Deer Shooting restraint

bibio

This e-mail calling on Deer Shooters to refrain from Shooting was sent out

Sent: Wed, 6 January, 2010 16:14:57
Subject: Voluntary Restrain on Stalking

Dear Members,

Please see this comment from your chairman,


The Lenister Branch of the IDS, would like to request its members and all parties with interests in Deer, to engage in a voluntary restrain on recreational stalking of deer in areas which are affected by sever weather conditions. With the current sever weather condition, deer are under undue pressure from the elements and also form shortage of food supply, therefore we would like each member to use their own discretion in the area they hunt and when they see fit, to refrain from stalking deer until the weather conditions improve.

I would like to also take the opportunity to thank you all in advance and to wish you a Happy and safe New Year.

Regards

Ahmed Salman
Chairman Lenister Branch

buckshotbrolan

Now how we going to tell the poacher's about this 'restrain?'

jwshooter

i heard of a chap that bought a new top of the range rifle and scope,he picked it up the week before christmas .there paid for now from selling deer.

the cull may go on in parts ,just have to be more sensible about how its done.

Tackleberry.

jwshooter wrote: »

i heard of a chap that bought a new top of the range rifle and scope,he picked it up the week before christmas .there paid for now from selling deer.

the cull may go on in parts ,just have to be more sensible about how its done.

and whats wrong with selling deer? i have sold a few and would just like to understand your comment better JW.

jingojonson

My Tuppence

Nothing wrong with selling "a couple" of deer or eating them for that matter, but if that becomes ten or twenty and everyone starts then its bye bye deer

Poaching wiped out Salmon in Ireland and they are only now recovering in privately run rivers (ie Ballisodare) where members restrict themselves to a quota.

Might be an idea if a quota system was introduced otherwise ignoramuses will
wipe out the deer

Was out hunting (looking) with a friend in wicklow recently and he commented on how much harder its become to find them over the past couple of years (do the math)

jwshooter

Tackleberry. wrote: »

and whats wrong with selling deer? i have sold a few and would just like to understand your comment better JW.

not to many guys with that amount of deer on there ground.
you would not want to be a rocket scientist to work out the guy is poaching.

Tackleberry.

jwshooter wrote: »

not to many guys with that amount of deer on there ground.
you would not want to be a rocket scientist to work out the guy is poaching.

Okay i understand you now, and would agree fully, that its greed and money that will damage deer numbers in certain aeras of the country. i also happen to shoot East Clare which suffers this scum.

jwshooter

the problem is a new game dealer , they way and pay on the day.
guys leaving in trailers loads of animals ,with little ground .
do the returns on the deer hunting licence add up with the deer sold ?

where do we start the npws or tax man.

jingojonson

Where does that dealer operate, I'd like to get the npws to check him out

Grizzly 45

jingojonson wrote: »

Poaching wiped out Salmon in Ireland and they are only now recovering in privately run rivers (ie Ballisodare) where members restrict themselves to a quota.

Not forgetting every foreign trawler drift netting and harvesting the salmon trying to get back up stream with illegal nets,and being allowed to do so by the EU.Yeah legal poaching an a grand scale all right.:rolleyes:

Might be an idea if a quota system was introduced otherwise ignoramuses will
wipe out the deer

funnily enough ,eveyone else was complaing about the abundance of deer recently and that they were breeding like crazy.What would be better is that people stop trying to shoot every stag they set eyes on that has a halfway decent rack on him,and cull out some does and calves.

corco2000

I believe this now applies to all wild fowl also. IMO it should apply to all game. Be like shooting fish in a barrel. Not much sport in that at the moment. Although Im seeing alot of foxes out at the moment! Good be a good chance to cull them and not game!
And in regards to deer, there is defo guys going around shooting the s**t out of everything they see for €. Trailer loads. And I defo agree that in years to come if this continues they will become scarce. My 2pence worth.

jwshooter

corco2000 wrote: »

I believe this now applies to all wild fowl also. IMO it should apply to all game. Be like shooting fish in a barrel. Not much sport in that at the moment. Although Im seeing alot of foxes out at the moment! Good be a good chance to cull them and not game!
And in regards to deer, there is defo guys going around shooting the s**t out of everything they see for €. Trailer loads. And I defo agree that in years to come if this continues they will become scarce. My 2pence worth.

iv no problem killing lots of deer ,if there yours to cull.

sixpointfive

thats a very good point jw, if a lad has only 150ac of ground with permission for deer and he returns 40 deer to weigh and pay, it doesnt take einstein to work it out, i was up there in late sept/early oct with a sika stag i shot and a lad landed in with a trailer full of fallow bucks of varying size, at least 8 or 9 of them, now, i dont care who you are, unless you are in the phoenix park you wont shoot that many bucks in one day, my guess is it was done with the aid of 1 million candle power,the other thing is i wonder does he fill all that out on his app for next years hunting licence? i doubt most tell the truth on that front. i havent fired at a deer in weeks and dont intend to till well into the month, i still have half a trailer of silage to tipp out on my private ground for them,

DR6.5

A lad i know was in the game dealers <snip> one day last year and a jeep pulled in with a trailer with 21 fallow all head shot and not a drag mark in site all freshly shot again dosnt take a rocket scientest to work out how they were shot.

