cats and dogs brutally killed and eaten in china

Dmighty

I was just sitting down browsing youtube as i do, and i came across some of the most disturbing videos to watch, stray cats and dogs are being killed for there meat and fur in china, chinese people believe the meat improves your brain cells and also improves how you perform in bed. Its the most inhuman thing i have ever seen, they have a large quantity of cats and dogs in tiny cages, they boil cats alive and skin them, they beat dogs with sticks to death or hang them, while people and children walk alone on the streets watching them as if its normal, i dont know how on this earth could this be legal over there or with that in any country, but i think its truly sick. there are alot of videos on youtube and i would not advise you to watch them as there very sickening. Did anyone else hear about this? what are your thought and opinions on this subject??

Hellrazer

I was just sitting down browsing youtube as i do, and i came across some of the most disturbing videos to watch,in Ireland and Europe they shoot terrified cows and pigs with a big metal bar into their skulls and then they use them for food.



I work with a Malaysian bloke and they find the way we do things over here disgusting especially cows which are sacred in his country.Over there dogs are a delicacy and cats are like "cheaper" meat.
Its only because of the way we treat our animals here in the west that you find it disgusting.Personally after working with this lad for a few years now I see both sides of the coin so to speak.

Whispered

I know it's horrific but in all fairness they are farmed animals there, in the same way that pigs & chickens are farmed animals here. Some of the practises here are barbaric and unnecessary too.

ISDW

I love dogs and cats (which is why my house is full of them) but I am a meat eater, so I can't be hypocritical and say that they shouldn't eat cat and dog in other countries and cultures. However, I do object to the way they are killed. If they were killed humanely, then fair enough. Again though, I know that animals aren't always killed humanely here either.

Your point is a very good one Hellrazer, are cows not sacred in India as well, so to them, the way we treat them must seem barbaric.

Hellrazer

Exactly my point.We dont always treat our own animals for food sources the best here either.

It annoys me when someone like the op comes on and bangs on about it without the full facts or tries to ram their opinion down your throat---thats why I approved this thread....I was probably a bit like that until I started work with this Malay bloke.

Whispered

were you replying to me?

Hellrazer

helena.ryan wrote: »

were you replying to me?

Kinda to both of you

davidoco

Dmighty wrote: »

........ stray cats and dogs....

You have been misled on the stray bit. They only eat a certain breed of dog raised specifically for eating.

Whispered

Hellrazer wrote: »

Kinda to both of you

Sorry I just thought it funny you replied before my post was visible. Forgot I was in the welfare bit where you have to premod. Carry on.

star-pants

Yeah I guess it's fairly gross to think of what we would consider a pet being killed and eaten. But to other people pigs and such are pets or other animals are sacred in some countries.

I recall being in Cambodia, and the only thing I felt was safe enough to eat (which will tell you how much I didn't trust some of the meat) was the pork. Yet at 4am most mornings I would have to listen to the most awful squealings of pigs being killed next door.
They eat anything over there, because some of them are so poor they eat whatever they can get their hands on. Dried deer, endangered turtle, assortments of lizards.
I was presented with these over there but I just couldn't bring myself to try them (I don't really like meat anyway) but I just attached too much personality to them.
Some people don't have that luxury.

Whispered

star-pants wrote: »

Yet at 4am most mornings I would have to listen to the most awful squealings of pigs being killed next door.

Oh god, that would have ruined the holiday for me. Absolutely could not cope with that. There was a thing on the F word where pigs were being sent to slaughter. I bawled my eyes out through the whole thing. Actually thinking back, I did the same last year when they were rearing and killing lambs. I suppose I should stop watching the F word?

On the plus side, my OH watched it and told me that after that he couldn't stop thinking about it while eating his brekkie roll in work the next day. We're having a meat free Jan.

star-pants wrote: »

Dried deer, endangered turtle, assortments of lizards.
I was presented with these over there but I just couldn't bring myself to try them (I don't really like meat anyway) but I just attached too much personality to them.
Some people don't have that luxury.

I think if I ate meat I would try less domestic animals like deer (very like cows IMO) and lizards if in a country where it is the norm. But I think like most people I would never be able to extend that to cats and dogs. Like you said, you think of your own pets and give your food personalities.

