Has Miguel Cotto Ever Been Beaten By A Clean Fighter?

bustertherat

Just saying..........:rolleyes:

magma69

Stupid post. Just saying :rolleyes:

x PyRo

bustertherat wrote: »

Just saying..........:rolleyes:

Yes... Manny Pacquiao.

MrStuffins

Whats wrong with Antonio Margarito?

The whole hand wrap thing? Because that had nothing to do with the beating he put on Cotto!

makl

MrStuffins wrote: »

Whats wrong with Antonio Margarito?

The whole hand wrap thing? Because that had nothing to do with the beating he put on Cotto!

thats debatable.

joepenguin

makl wrote: »

thats debatable.

So is Manny using enhancers, and mosely nowadays, is he or isnt he? drugs in sport is a complex issue and even if they do random testing year around you could question if they tests pick up the masking agents to fool the tests etc.

They should however have tests in place for all world title fights, both on the night and randomly throughout camp. At least this way fighters would really have to go out of their way to cheat and would wipe out unfair advantages on undercards etc.

makl

Manny was never caught taking enhancers.

Margarito was caught with paris pads in his gloves 6 months after Cotto fight.

It's not proof he had them in with Cotto, but very very suspicious. There's no similar grounds for Manny.



p.s. i dont think bustertherat is referrin to drugs but the gloves situ.

good article on the difference between cotto's face after manny fight and margarito fight @ http://www.boxingnews24.com/2009/11/pacquiao-vs-cotto-same-as-margarito-cotto/

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

Whats wrong with Antonio Margarito?

The whole hand wrap thing? Because that had nothing to do with the beating he put on Cotto!

Dont be ridiculous. It had everything to do with it.

walshb

To me this is simple: IF Manny in the future tests positive for PEDs, then yes, his previous wins are open to questioning.

With Marg, this happened. He was caught out vs. Mosley, hence, his win over Cotto is suspect. It may well be that all was above board, but the question mark remains.

Same with any athlete found to be cheating, their previous performances will
naturally be queried, and who can blame anyone for querying?

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

Dont be ridiculous. It had everything to do with it.

Say bitter Cotto supporters!

Bodhisopha

Manny "pacman" Pacquiaooooo

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

Say bitter Cotto supporters!

Well there is a first time for everything. The dude had plaster in his wraps.

Bodhisopha

Poor old Cotto. Such a class act. I hope he can come back and eventually win some more big fights. I'd love for him to make it into the HOF.

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

Well there is a first time for everything. The dude had plaster in his wraps.

During the Cotto fight?

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

During the Cotto fight?

The biggest fight of his career. Yes.

walshb

Proof?

T-K-O

Woof!

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

The biggest fight of his career. Yes.

Am i wrong in thinking you're getting Miguel Cotto confused with Shane Mosely?

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

Am i wrong in thinking you're getting Miguel Cotto confused with Shane Mosely?

You think Mosley was a bigger fight than Cotto ?

T-K-O

Oh and yes to answer your question.

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

Oh and yes to answer your question.

Antonio Margarito was never caught with plaster paris in his hand wraps before, during or immediately after the Cotto fight.

It was however alleged in relation to the Shane Mosely fight.

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

Antonio Margarito was never caught with plaster paris in his hand wraps before, during or immediately after the Cotto fight.

It was however alleged in relation to the Shane Mosely fight.

Why is Margarito currently serving a ban ?

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

Why is Margarito currently serving a ban ?

As i said

T-K-O

MrStuffins wrote: »

As i said

Dont believe everything you read on wiki.

My point is that Margarito obviously fancied himself a sculptor and common sense would tell us that he would have tried the same for the biggest fight of his career.

MrStuffins

T-K-O wrote: »

Dont believe everything you read on wiki.

My point is that Margarito obviously fancied himself a sculptor and common sense would tell us that he would have tried the same for the biggest fight of his career.

Your idea of "common sense" is not the same as proof i'm afraid!

T-K-O

Well some people choose to live with their head in sand. Is Margarito was tampering with the gloves for a fight manny thought was a gimme he sure as hell did it for the biggest fight in his career.

ODD-JOB

What surprised me most in the Cotto - Pacq fight was Manny's ability to walk thru Cottos power punches . And boy did Cotto hit him too.

I dont think any steroid can build you a chin .

Is that right ?

T-K-O

ODD-JOB wrote: »

What surprised me most in the Cotto - Pacq fight was Manny's ability to walk thru Cottos power punches . And boy did Cotto hit him too.

I dont think any steroid can build you a chin .

Is that right ?

