How to get a passport without mother's birth certificate

masherella88

Hope this is the right place to post this.

I was just wondering how you go about this.

My friend is in this situation where she wants to get a passport but cannot get her mother's birth certificate. Her mother won't tell her her what her maiden name is or her age. She also does not know who her father is. She was born in Britain but has been living in Ireland for over ten years. Is there any way she can get a passport? I assume she must be able to somehow. As she is British, does she go to the British Embassy or the Irish Passport office?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

dermot_sheehan

She can get a british passport using her british birth certificate from the british embassy if she was born before the 1st of January 1983. If she was born after that date she needs to prove one of her parents was lawfully settled in the united kingdom when she was born (one of her parents passports or birth certificates if they were born in ireland would show this as irish citizens are automatically regarded as lawfully settled in the united kingdom).

She can get an irish passport if she can get a birth certificate for either parent if they were born in ireland. She can apply for it at the General Register Office, and can go visit the office and carry out a search by name for a particular set of dates.

I consider it bizare that she does not know her mother's maiden name nor the dates of birth of either parents. If she was adopted, her adoption order would be adequate proof of citizenship since she is regarded in law thereafter as the child of her adoptive parents.

masherella88

She's not adopted and she was born in 1990.

It is a very strange situation but it is the one she finds herself in unfortunately. I want to help her to get a passport as without it she cannot travel, and I think that's awful. It is something we have been discussing for a while now. She believes that it is going to be impossible for her to get a passport as she has none of these details but I think there must be something she can do. It's not her fault that she cannot access these details, the only family she has is her mother who will not give her them to her. My friend fears that the only way to get these details will be to take legal action against her mother. However this is an avenue she does not want to go down. It is a very delicate situation but I'm sure there must be some way around it, no?

dermot_sheehan

She wouldn't have a cause of action against her mother since her mother has no obligation to furnish her with such information.

If she knew the date of birth, she could carry out a search at the GRO. Her mother's date of birth would be recorded in many documents that she has access to. For example she could make a data protection request from the department for social welfare for any child benefit her mother received for her and her mother's date of birth would be on the application form.

masherella88

okay so that's how she can find out her date of birth. i'm not sure if she was born in ireland though. i think she is british. how would she go about searching for a british birth certificate?

thank you very much for your help!

watna

masherella88 wrote: »

okay so that's how she can find out her date of birth. i'm not sure if she was born in ireland though. i think she is british. how would she go about searching for a british birth certificate?

thank you very much for your help!

If you think your friend's mother is British, how is he going to get an Irish passport with it? I'm confused.

metrovelvet

Her mothers maiden name should be on her own birthcert. She can then use that and her mothers birthday,also listed on her own birthcert, to obtain a copy of her mothers birthcert. She needs the parents birthcerts for a second dual national passport, not for the nation of which she is already a citizen.

Our man in Havana

From what I can tell this person is stateless for all intents and purposes. Being born in the UK since 1983 is not enough to be a British citizen by birth, at least one parent must be lawfully settled in the UK, as said any Irish citizen is considered as settled in the UK.

A mothers Date of Birth will not be on a child's birth cert, but certainly her maiden name will be. I think the best way forward would be to FOI the Dept of Social Welfare for the child benefit forms. A DPA request will only yield information about the subject and not her mother. A FOI request should get the whole form which will have the details needed, even the place of birth which would make a search much easier.

A search of the GRO here in Ireland and failing that a search of UK records should yield the mothers birth cert.

Foxytocin

My Dad tried to get a passport for a distant cousin of his, she was born in INDIA 70years ago. It was impossible. He really tried.

edited because i get it now!

does your friend have her own birth cert which shows that she was herself born in the UK, if so , then she's not stateless. It's hard to arrange when she's not living in the uk.

my x's mother was born in british guyana, and it was extremely difficult for her to get a passport when guyana got indpendence but she eventually managed it after drafting in help of an local politician (she didn't want a guyanian passport, as she never went there, knew nobody there, whole family had relocated to uk when she was a child, so she thought it would be too odd).

masherella88

Thank you all for your responses!

She doesn't know which country her mother is from, but she is either british or irish-i know this all sounds bizarre but it is the current situation.

She doesn't care what passport-a British or an Irish one, it doesn't matter. Just some form of passport. She doesn't think there is any way for her to get a passport but I don't believe that that can be right. There has to be something she can do. I will inform her of all your suggestions.

She too believes herself to be stateless and I think there must be something that can be done. As I said, it's not her fault that she does not know these things. And it can't be right that she's denied a passport because of her mother's unwillingness to give her the necessary information.

She does have her own birth certificate.