The point you made on luxury is a very good one. It's all well and good giving out about eating this and that but when it comes to starving or eating meat it becomes a non issue really. Where food is scarce and people are poor they will eat what they have and it wouldn't be right to judge them on that.

Magenta

I agree with the rest of the posters. It is hypocritical of us to judge other countries for eating farmed animals. Most Irish people are more emotionally attached to cats and dogs than we are to cows, which is why we don't generally eat cats and dogs, but that in itself doesn't mean we are right and they are wrong. Hell, rabbits are on both sides of the coin in this country, many people keep them as pets but many people eat them also. Same as horses in France. I'm sure there are countries that would be horrified at that.

The methods of killing could be improved though, to avoid unneccessary suffering.

star-pants

I was actually working Helena so it was just part of every day there for a few weeks.
These people had nothing, but would share anything with you. This was their food, if we were out doing our work they'd run off if they saw a deer or something (wildlife was very scarce, no noises in the forest, very eerie) to kill it.

But even what they cook of the meats shows you that it's only for the need of food rather than killing certain animals. They cook everything of a chicken, feet, neck everything goes in (the sight turned my stomach), lizard still had some skin on, things like that. They don't leave food behind.

Obviously across the world we don't always kill food animals in the best way but that's something that people do try to bring awareness to.

Some countries cull animals as they are over run, and some people don't have issue with this, but kill it to eat it and they will.
In Australia in areas, they aim for certain cane toads when they see them if driving, because they cause such damage to crops.

Amalgam

I don't have a problem with an animal being eaten, any animal, as long as it is dispatched quickly.

Koreans eat medium to large sized dogs and they slaughter them pretty much the same way pork is in this country, an electric shock and then a bolt.

Just to go off topic a bit, but still an emotive subject, not even involving meat. Some african nations and in the far east would get sick at the idea of how we handle and consume 'butter', milk and various cheeses. Different people, different tastes..

ISDW

Sorry, I'm going to come over all female and emotional now:D but I am so impressed with the way people can discuss this, and see both sides of the story. In this forum a lot of us get very emotive about our animals, but its great to see that so many of us are non judgemental about other cultures and what they consider right and wrong.

I love you guys:eek::P:rolleyes:

Magenta

ISDW wrote: »

Sorry, I'm going to come over all female and emotional now:D but I am so impressed with the way people can discuss this, and see both sides of the story. In this forum a lot of us get very emotive about our animals, but its great to see that so many of us are non judgemental about other cultures and what they consider right and wrong.

I love you guys:eek::P:rolleyes:

I think this forum is probably the most emotional on Boards. It's right up there with Personal Issues!!!

Dmighty

Thank you for all of your opinions, you all make a really good point and i agree with what most of you are saying, i'm a lover of all animals and rarely eat meat. I suppose its not right to judge any country as the same happens here with cows and pigs. Just when i saw how brutally and inhumanly they where killed, I was horrified as i have cats and dogs myself and love the bones off them and could never imagine anything like this, maybe its just because we keep them as pets and we are so close to them that it just feels wrong to us.
@davidoco... In one of the videos they said they take stray dogs and cats from china and neighboring countries that are not wanted, they may have got it wrong, maybe they do only breed a certain type of dog and cat for food.

FAYESY

If you saw how animals are killed here its hardly human! Often when slaughtering bullocks the bolt misses - the animal blacks out you thinks it dead - then it wakes up & runs wild in pain & shock through a meat factory & workers run for their lives - the vet has to come & shoot the poor bullock. I would not eat cats or dogs but to other cultures our cows & pigs are considered gross as they are either sacred animals or are considered to be dirty!

Dmighty

I understand and agree with what you are saying, i haven't seen the way pigs and cows are killed over here, but i never would of imagined they where killed so inhumanly. :eek:

In china they say they kill the animals brutally with sticks, bleed them alive or hang them because they taste better when there terrified before being killed. Not only adult dogs and cats but little sweet kittens and puppies, your heart nearly dies inside.:(

I don't judge people, just when animals are involved i feel very sad and shocked to see these things happening. Not just cats and dogs but all animals. If people want to eat them they should kill them fast so there not lying there slowly dieing a painful death.

