawings’ you take from the business is not an allowable expense. If your ‘drawings’ from the business are greater than the level of income calculated, the ‘drawings’ are assessed as cash income.

There is no exhaustive list of all expenses allowed because expenses vary with the nature and extent of the self-employment. However the following are the main allowable expenses in most cases:

* Materials (supplies costs)
* Motor running costs (portion applicable to business)
* Depreciation of machinery or equipment
* Insurance relating to the business
* Telephone (portion applicable to business)
* Lighting and heating (for business and not domestic use)
* Advertising
* Bank charges
* Stationery
* Van leasing
* Labour costs
* Pension plan
* Any other costs associated with running the business
* Household running costs are not allowed as deductions against business profit
* Class S PRSI contributions (where paid or payable) (Note if payable but not being paid, a separate report should be made by the Social Welfare Investigator on this aspect.)

To prove the level of income from your business you must give your receipts and payments (documentation showing money coming in and out of your business) or audited accounts to the person dealing with your application in your Social Welfare Local Office.

When you apply for Jobseeker’s Allowance (JA)
Usually, you will be asked for your receipts and payments or audited accounts for the current and previous year. For example, if you apply for Jobseeker's Allowance in June 2009 you will be asked for your receipts and payments from January to June 2009 and for 2008. However, in certain cases you may be required to show audited accounts for the last two or more years. Find out more about signing on for a jobseeker’s payment.

You may qualify for Supplementary Welfare Allowance while you are waiting to be assessed for a jobseeker’s payment or if you don’t qualify for a jobseeker’s payment.

deemy

tanx balagan

mirror mirror

deemy wrote: »

mirror can I ask - maybe u might know as have been down this road. Do u know when they did their 1st means test where did they get the final figure on earnings. Did they take into account all vehicles, insurances, running costs such as phone ect as well as diseal costs ect related to the business into account??
tanx

not the first time ,but when i requested a 2nd means test ,all this was taken into a/c.. means test officer said no 2 people in dole office will arrive at the exact same figure when means testing self employed.