No refund for abandoned race

phil16phil

Went into Boylesports this morning to get a refund on my Leopardstown docket yesterday which was abandoned.

I was informed that I was only entitled to a refund if I had went back in yesterday and that my bet on Cooldine in the big race (The lexus) must stand.

This bet must stand even though when I initially backed the hores he was to be ridden by Ruby Walsh (No disrespect to Paul Townend who now rides - Excellent Jockey) and there has probably been about 10mm of rain overnight, which changes the compexion of the race.

I am disgusted with Boylesport.

Are they correct to do this???????

Healio

What a stingy operation. They should have at least offered you the chance to have your bet voided.

Although the race was only abandoned a day, e.g. entries werent reopened for the races so as such they can tell you your bet stands.

thesandeman

PP and Celtic both refunded me. That was yesterday tho.

PhatPiggins

Did they say whether or not they would have voided if it had won?

Bluetonic

phil16phil wrote: »

there has probably been about 10mm of rain overnight, which changes the compexion of the race.

There's been nothing of the sort overnight.

Fromvert

Get on the phone to their customer service. That bet should be definitely be voided.

Moro Man

Fromvert wrote: »

Get on the phone to their customer service. That bet should be definitely be voided.

They're not going to void it after the race :rolleyes:

RocketRonnie

The bet is void, money back. No question..!!

tatoo

phil16phil wrote: »

Went into Boylesports this morning to get a refund on my Leopardstown docket yesterday which was abandoned.

I was informed that I was only entitled to a refund if I had went back in yesterday and that my bet on Cooldine in the big race (The lexus) must stand.

This bet must stand even though when I initially backed the hores he was to be ridden by Ruby Walsh (No disrespect to Paul Townend who now rides - Excellent Jockey) and there has probably been about 10mm of rain overnight, which changes the compexion of the race.

I am disgusted with Boylesport.

Are they correct to do this???????

I would think that it'd only be fair to allow the punter the option to void his bet prior to the off , Boyles should have done this .
From todays Racing Post ;
" The majority of bookmakers announced that bets would stand until today's race , with only Coral , among the major layers voiding bets already struck."

kingshankly

Bet was void unless it was an ante post bet
I backed it yesterday at 11/2 and there was no way I was going to back it at 0/30 today thank god I didn't back it but if I was given the option to lat the bet stand I would have done

phil16phil

I spoke to customer servives at Boylesports and they confirmed that the bettor was only entitled to a refund on the same day.
He also said that ..... as per rules of racing a bet stands if a race is run within 24hrs and that refunding the bet was just a gesture of good will.

This was not an anti-post bet where some unknown factors are priced into the equation.

The conditions of the race undeniably changed within this 24hrs, I was put at a disadvantage and the bookmaker at an advantage by not being able to use this additional time and info to choose my selection.

I was unaware of this 24 hour rule, and I think it,s wrong.

Bluetonic

phil16phil wrote: »

I
I was unaware of this 24 hour rule, and I think it,s wrong.

It's not.

phil16phil

Bluetonic wrote: »

It's not.

Do you you post just to get your numbers up.
What kind of Bull**** reply is that.

You may be correct, but at least put forward an argument as to why.

I maintain that the circumstances under which I placed a bet changed and that I should therefore be entitled to a refund.

Healio

wrote:

He also said that ..... as per rules of racing a bet stands if a race is run within 24hrs and that refunding the bet was just a gesture of good will.

The rules of racing line is a bull**** response, it only stands if the race is not reopened for entries. Nothing to do with 24 hours; this is also stated in the Boylesport rules.

The conditions of the race undeniably changed within this 24hrs, I was put at a disadvantage and the bookmaker at an advantage by not being able to use this additional time and info to choose my selection.

Agree with you here to an extent. i.e You should have been offered a chance to void from between abandonement right up until first show of the re-running.

I was unaware of this 24 hour rule, and I think it,s wrong.