I know similar things happen like this in other countries including this one but to actually see it happening in reality is very very sickening. :mad:

dhruvd

Very nice DMIGHTY. This is a very important issue to be discussed. I have myself seen how in some countries animals are treated for their meat and fur. It is just completely disgusting. I think there should be a law as to how animals are killed for their meat . And also i think there should be a complete ban on animal Fur.. It is completely Inhumane.
Animals have a life aswell they do feel pain. I consider it as a complete sin to make them suffer before they die.
Thanks again DMIGHTY. This is a very important topic and should be brought under attention to some concerned authorities by the general public/ Society.

Regards

Graces7

Remembering the book of the early years of the Coumban missionaries in China.. One of them had a pet dog which went missing; they found it marked up with red ready for jointing.

And yes, a cultural thing.

In the Orkneys, a great outcry re the local fishermen killing off seals.. and the old folk bewildered because when they were young, they ate selkie to suvive and think nothing of it.

So you ask them would they eat their pet dog....

Poverty does this.

Thankfully most of us will never know that desperation.

Life in China is cheap.. human as well as animals

lbrenn11

I have a really strong opinion on this issue, especially the barbaric skinning alive of dogs and cats just for their fur. It is DISGUSTING and EVIL. I have a real problem when people try to justify the way these animals are put through torture even when it's purpose is for meat. I seen a documentary on the fur trade in china months ago and I still can't get the images of the poor animals out of my head, it really affected me. I would love to see this stop but there is nothing I can do to stop it.

Molberts

Hellrazer wrote: »

Exactly my point.We dont always treat our own animals for food sources the best here either.

This is very true.

My brother is a chef, as part of his training he visited an abattoir to see exactly where the meat he was to cook with was coming from. Two words - bolt gun

He cooks meat and eats it himself but unlike imo the majority of people who consume it mindlessly he has a healthy respect for where it came from.

Yes, I'm a veggie but yes I promise not to go on an anti meat rant :cool:

I just wanted to agree with Hellrazer's original point, I don't think you can think one type of "meat" is ok and not another because the animal is smarter or cuter.

Lauragoesmad

I can understand where most of you are coming from but I don't aggree. Personally I don't think any nation should eat or kill dogs. They are valuable creatures to us as a race. We use them for many things such as companions, sniffer dogs, attack dogs, to find unused land mines, guide dogs, dogs for deaf people, dogs for people in wheelchairs and I'm sure many other things. No other animal on this planet has helped us as a species like dogs have and this is why I believe they should be treated with more respect than other animals.
I dont eat any meat as I am disgusted at how un natural farming has become, all animals should be killed INSTANTLY and more important than their death, their life should be exactly that. A LIFE! Not crammed in a crate or a box for their whole existance. A painful death might last a day and be horriffic but a life of boredom, neglect and cruelty is nearly worse!

Whispered

There are some people who believe pigs to be smarter than dogs.

Intelligence research was done with pigs in the 1990s. One of the experiments was to train the pigs to move the cursor on a video screen with their snouts. When the pigs used the cursors again, they were able to distinguish between the scribbles they already knew, and the scribbles they were seeing for the first time. The pigs learned this skill as fast as the chimpanzees.

Read more at Suite101: The Intelligent Pig: The Smartest Domestic Animal in The World http://mammals.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_intelligent_pig#ixzz0ccOsAmkW

I know dogs can do amazing things and they are at the centre of human development, just like stock animals are in another capacity. But if you are starving, if farming dogs/cats is a way of life in your country then you are as liely to question that as people here are to question how their food is produced. I mean the fact we still have battery farms in "civilised" society is a shame. And it's not just chickens who are farmed in that way either.

Some sows are kept thoughout their pregnancies in narrow sow stalls (see photo, right). Sows kept in stalls are unable to turn around and cannot exercise. The floor they stand or lie on is usually concrete, with slats at the back for waste removal. The sows have to lie down in the same area that they use for the toilet. The sows stay like this for their entire pregnancy - nearly four months. Apart from when they are carrying their first litter, for which they are usually kept in group housing, sows will spend all their pregnancies confined in stalls - this is up to 6 or 7 pregnancies in total. When their productive life is over, they are slaughtered. http://www.ciwf.ie/farminfo/farmfacts_pigs.html

Milking cows are constantly pregnant or lactating, usually with a cycle of 12-16 months AFAIK. Surplus males are usually killed very young for veal.

