N4 closed

HydeRoad

The N4 Chapelizod bypass has been closed by Gardai.

I was out at 6am this morning to drive a bus on a short city run. The overnight snow and freeze has left roads in Dublin very dangerous everywhere, but generally not impassable if you are careful and know what you are doing.

Unfortunately, along with the first sunrise of 2010, we have the rise of the living braindeads, driving round in a blind stupor in their cars, with drool running down their lips, and a vacant gaze as they stare blankly out at the surreal world in front of them.

I was half an hour stuck in Inchicore due to these fools. I was heading inbound from the Naas Road. First, we have a line of cars outbound at the canal bridge, all stopped nose to tail on the bridge, spinning wheels, nobody going anywhere. First, don't stop on an incline, and second, if the guy in front does, at least stay well back. No, they all herd like sheep up the bridge, and then sit there gaping at each other, with their feet hard on the accelerator, polishing the road to a nice sheen.

Then we have three cars crashed and abandoned after that, one at right angles to the road. With the outbound queue growing longer (this is 6:30am) and queuing tightly opposite the abandoned cars, no gap left, this leaves precious little room for inbound traffic to squeeze through. Eventually I get past all this, only to encounter a young lady of ethnic persuasion driving along at 1.24 miles per hour. A rolling hazard, and barely rolling at that.

So I creep along well back from her, while she brakes, dithers, changes position, brakes again, and stops at each speed cushion along Tyrconnell Road. Stuck behind her all the way to the lights at Emmet Road, then is she going straight? Is she going right? She doesn't seem to know herself, so we all stop and wait. Then, dammit, she is going straight. I'm going straight, because I don't fancy the hill on Emmet Road, or definitely the hill at Mount Brown. So we creep on.

Then we meet the blue flashing lights of the Gardai at the corner of Inchicore Road and Memorial. We can access the city, but no left turn to the N4. That's grand, but our lady in front decides she is turning back, and proceeds to do a nine point turn in the snow, with a good two or three minutes for reflection between each manoeuvre.

I take a run at the hill on Memorial Road. Cars have been sliding here, but I get the bus up no problem. City Centre grand for driving, but returning west decided to choose the Crumlin Road, which has few inclines, and while very slippy crossing junctions, at least seemed to be clear of most of the living braindead.

Experienced drivers can get around in any conditions. I'd love to know how we can stop these braindeads from piling onto the roads, oblivious to the danger until it is too late, and then blocking up otherwise negotiable roads. There was an ambulance in Inchicore with blue lights flashing, unable to get past the queue of traffic. There really is no need for roads to be blocked like this by ignorant people.

kdouglas

Was stuck on the N4 last night for about two hours when the worst of it happened, trust me, even skilled and experienced drivers were having a hard time.

Unfortunately, there were alot of "braindeads" which were making the road conditions much worse then they needed to be but your wrong if you think experience can get you through everything.

Lack of education is the problem.

faceman

HydeRoad wrote: »

Experienced drivers can get around in any conditions. I'd love to know how we can stop these braindeads from piling onto the roads, oblivious to the danger until it is too late, and then blocking up otherwise negotiable roads.

Training and education. I dont consider them braindead. There is very little training and education in ireland when it comes to snow and icy conditions. The RSA havent had one ad specific to driving in icy or snowy conditions on the radio or tv in December despite the harsh month that it was.

DWCommuter

Commonsense is free and we learn as children that ice is slippery. But for some reason the Irish think their cars are immune to ice.

Absurdum

DWCommuter wrote: »

Commonsense is free and we learn as children that ice is slippery. But for some reason the Irish think their cars are immune to ice.

hey guess what? the exact same thing happens in many other countries too, get over your autophobia

DWCommuter

Absurdum wrote: »

hey guess what? the exact same thing happens in many other countries too, get over your autophobia

Hey guess what? Im certain it happens in other countries. But Im talking about Ireland and its a fact that Irish drivers have a habit of not using caution on icy roads. So get over that opinion you little dictator.

Snake Plisken

So are there any key points people should know when driving in these conditions? I've to go out tomorrow & Sunday as I'm on call for my job (in Dublin area) , will be driving a Ford Transit Connect, I'm an ok driver just don't like these type of conditions

HydeRoad

Leave loads of space all round.

Don't stop on an incline if you can avoid it.

If someone in front of you is stuck on an incline, stay back on the flat, give them a chance to get clear.

Traffic lights are a curse, you get a bit of momentum to clear a junction in one slow, steady roll, and the yellow light appears as you make your decision. Again, too many junctions have a slight rise just at the stopping point, so stay back where it is flat, and try to keep rolling slowly, judging the light sequence, rather than coming to a complete halt.