This is not presented in these words on the rules, but is stated that unless race is reopened for entries.



At the end of the day they are a useless shower of unprofessional C**ts, and they will twist the rules to suit themselves. I have factual evidence to back this up by the way.

prendy

phil16phil wrote: »

Do you you post just to get your numbers up.
What kind of Bull**** reply is that.

You may be correct, but at least put forward an argument as to why.

I maintain that the circumstances under which I placed a bet changed and that I should therefore be entitled to a refund.

OP did you go in before the off in the re-arranged race??

If you went in after the race was run i can see the bookies point of view.

Kod-box

original post was at 11:01am yesterday so he obviously did.

okidoki987

In fairness to Boylers, they couldn't pay out twice on the same race could they, refund or as a winner?
By that I mean you could have claimed a refund yesterday but then if the horse had won today you would have expected to get paid as a Winner?
Sounds fair if you had gone in yesterday and claimed it back but next day, bet stands.

Healio

okidoki987 wrote: »

Sounds fair if you had gone in yesterday and claimed it back but next day, bet stands.

From my reading of it; he went in and wasnt even offered the choice to void.

Kod-box

he went in 3 or so hours before the race, so they should have voided the bet imo.

phil16phil

Yeah....I looked to have my bet declared void at about 10:15/10:30 on the morning of the re-arranged race.
The girl read from her screen a note that had been circulated re the non-refunding of stakes. She advised me to raise the issue with customer services.
Just to clarify ...... I was unhappy about the situation ever before I knew if the docket was a winning one or not.

Bluetonic

phil16phil wrote: »

You may be correct, but at least put forward an argument as to why.

You placed a bet, it's up to you to be an adult and understand the rules under which you place the bet.

If your not responsible enough to do that then I recommend staying indoors.

Bluetonic

phil16phil wrote: »

Yeah....I looked to have my bet declared void at about 10:15/10:30 on the morning of the re-arranged race.
The girl read from her screen a note that had been circulated re the non-refunding of stakes. She advised me to raise the issue with customer services.
Just to clarify ...... I was unhappy about the situation ever before I knew if the docket was a winning one or not.

Your were going on about 10mm of rain falling even before the rain had even fallen. The going had not even changed when you went looking for your refund.

Looks like you had an opportunity to get a refund on the day (something of which the bookies doesn't have to do), you didn't bother with this. Subsequently you then saw the changing weather and **** yourself and went in demanding a refund not knowing the rules under which you placed the bet.

If the race had been run on the day and Ruby had been stood down earlier in the day would you have been looking for a refund?

Summary - know under what rules you place your bets.

Juwwi

Bluetonic wrote: »

Your were going on about 10mm of rain falling even before the rain had even fallen. The going had not even changed when you went looking for your refund.

Looks like you had an opportunity to get a refund on the day (something of which the bookies doesn't have to do), you didn't bother with this. Subsequently you then saw the changing weather and **** yourself and went in demanding a refund not knowing the rules under which you placed the bet.

If the race had been run on the day and Ruby had been stood down earlier in the day would you have been looking for a refund?

Summary - know under what rules you place your bets.

Could'nt disagree more with everything you said bluetonic.

It does'nt matter if the going had'nt of change there had been rain and the forcast was'nt good.

When did he say he demanded his money back?

The fairest way the bookies should of settling all bets would of been to settle all bets as they stood or refund if someone asked for a refund.(except antepost bets).
That way everyone is happy.

Bluetonic

robbie1977 wrote: »

When did he say he demanded his money back?

Demand/Ask - your not one of these keyboard warriors are you?

robbie1977 wrote: »

The fairest way the bookies should of settling all bets would of been to settle all bets as they stood or refund if someone asked for a refund.(except antepost bets).
That way everyone is happy.

The fairest thing would have been for the bookie to follow the rules that way there'd be no confusion. They did this yet we still have confusion.