I know you're not defending farming at all, you said so very clearly and you don't eat meat because of it. But I think it's very important that people try to fix what is wrong closer to home before going off on one about other countries. Yes it's horrific, I don't know anybody who would disagree. But what can we do about it here? Very little, however, if more people eat ethically here (as you do), it could impact the animals we have in this country.

terenc

Different cultures eat different types of animals and you have to respect this.
I love dogs but if I lived in South Korea I would be considered a oddity for keeping dogs has pets and not a food source at some stage of their life.
Koreans will take dogs on long fishing trips and they use them has fresh meat to be cooked during the trip and that is just one way in which they use dog has a food source.

boardgirl

nobody actually seems to have read the origional post? Its the treatment and dispatch of the animals she is concearned about more than anything. Our own slaughter houses arent exactly fantastic but thats beside the point as we are talking about China-not Ireland or Malasia. There is one particular video on youtube that will clear up any doubts you may have about how common these practices are. At the start we see trucks that are stacked high with 2ft by 3ft cages stuffed with cats. They are rammed into these cages with the ones on the underneath often suffocating, pis£ing on each other with fear, passing out with the pain from injuries.A workman begins to unload the back of one truck, standing 15sh ft ontop and throwing the cages down to the ground below..cracking the bones of the terrified cats inside in the process.The camera then moves to an outside yard area where hundreds of pelts are drying out on the ground while a clearly traumatised cat is walking about. A man 'places' a live cat on a large hook under his jaw and proceeds to peel the skin from his body without even a hint of emotion. He then dumps whats left of this creature in a pile. The most desturbing thing about this is that a lot of the little cats have still got their collars on them. They were somebodys beloved pet at one time. An awful lot of pounds accross western Europe sell on their cats and dogs in 'bulk' to chinese companies-this is not a myth its a FACT..please dont watch that video-it cant be unseen and Ive never been so affected by something before. Ive travelled a lot in S.E Asia and dont blame anyone for doing what they need to survive-I have witnessed local villagers in Laos bidding over a cat they found knocked down on a road.I think we all know its not about this.:(

morganafay

ISDW wrote: »

Sorry, I'm going to come over all female and emotional now:D but I am so impressed with the way people can discuss this, and see both sides of the story. In this forum a lot of us get very emotive about our animals, but its great to see that so many of us are non judgemental about other cultures and what they consider right and wrong.

I love you guys:eek::P:rolleyes:

I'm going to ruin it and be all judgemental.

I don't mind that they eat dogs and cats, just the way they are kept and the ways they are killed. But a lot of farmed animals here are treated badly too, and I think that's wrong too.

ISDW

boardgirl wrote: »

nobody actually seems to have read the origional post? Its the treatment and dispatch of the animals she is concearned about more than anything. Our own slaughter houses arent exactly fantastic but thats beside the point as we are talking about China-not Ireland or Malasia. There is one particular video on youtube that will clear up any doubts you may have about how common these practices are. At the start we see trucks that are stacked high with 2ft by 3ft cages stuffed with cats. They are rammed into these cages with the ones on the underneath often suffocating, pis£ing on each other with fear, passing out with the pain from injuries.A workman begins to unload the back of one truck, standing 15sh ft ontop and throwing the cages down to the ground below..cracking the bones of the terrified cats inside in the process.The camera then moves to an outside yard area where hundreds of pelts are drying out on the ground while a clearly traumatised cat is walking about. A man 'places' a live cat on a large hook under his jaw and proceeds to peel the skin from his body without even a hint of emotion. He then dumps whats left of this creature in a pile. The most desturbing thing about this is that a lot of the little cats have still got their collars on them. They were somebodys beloved pet at one time. An awful lot of pounds accross western Europe sell on their cats and dogs in 'bulk' to chinese companies-this is not a myth its a FACT..please dont watch that video-it cant be unseen and Ive never been so affected by something before. Ive travelled a lot in S.E Asia and dont blame anyone for doing what they need to survive-I have witnessed local villagers in Laos bidding over a cat they found knocked down on a road.I think we all know its not about this.:(

You obviously didn't read the replies. I know that I hate the way the animals are kept and killed, and I said that, as did the other posters. We also commented on the fact that a lot of animals in this country are treated very inhumanely as well. As far as i read in this thread, nobody condoned how the animals are killed.