All that depends on relatively empty roads. No doubt the drooling herds will all pile out in their cars and feck everyone else up, so try to keep away from them!

HydeRoad

faceman wrote: »

Training and education. I dont consider them braindead. There is very little training and education in ireland when it comes to snow and icy conditions. The RSA havent had one ad specific to driving in icy or snowy conditions on the radio or tv in December despite the harsh month that it was.

Ah yes, but these are people who don't bother to educate themselves how to drive properly in normal conditions. The ones who never indicate, have no idea what lights are for, have no idea of road positioning, no judgement of other road users, anything.

If they are that bad in normal conditions, what are they like faced with a bit of real danger, like this morning's snow and ice? Many of them shouldn't be driving cars at all, they have little or no education in basic driving skills. So how do you stop them going out in extreme conditions they don't even have the beginnings of an idea of, and consequently bringing whole roads and areas to a standstill, blocking emergency services and working vehicles?

As an example, a young lad brought his girlfriend up the Wicklow mountains on Christmas Eve for a drive, despite the warnings not to do so. Not only did he get stuck up there, but he burnt out his clutch trying to get back. Wicklow Mountain Rescue had to be called, in two 4x4s, on Christmas Eve when these guys have better things to be doing, than rescuing a bloody idiot like this.

faceman

HydeRoad wrote: »

Ah yes, but these are people who don't bother to educate themselves how to drive properly in normal conditions. The ones who never indicate, have no idea what lights are for, have no idea of road positioning, no judgement of other road users, anything.

If they are that bad in normal conditions, what are they like faced with a bit of real danger, like this morning's snow and ice? Many of them shouldn't be driving cars at all, they have little or no education in basic driving skills. So how do you stop them going out in extreme conditions they don't even have the beginnings of an idea of, and consequently bringing whole roads and areas to a standstill, blocking emergency services and working vehicles?

As an example, a young lad brought his girlfriend up the Wicklow mountains on Christmas Eve for a drive, despite the warnings not to do so. Not only did he get stuck up there, but he burnt out his clutch trying to get back. Wicklow Mountain Rescue had to be called, in two 4x4s, on Christmas Eve when these guys have better things to be doing, than rescuing a bloody idiot like this.

Dont get me wrong, I hate it just as much as you do. Driving along the Alfie Byrne road today in Dublin I witnessed a car overtake 4 cars on the road because they werent driving fast enough for him.

There are 2 types of bad drivers. Those that dont give a toss (like him above) and those that dont have a need a educate themselves nor any mandatory requirement to do so.

You cant completely blame people. The guy who went up the mountains, why werent roads closed? There was very little warning about avoiding the mountains.

Unless people are forced to learn or forced to avoid hazardous situations, people will do stupid things. Giving out about it wont change it. Only by contacting the people who can make a difference, RSA, Gardai, Dept of Trans, can things change.

DWCommuter

faceman wrote: »

There was very little warning about avoiding the mountains.

.

Id have to disagree with you there. Every news bulletin that I listened to clearly stated that the Sally Gap and Wicklow pass were inpassable and that the wicklow mountains were to be avoided.

Of course maybe this horny youngfella was too busy listening to his base bin fuelled music system.:D

But in fairness, I certainly would have avoided the wicklow mountains on the basis of the radio reports and commonsense.

HydeRoad

It was the burning out of the clutch that made me laugh. A sure sign of no driving skill or even basic understanding of the mechanics of his car. Slipping and sliding on ice and snow is one thing, but there were no circumstances where slipping his clutch till it burnt away was necessary. It would be nice, while he sits at home wrapped up in a warm rug with a mug of cocoa waiting for his car to be fixed, if somebody could have a word in his ear about proper driving and proper use of the clutch.

Snake Plisken

driving around today wasn't to bad as long as you took your time, the newcastle lucan road was worst, council never bother their arse to grit it.
Also was on the stilorgan road and this twit boy racer in Golf GTI sped past me in the bus lane, all fine until he hit a load of slush car went all over the place nearly flipped over he slowed down for a while and then off down the bus lane again what an asshole

JHMEG

HydeRoad wrote: »

So I creep along well back from her, while she brakes, dithers, changes position, brakes again, and stops at each speed cushion along Tyrconnell Road..

Then we meet the blue flashing lights of the Gardai at the corner of Inchicore Road and Memorial.

That's grand, but our lady in front decides she is turning back, and proceeds to do a nine point turn in the snow, with a good two or three minutes for reflection between each manoeuvre.

What was this about?

HydeRoad

JHMEG wrote: »

What was this about?