Yet again there seems to be a lack of personal responsibility and understanding.

Juwwi

Bluetonic wrote: »

Demand/Ask - your not one of these keyboard warriors are you?

^^^^
That made me laugh !!

there is no point having a discussion with you.

just one last thing there is difference between demanding and asking.

Bluetonic

robbie1977 wrote: »

there is no point having a discussion with you.

Nor with you if your going to pull me up over everything I type looking for it to be referenced, talk about pedantic.

Happy new year.

phil16phil

It is important wether I asked for a refund or demanded it. I understand that the girls at the counter were just carrying out instructions. I was at all times well behaved and never raised my voice and similarly when I talked to customer services. I accept the decision but I don't agree with it.

Bluetonic......I admit I don,t know every rule....do you ?
By your reckoning, I shouldn't have any more bets and stay indoors. Great argument !!!!

On this forum it was stated that the recent ulster (Heiniken Cup Rugby)match that was cancelled on the Staurday and re-scheduled for the Sunday was declared void. I know it is not an identical situation but it is fair to make comparisons.

It is difficult to know each and every term and condition under which a bet is placed. Some bets are settled through fairness and common sense, it is sport after all.

oconnon9

Bluetonic wrote: »

If your not responsible enough to do that then I recommend staying indoors.

^^^ = sap

Did you get onto customer care? Generally bookies will look after their customers.. as they'll more than likely get your money back again!

Juwwi

Here is a thread l started a while ago.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055595058

I never got paid on that bet even tho other bookies voided the match.
There is no way some bookies should pay out on the match and others void the match.


There is millions bet on every single horse race,dog race football match blah blah blah and the industry could well afford a 3 man commitee working full time to act as independent stewards fair play rule to enforce bookies rules which all all bookies enforce aslike this insidance at leopardstown and my rugby bet.

To be honest at the moment each bookies make up rules to suit themselves
as they go along in my opinion when they can.

bertmc

It is difficult to know each and every term and condition under which a bet is placed. Some bets are settled through fairness and common sense, it is sport after all.[/quote]

Most bookmakers have a subsection stating that you are in agreement with the terms and conditions/ rules by the very action of your placing a bet.

I think its a bit ridiculous that any bet placed on the day of the lexus originally up until the off on the rescheduled day was not voided on request. I think boyles were unfair here.

With regard to changing conditions of a race - surely the same would apply if there was a deluge of rain 10 minutes before the off ( as happened at Galway festival with those crazy eletrical storms a few years back, I recall) - yet you wouldn't be requesting money back on your stake in that instance.

Healio

We can all argue this one-way or the other til the cows squirt pepsi.
Boyles were well within their rights to do what they did, however it doesnt make it morally right, but it is technically not wrong.

Dont get me wrong; id be the first to slate them, (have evidence to justify this), but their terms of refund seem to be for bets requesting voidment on the day only; thats their perogative. It sounds/looks/is robbery, however they did have such a situation allowed for in their rules.

You can also turn around and say not everyone knows/reads the rules when they sign up (im guilty of this aswell, e.g. bet365) however they do offer you the chance to read them. Most people in their haste click the "X" in the corner, but doing this diverts you from these possible problems down the line.

Clare_Guy

really interesting show on sellotanta tonight (this morning) reviewing 09 racing. They were saying Ruby is unique on a horse and he can change a horse from an average chance to a class act with just a couple of rides!!

One of the contributors (didn't get his name) said Ruby turned a horse he had an interest in, into a winner and changed the animal into a winner for other jockeys after that ride. Amazing stuff, especially as he wasn't in the top 10 of Irish sports stars that was announced on RTE tonight.

Amazing man, Ruby...

To establish being on-topic, I think the OP should've got a refund.

heavyballs

Clare_Guy wrote: »

really interesting show on sellotanta tonight (this morning) reviewing 09 racing. They were saying Ruby is unique on a horse and he can change a horse from an average chance to a class act with just a couple of rides!!