Have you got any evidence on the fact that pound animals are shipped to China? Are they sent dead or alive? Economically it wouldn't make sense to send live dogs that way, when they could be bred or 'rounded up' in S.E. Asia much cheaper.

boardgirl

your right ISDW I should have said 'some' people, Im sorry for that, I just didnt want to see such an important issue as the brutally inhumane treatment of animals in China being hijacked by a debate about wheather or not people should eat cats and dogs. Apologies to anyone I may have offended..:o

Discodog

boardgirl wrote: »

An awful lot of pounds accross western Europe sell on their cats and dogs in 'bulk' to chinese companies-this is not a myth its a FACT..

Well I know for certain that Pounds in Ireland & the UK do not do this. Some European countries do not have Pounds - they don't need them.

So I think that it is reasonable that when you assert/shout that something is a fact, you back it up with some evidence.

As people here know I am no supporter of Pounds.

boardgirl

Italy has imported hundreds of thousands of dog pelts from Romania
according to news reports. (The Guardian [London], Dec. 15, 1994)
In February 2003, Humane Society International investigators working
undercover in Belgium found cat fur openly and easily available in
three shops and wholesale houses in three towns. One seller claimed
cats were being bred on cat farms within Belgium as well as being
“gathered” from “institutes”. A second seller claimed the skins came
from Eastern Europe and a third said it came from China. Sellers could
not disavow that some of the animals killed might be lost pets. In
Belgium, the cat fur on sale is often used as “Rheumadecke” blankets
and other items made of cat fur which dealers claim helps relieve
arthritis and other rheumatic complaints. Three sets of separate
university laboratory microscopic tests indicated that the samples
closely resembled domestic cat fur. The sale of cat fur is not illegal
in Belgium.

THE CAT FUR TRADE
2003 - 2005, S Hartwell
In May 2003, BBC News reported that cats were being farmed for their
skins in the European Union in spite of assertions from EU officials
that there is no cat or dog farming inside the EU. Hundreds of
thousands of cat and dog skins are traded in Europe each year and
since the US banned the trade of cat and dog skin in 2001, the
European market has expanded. A Belgian furrier appeared on video
displaying a fur blanket apparently made from cats farmed in Belgium.
He claimed that stray cats and dogs in the area were rounded up and
skinned. What horrified pet owners was the likelihood of family pets
being rounded up or even stolen for the pet fur trade.
Investigators found significant levels of imports of dog and cat fur
to Germany, Italy and France with China being the main exporter of pet
fur. Other exporters of pet fur include Thailand, Korea and the
Philippines. Scandinavia, Australia and, surprisingly, Britain are
also cited as suppliers of cat fur.