There is also a game dealer from <snip> buying animals again weigh and pay and no record of the animals hes buying.

Another problem is that there are a lot of lads with lamping licences so if they are stopped with a jeep load of animals they can just say they were lamping farmers x land which they have permission to lamp.

Also if the new dealer is buying animals year round the lampers will be able to shoot all year because they will have a source to get rid of the animals they are shooting.

Sparks

Folks, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, and I'm not saying people here don't have a fairly strong idea of who's doing it, but please don't go posting allegations of poaching against identifiable parties in here. Reporting poaching here only lets people sue Boards.ie for libel, it doesn't fix the problem. If you want to see the poaching stopped, report the poachers to the Gardai and deal with it using the courts.

Pkiernan

Genuine question:

With food being scarce for deer at the moment, wouldn't shooting deer leave more food for the ones that are not shot?

jwshooter

Pkiernan wrote: »

Genuine question:

With food being scarce for deer at the moment, wouldn't shooting deer leave more food for the ones that are not shot?

not in practice , as if the ground is over populated now .culling will push the remaining deer off the feeding grounds .

westwicklow

jwshooter wrote: »

iv no problem killing lots of deer ,if there yours to cull.

Excellent!

What would your view be on deer that are a total nuisnace by eating fodder put out by the farming community for farm animals?

Sometimes I think the deer are actually waiting in the woods for me to feed them! Don't laugh, this is a serious problem at the moment as there's a lot of extra work and extra time and extra expense involved in keeping the farm animals extra well fed against this bad weather.

jwshooter

WW ,
the vast majority of farm animals are in now or close to the home stead.deer are not competing with to many domestic animals.

people love to jump onto the band wagon where deer are concerned.

apart form the extra work thats there any way . i come from a farming back ground and have spent many nites lambing at this time of the year.

you get enormous pleasure from the deer on your ground ,so why not feed them.
or would you like to see them all shot.

natdog

shooting deer for money is totally wrong in my opinion and totally supports commercial poaching.
Butchers should not be allowed to buy wild venison and i think anyone selling venison is only leading to the downfall of the sport through giving it a bad name.
Its a sport\hobby not a buisness

Jonty

natdog wrote: »

shooting deer for money is totally wrong in my opinion and totally supports commercial poaching.
Butchers should not be allowed to buy wild venison and i think anyone selling venison is only leading to the downfall of the sport through giving it a bad name.
Its a sport\hobby not a buisness

Butchers aren't allowed to buy wild venison, unless they have a game dealer's license.

jwshooter

natdog wrote: »

shooting deer for money is totally wrong in my opinion and totally supports commercial poaching.
Butchers should not be allowed to buy wild venison and i think anyone selling venison is only leading to the downfall of the sport through giving it a bad name.
Its a sport\hobby not a buisness

to you its a sport/hobby .

some men are out in all weathers to make the cull each season.

kakashka

natdog wrote: »

shooting deer for money is totally wrong in my opinion and totally supports commercial poaching.
Butchers should not be allowed to buy wild venison and i think anyone selling venison is only leading to the downfall of the sport through giving it a bad name.
Its a sport\hobby not a buisness

Thats all very fine if they are not eating your livelihood,
I shoot a lot of Deer,i have a large area which i shoot mostly alone,i could lease and make real money but i will not/ever(it's still a sport/hobby to me),yes i get paid(a pittance) for most of my carcasses but what would you suggest i do with Deer i shoot??
i can also honestly say that i've never made a penny out of it,and more often than not i'm down,sure you'll get a lump at the end of season but tot all your time,diesel,wear and tare etc up and you have nothing-only ppl making from it are dealers
I would agree that more attention should be paid to returns made on applications as it's not difficult as JWya says for NPWS to figure out who's taking the pi55

deerhunter1

jingojonson wrote: »

My Tuppence

Nothing wrong with selling "a couple" of deer or eating them for that matter, but if that becomes ten or twenty and everyone starts then its bye bye deer

Poaching wiped out Salmon in Ireland and they are only now recovering in privately run rivers (ie Ballisodare) where members restrict themselves to a quota.