I would agree, steroids will not prevent you from getting KOed.

walshb

ODD-JOB wrote: »

What surprised me most in the Cotto - Pacq fight was Manny's ability to walk thru Cottos power punches . And boy did Cotto hit him too.

I dont think any steroid can build you a chin .

Is that right ?

Ah, but it's not all just chin you know. Strength and power and ability to shake the affects also play a part. Drugs could aid you here, and every little bit of help, helps!

BTW, I believe Manny is clean.

T-K-O

I dont believe any drug could prevent you bell from being rang.

walshb

No, but chin and ability to take a shot do not begin and end with the chin alone.

Age (maturity), weight, stamina are three important factors to consider.
Now, these won't see a weak chinned man suddenly become steel chinned.
But, they can aid a fighter to a degree.

I won't go into the details, but I am sure you can draw your own
inclusions

Drugs can improve ones recovery rate, enabling better sessions, improving
stamina......link is there.

T-K-O

It's not as if the Pacman developed sick skills over night.

He demolished Ricky Hatton, Ricky was clearly outta his league. He beat up an old Dela Hoya and to my surprise he beat the **** outta Cotto. Some people are acting like he just did the impossible, it's not that unbelievable when you break it down.

MrStuffins

Hang on, all this rubbish talk is annoying me.

Where has it ever been said that Paq was juicing?He's never failed a test and this Mayweather business is ridiculous.

The man is a true champion, it's sad that a man can't be at the top of a game without accusations of cheating!

walshb

MrStuffins wrote: »

The man is a true champion, it's sad that a man can't be at the top of a game without accusations of cheating!

It's not sad, it's reality. All top sports stars will be queried. Simple as that. Money and big money, lure drugs to sport.

Like I said, I think he is clean, like I think Usain Bolt is, but there will always be suspicious people. I would be damn foolish to bet my house on it though, as history has told us that many greats were on the juice

ragg

The roumer is only out cos mayweather sr ran his mouth in an interview.

Pac has the best of the best looking after him Alex Ariza is the best S&C coach in boxing and people seem to forget the pac was underweight for most of his career. its not like he's been packing on muscle overnight, he is going up in small increments each time.

His speed comes from his coaching and training, not from his weight

T-K-O

This is how I see it.


Pac is being a dick for not being tested.
Floyd, equally so for moving the goal post in order for him to man up.

walshb

Alex Ariza has links to BALCO by the way, another sussy issue

ragg

walshb wrote: »

Alex Ariza has links to BALCO by the way, another sussy issue

“I didn’t really do any interviews before this because I didn’t feel it warranted it. But I’ve seen stories like Lou DiBella said that members of Team Pacquiao have a history of steroid use? Show me. Where’s his paperwork that leads to BALCO? I’ve worked with Diego Corrales, Erik Morales, Angel Manfredy. None of those guys has ever even tested for a diaretic, cold medication, antibiotics, nothing. I don’t give any of my fighters that would be considered illegal or a performance enhancing drug. I don’t know where people are coming up that I’m linked to BALCO. I’ve never been associated or questioned about anything.” said an irritated Ariza.

:rolleyes:

ragg

T-K-O wrote: »

This is how I see it.


Pac is being a dick for not being tested.
Floyd, equally so for moving the goal post in order for him to man up.

Drawing blood from a fighter a couple of days before a fight isn't right - He could maybe allow them test his Hepatitis sample - but it would still mean drawing twice the amount of blood - have you ever had a blood sample taken and then hit the gym the next day or two?? Its no fun

T-K-O

ragg wrote: »

Drawing blood from a fighter a couple of days before a fight isn't right - He could maybe allow them test his Hepatitis sample - but it would still mean drawing twice the amount of blood - have you ever had a blood sample taken and then hit the gym the next day or two?? Its no fun

Compromise....

slipss

bustertherat wrote: »

Just saying..........:rolleyes:

It would be just as valid to start a thread asking if Miguel Cotto has ever been clean for one of his fights? He's only had the same testing Pac has had so if Pac's to be deemed dirty at this point in time then every pro out there is, and have been for all of there fights. Either Pac's innocent untill proven guilty or everybody, Hatton, Mayweather, DLH, Morales, Wright, Leonard, Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis, JMM, Barrera, Pac, Cotto and every other fighter are all guilty untill proven innocent. That's just the way it is, you can't pick and choose.





(as far as Margarito goes though, I put a mental asterix beside that loss now, but that's a different matter, he was caught, the above fighters were never stung for anything.)

TiwstaSista

x PyRo wrote: »

Yes... Manny Pacquiao.

I agree