One of the contributors (didn't get his name) said Ruby turned a horse he had an interest in, into a winner and changed the animal into a winner for other jockeys after that ride. Amazing stuff, especially as he wasn't in the top 10 of Irish sports stars that was announced on RTE tonight.

Amazing man, Ruby...

To establish being on-topic, I think the OP should've got a refund.

where did that Ruby rant com from? He's a super jockey but that sounds like a load of sheitr to me tbh

Clare_Guy

heavyballs wrote: »

where did that Ruby rant com from? He's a super jockey but that sounds like a load of sheitr to me tbh

Seriously, on setanta 's review of racing 09 they quoted Timmy Murphy as saying it takes most jockeys years to learn to keep still while the horse is jumping. Ruby, for whatever reason, has always known it...

heavyballs

Clare_Guy wrote: »

Seriously, on setanta 's review of racing 09 they quoted Timmy Murphy as saying it takes most jockeys years to learn to keep still while the horse is jumping. Ruby, for whatever reason, has always known it...

i still don't think he can change a horse so remarkably,i would have to see an example of a horse(not a progressive)who improved all of a sudden when Ruby started to school (and or) race him.
That said he's class,no doubt
I'm off to the pit.gl

Clare_Guy

heavyballs wrote: »

i still don't think he can change a horse so remarkably,i would have to see an example of a horse(not a progressive)who improved all of a sudden when Ruby started to school (and or) race him.
That said he's class,no doubt
I'm off to the pit.gl

Well I'm only repeating what was said and I'd heard many times before, in less specific terms, that Ruby was particularly gifted with horses, and that it was apparent from the first time he climbed aboard a thorough-bred. Apparently Willie Mullins gave Ruby his first ride (which he won) and his talent was so apparent even then, he request first refusal on his services...

Chonaic

Clare_Guy wrote: »

Apparently Willie Mullins gave Ruby his first ride (which he won) and his talent was so apparent even then, he request first refusal on his services...

I always remember looking out for Mr. R W Walsh before i baked him

Glenbhoy

Boylesports are becoming very shoddy with customer service recently. The OP should have been refunded.
I recently placed a €100 single at 10/11 on a coupon, when i went to collect my winnings they told me that the price had changed to 4/7 when I placed the bet (this was news to me and it wasn't that i was trying to get one over them via the coupon), I was baffled as to how they could accept a bet at one price and pay out at another - if i had known that the price had changed, i wouldn't have been placing the bet, if the bet had lost i wouldn't have known that the price was changed.
I asked what the point of printing coupons was if they weren't going to honour prices, she told me it was for handiness and that they only actually provide a guide to prices

Collie D

Glenbhoy wrote: »

Boylesports are becoming very shoddy with customer service recently. The OP should have been refunded.
I recently placed a €100 single at 10/11 on a coupon, when i went to collect my winnings they told me that the price had changed to 4/7 when I placed the bet (this was news to me and it wasn't that i was trying to get one over them via the coupon), I was baffled as to how they could accept a bet at one price and pay out at another - if i had known that the price had changed, i wouldn't have been placing the bet, if the bet had lost i wouldn't have known that the price was changed.
I asked what the point of printing coupons was if they weren't going to honour prices, she told me it was for handiness and that they only actually provide a guide to prices

Have had this situation before, usually do footie coupons in PP and they always pull me up when a price has changed from the coupon and ask do I want to continue with the bet.

In fairness to whatever bookie you used, the coupons are done on a Wednesday or Thursday and if you placed bet on Saturday the price may well have changed (ASSUMING IT'S A FOOTIE COUPON HERE) especially with the mount of games played over Xmas. It's usually stated on coupon as well that prices are subject to change and screens should be checked. Still, you should have been informed when you struck the bet. I know I'd pull out if a price went from 10/11 into 4/7