Might be an idea if a quota system was introduced otherwise ignoramuses will
wipe out the deer

Was out hunting (looking) with a friend in wicklow recently and he commented on how much harder its become to find them over the past couple of years (do the math)

Tell your local landowner you suggest a quota on deer shooting see how far you get:o

deerhunter1

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Not forgetting every foreign trawler drift netting and harvesting the salmon trying to get back up stream with illegal nets,and being allowed to do so by the EU.Yeah legal poaching an a grand scale all right.:rolleyes:



funnily enough ,eveyone else was complaing about the abundance of deer recently and that they were breeding like crazy.What would be better is that people stop trying to shoot every stag they set eyes on that has a halfway decent rack on him,and cull out some does and calves.

Well said 100% agree

westwicklow

jwshooter wrote: »

WW, you get enormous pleasure from the deer on your ground ,so why not feed them.
or would you like to see them all shot.

I certainly get little pleasure from having them around especially the damn minties and look, having them all shot is not the answer. We all know that.

It angers me especially that I've found some deer (and some sheep...jeez!) carcases lying around and before anyone says they may have run when shot in the "engine room" before bleeding out, some had clean headsots. What's going on there? One particular dog of mine is dead set on retreiving spent cartridges and shells and yesterday returned me a fairly fresh 6.5 round... mine's a .223 and nobody mentioned they were out shooting the land to me!

Ok, there's a plus side, I've hauled home the occasional carcass and minced it up for the dogs..... unlike me, they are fond of deer!!

natdog

kakashka wrote: »

Thats all very fine if they are not eating your livelihood,
point taking but there has to be stricter controls on the sale of vension the point i was making is the sale of deer for profit which im sure you will agree is going on large scale is wrong, you are shooting the deer to protect your land but maybe you could give meat out to friends nad family instead of letting the dealers make a killing just a suggestion im not having a go at you:)
what the going rait for venison?

jwshooter

natdog

you have a very sanitised notion of stalking should be like.

like i have said before ,i have no problem killing or people killing lots of deer as long as there there's in the first place.what they do with them is there own business.
i also see a problem with groups taking a 5 year lease ,shooting the crap out of it and giving it back after 2 years .there coming along and doing the same on new ground the next year.
this is happing a lot in the last 4-6 years its about time the penny dropped with the land owners.

i do agree stricter controls should be enforced in all matters deer related.

natdog

jwshooter wrote: »

natdog

you have a very sanitised notion of stalking should be like.

like i have said before ,i have no problem killing or people killing lots of deer as long as there there's in the first place.what they do with them is there own business.
i also see a problem with groups taking a 5 year lease ,shooting the crap out of it and giving it back after 2 years .there coming along and doing the same on new ground the next year.
this is happing a lot in the last 4-6 years its about time the penny dropped with the land owners.

are you not slightly contradicting yourself jw deer are not vermin anymore and whether there on your land or not a certain amount of conservation should be shown

.243 express

If people take the leases and pay there money,then arent the deer theres to shoot.Coillte havent given out tags with a good few years.I have lettings with the last 10yrs and have never being given a tag nor do i want them.They are promoting this thing of shooting the crap out of woods and then moving on to the next wood on which i dont agree with either.

jwshooter

natdog wrote: »

jwshooter wrote: »

natdog

you have a very sanitised notion of stalking should be like.

like i have said before ,i have no problem killing or people killing lots of deer as long as there there's in the first place.what they do with them is there own business.
i also see a problem with groups taking a 5 year lease ,shooting the crap out of it and giving it back after 2 years .there coming along and doing the same on new ground the next year.
this is happing a lot in the last 4-6 years its about time the penny dropped with the land owners.

are you not slightly contradicting yourself jw deer are not vermin anymore and whether there on your land or not a certain amount of conservation should be shown

if you have a cull figure to meet, every effort should be made to meet it.

with fog and rain from late oct till the snow and ice started 4 weeks ago ,most are way behind.
i was not talking about recreational stalking.

conservation of deer does not happen ,in the recreational stalking circles.
the first animal to pop up gets whacked.

natdog

your talking about cull figures now which is a good thing but earlier you did mention killing as many deer as you want which is not a good thing.
culling is a part of conservation and to say that no conservation goes on in recreational shooting is a bit of a loose statment.
i shoot recreationally and practice conservation in every bit of shooting i do.

jwshooter

natdog wrote: »

your talking about cull figures now which is a good thing but earlier you did mention killing as many deer as you want which is not a good thing.
culling is a part of conservation and to say that no conservation goes on in recreational shooting is a bit of a loose statment.
i shoot recreationally and practice conservation in every bit of shooting i do.

good for you, wish there was more like you