boardgirl

CAT FUR AND CAT THEFT
The tales of cats being stolen for fur are not a recent phenomenon. Back in the 1970s a popular children's book was "The Hunting of Wilberforce Pike" featuring a cat thief stealing pets and strays for their fur. It has long been believed that a cat fur trade exists in Britain, possibly supplying continental markets.
Since 1983, a charity called Petwatch mounted intensive investigations into the problem of vanishing cats. They found that the patterns of disappearances were strongly indicative of organised cat theft. Certain breeds or colours of cats vanish in considerable numbers from small areas in a short time frame. The numbers are such that coincidence can be discounted. For example in Luton, England, 7 cats vanished from a single street in one afternoon while 21 cats vanished from a nearby village and 200 cats vanished over a 3 month period. Theft black spots were areas well lit at night.
Over many years in the UK there have been reports of skinned cat carcasses being found and of cats vanishing "by colour". During the 1990s in Chelmsford, Essex, there were waves of cat disappearances characterised by the fact that the disappearing cats are all one colour. One month black cats have vanish en masse. A few months later most of the tabby cats in one housing development have vanished. They vanished either late at night or very early in the morning when let out to do their business in the garden. In some cases, attempted thefts have been witnessed or thwarted by the owners.
In 1995, cat owners in Clevedon, Somerset, England were advised to keep cats indoors, after around 100 cats, nearly all being black cats, were reported stolen over the previous twelve months. In March 1995, ten disappeared in a single day. It was believed that they were stolen for their pelts, which are sold abroad or passed off as rabbit.
According to a 1985 National Petwatch survey, the British Fur Trade Association use only cat skins from legal sources. The Fur Trade Association had previously stated that cat skins were not used at all. At various times, the Fur Trade Association have previously offered rewards of up to £3000 to anyone who can prove beyond doubt a connection between vanishing cats and the fur trade. Unfortunately, by the time prepared cat skins reach the legitimate fur trade, any identifying material will have been removed, including microchips (under skin) and tattoos (on ears). Modern DNA techniques might identify a pelt as previously being a person's cherished cat provided that the pet's DNA is available (e.g. tissue biopsy).
Some pet lovers might be surprised at what sources are considered legal. Imported farmed fur is one legal source. Other legal sources may include pelts taken from the bodies of pets destroyed at vets, animal shelters and dead animals picked up at the roadside by local cleansing departments. Admittedly rare, it is apparently legal for these to be sold to skin merchants. During the 1980s, a British tabloid newspaper carried reports about UK veterinarians who passed cats and dogs presented for euthanasia to laboratories.
There will always be dealers willing to buy pelts and/or carcasses in tens of thousands (often bales of fur sold by weight) on a 'no questions asked' basis. These pelts will have come from one of the above sources or from stolen cats. According to the reports, cat skins may be processed by London furriers or the carcasses may be sold directly to foreign buyers. Manufacturers abroad admit that the best suppliers of cat pelts are Scandinavia, Australia (as part of feral cat extermination programs) and Britain.
From time to time, quantities of skinned cat bodies or heads and paws have been discovered. During the mid 1980s, I spoke with an Essex policeman who claimed to have found skinned cat bodies in dustbin bags. Veterinary/taxidermy waste is incinerated or, more rarely, rendered. The fact that the carcass is discarded gives a very convincing picture of what is going on.
In 1992, a spokesman for the Fur Education Council (the propaganda arm of the British fur trade) said that there had never been any evidence to suggest that animals were being taken for their fur. In other words, the existence of theft is neither denied or acknowledged, but there is no evidence to link the Fur Trade Association to suspicious disappearances of cats. Any pelts could simply be mixed in with legally obtained pelts and any accompanying documents can be falsified so that pelts from stolen cats are 'laundered' like money among pelts from legal sources.
Even the ongoing problem of missing or stolen cats seems not to be taken seriously in Britain. While major animal rescue organisations claim that vanished cats have simply strayed or killed by traffic, there have been witness reports of attempted cat thefts.
Where disproportionate numbers of certain coloured cats vanish while others do not, it indicates that certain colours are targeted. It is true that black and tabby are common colours and that it is statistically likely that more of these will be reported missing (i.e. simply because there are more of them around). However, it is most unlikely that all the black cats in one small area (a few streets) will go walkabout within 48 hours while all the other coloured cats stay at home. This is stretching coincidence too far.
In a few cases, there have been witnesses. I personally found one case where a Springfield, Chelmsford resident gave chase after an attempt to snatch her cat from her garden. In another case the owner witnessed her tabby cat escaping from a small van. People have been seen enticing cats towards vehicles; in Chelmsford, there were once several reports of youngsters collecting cats and taking them to a white van. Although dismissed as an urban legend, it was taken seriously enough that warning notices were placed on vet and pet shop notice-boards.
In areas where cats are "vanishing by colours" suggests that they were indeed being taken for their pelts. That the fur trade in Europe is thriving and growing causes greater suspicion that the fur from a missing pet's back may now be adorning someone else's back.

boardgirl

An awful lot of pounds accross western Europe sell on their cats and dogs in 'bulk' to chinese companies-this is not a myth its a FACT..

Where have I singled out UK and Ireland? Also bolding the word fact wasn't intended to come accross as shouting, Its intended use was to discourage people from labelling this an urban myth as there is a considerable level of evidence to the contrary. I regret that though as I didnt take the possibility of you taking it up like that into consideration when I posted, sorry.