I have no idea! Why do people stop in the middle of a busy road for no apparent reason? Why do people drive at 1.24mph creating an enormous hazard for others? Why do people seem unable to make concise decisions on the move? Why do people only see the ten foot square box in front of their car, and remain totally oblivious to the rest of the world around them?

How can people with such a desperate case of incompetence ever be allowed to drive cars in the first place? In a test situation, the examiner wouldn't even let her leave the car park!

foggy_lad

HydeRoad wrote: »

I have no idea! Why do people stop in the middle of a busy road for no apparent reason? Why do people drive at 1.24mph creating an enormous hazard for others? Why do people seem unable to make concise decisions on the move? Why do people only see the ten foot square box in front of their car, and remain totally oblivious to the rest of the world around them?

How can people with such a desperate case of incompetence ever be allowed to drive cars in the first place? In a test situation, the examiner wouldn't even let her leave the car park!

dublin sounds a dream compared to kildare on new years day and yesterday! if kildare county council were out salting the roads their aim wsa awful as they seemed to miss every road except a short stretch between naas and kilcullen. i wonder if the excellent stretch of recently resurfaced road around charlie mccreeveys house was salted?

kildare county council really let themselves down again but they are not totally to blame for the poor driving conditions as many people should be forbidden from driving(and from ice skating) forever judging from their performances on the roads after a fairly light fall of snow and a relatively mild freeze!

i saw people travelling at less than 5mph making busses and trucks pass them at much higher speeds all because they are suffering from some kind of brain freeze and overly cautious because they are too thick to read the road conditions.

PCPhoto

HydeRoad wrote: »

Ah yes, but these are people who don't bother to educate themselves how to drive properly in normal conditions. The ones who never indicate, have no idea what lights are for, have no idea of road positioning, no judgement of other road users, anything.

If they are that bad in normal conditions, what are they like faced with a bit of real danger, like this morning's snow and ice? Many of them shouldn't be driving cars at all, they have little or no education in basic driving skills. So how do you stop them going out in extreme conditions they don't even have the beginnings of an idea of, and consequently bringing whole roads and areas to a standstill, blocking emergency services and working vehicles?

As an example, a young lad brought his girlfriend up the Wicklow mountains on Christmas Eve for a drive, despite the warnings not to do so. Not only did he get stuck up there, but he burnt out his clutch trying to get back. Wicklow Mountain Rescue had to be called, in two 4x4s, on Christmas Eve when these guys have better things to be doing, than rescuing a bloody idiot like this.

common sense is lacking amongst a lot of irish drivers and some of those that actually have common sense seem to come across as arrogant and think they know how to drive and how everyone else should drive (I fall into this category - would consider myself a good driver but in reality I'm prob an average driver who is frustrated by the "mistakes" of other drivers)

Anyway ...the solution to idiot drivers who don't listen to news reports and/or are too damn ignorant to use common sense (its not rocket science - if conditions are bad don't goto an area where it will be really dangerous to drive)

.... anyway..the solution - once they are rescued...make them pay for the bill for their rescue (I dont know if this is the case or not - but it could mean that people will learn that if you dont use common sense you pay the price for a rescue)

HydeRoad

PCPhoto wrote: »

common sense is lacking amongst a lot of irish drivers and some of those that actually have common sense seem to come across as arrogant and think they know how to drive and how everyone else should drive

Well I'm generally an easy going guy, but I make no excuses for being quite forward when it comes to driving standards. If I am driving Dublin to Cork, Dublin to Limerick, Dublin to Galway, or a weekend crisscrossing Galway, Connemara and Clare, I might put in 300 or 400 kms a day, and eight or nine hours of driving.

In such case, one offending motorist in a Micra won't make the slightest difference to my day. But forty or sixty or eighty of them bloody well will, and I can lose an hour or more, which becomes critical when I am on a tachograph.

I have the advantage of hundreds of thousands of miles under me, in all kinds of vehicles, big and small, here and abroad, in all weathers. Very few people will ever have the opportunity or need to do a tenth of that in their lifetimes. I do not begin to expect others to have the kind of experience I have.

But I DO expect that other drivers make a bloody effort to educate themselves. There are far too many drivers, some even evident posting here, with an attitude that they can do as they please, and to hell with everyone else. That is simply not good enough.

If you make a mistake, that's grand. Hopefully you'll learn from it. I make mistakes too, hundreds over thousands of miles of driving. But if you simply cannot be bothered making an effort, well that's another thing. I have only to take one look at you on the road to know the difference.

Here's the smiley...

foggy_lad

.... anyway..the solution - once they are rescued...make them pay for the bill for their rescue (I dont know if this is the case or not - but it could mean that people will learn that if you dont use common sense you pay the price for a rescue)

Afaik this is already done in many countries in europe and north america you will pay for your rescue anyway.