Pardon my ignorance, but what is a FOI request?

Jumpy

masherella88 wrote: »

Thank you all for your responses!

She doesn't know which country her mother is from, but she is either british or irish-i know this all sounds bizarre but it is the current situation.

She doesn't care what passport-a British or an Irish one, it doesn't matter. Just some form of passport. She doesn't think there is any way for her to get a passport but I don't believe that that can be right. There has to be something she can do. I will inform her of all your suggestions.

She too believes herself to be stateless and I think there must be something that can be done. As I said, it's not her fault that she does not know these things. And it can't be right that she's denied a passport because of her mother's unwillingness to give her the necessary information.

She does have her own birth certificate.

Pardon my ignorance, but what is a FOI request?

FOI = Freedom of Information.

Our man in Havana

Foxytocin wrote: »

My Dad tried to get a passport for a distant cousin of his, she was born in INDIA 70years ago. It was impossible. He really tried.

edited because i get it now!

does your friend have her own birth cert which shows that she was herself born in the UK, if so , then she's not stateless. It's hard to arrange when she's not living in the uk.

my x's mother was born in british guyana, and it was extremely difficult for her to get a passport when guyana got indpendence but she eventually managed it after drafting in help of an local politician (she didn't want a guyanian passport, as she never went there, knew nobody there, whole family had relocated to uk when she was a child, so she thought it would be too odd).

Since 1983 merely being born in the UK is not grounds to be a British Citizen.

The UK may grant her a passport as a stateless person if she cannot get citizenship elsewhere. If she cannot get any further with finding info about her mother that option should be considered.

The only other option is getting a UN passport but that will need visas to enter nearly every country.

dermot_sheehan

She would not be stateless as the United Kingdom has signed the european convention on the avoidance of statelessness (schedule 2 of the british nationality act 1981).

To get the parent's birth cert, if they were born in the uk, you need to contact the general register office in either england and wales, scotland or northern ireland.

You can get a british passport with this and the childs birth cert from the british embassy.

Victor

Just in case they go refusing any documentation because it contains your mother's personal information, her name and date of birth are (most likely) public information.

metrovelvet

Bond-007 wrote: »

From what I can tell this person is stateless for all intents and purposes. Being born in the UK since 1983 is not enough to be a British citizen by birth, at least one parent must be lawfully settled in the UK, as said any Irish citizen is considered as settled in the UK.

A mothers Date of Birth will not be on a child's birth cert, but certainly her maiden name will be. I think the best way forward would be to FOI the Dept of Social Welfare for the child benefit forms. A DPA request will only yield information about the subject and not her mother. A FOI request should get the whole form which will have the details needed, even the place of birth which would make a search much easier.

A search of the GRO here in Ireland and failing that a search of UK records should yield the mothers birth cert.

Yes my mistake . On US birthcerts the birthdates and places of parents are declared, as well as the birth hospital. I checked my father's Irish birthcert and just names and address of his parents are listed. My mother was born in a British colony and grew up in England of Irish parentage and is not entitled to UK citizenship.

Our man in Havana

The UK nationality law is very complex. The way it affects the former colonies is the most complex of all.

Surely the person would have some legal grounds to get the information she needs?

one4on

masherella88 wrote: »

Hope this is the right place to post this.

I was just wondering how you go about this.

My friend is in this situation where she wants to get a passport but cannot get her mother's birth certificate. Her mother won't tell her her what her maiden name is or her age. She also does not know who her father is. She was born in Britain but has been living in Ireland for over ten years. Is there any way she can get a passport? I assume she must be able to somehow. As she is British, does she go to the British Embassy or the Irish Passport office?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Is being born on British soil enough to be a citizen?? from what I read on wikipedia, if one or both parents are Irish and are settled in the UK and living there for a year or something then the child born afterwards is a citizen, afaik, a woman who bears a child on uk soils does not automatically gain citizenship.

Seeing as she is 21/22 (born in 1990) is she not legally entitled to get a passport of her own without hindrance. After all it is the right of an Irish citizen. Could she not take her mother to court for the information ?? And wouldn't the mothers maiden name be on the birth certificate of the girl as well?

Our man in Havana

She should be able to get her UK birth cert with what info she has. Once she has this there should be no problem tracking down her mothers details.

I was shocked with how little info you actually need to get a birth cert.

Marcusm

Our man in Havana wrote: »

She should be able to get her UK birth cert with what info she has. Once she has this there should be no problem tracking down her mothers details.

I was shocked with how little info you actually need to get a birth cert.

Birth, death and marriage registers are public documents. THere seems to be little reason why you should not be able to browse them if you want!! Likewise, proven wills.