ML Semi Final and Final Venues decided on Super 14 model

thomond2006

http://www.magnersleague.com/news/4475.php

The date for the final, which will be known as the Magners League Grand Final, has been set for Saturday, 29 May, 2010, with a provisional kick-off of 6.30pm. The venue for the Grand Final will be determined by the final finishing positions of the four semi-finalists in their regular league campaign.

That was a vitally important rugby principle that the Celtic Rugby Board were determined to implement in this the first season of the exciting new, end of season format. Clubs will have until 8 March to nominate their choice of final venue should they be in the race for a Play-Off place.

"Getting the date and proposed kick-off time for the Grand Final was the first step, along with underlining the format for the Play-Off matches. As stated at the start of the season, the top four teams in the regular league will progress into the Play-Offs, with the top two teams enjoying home advantage," explained Celtic Rugby Director David Jordan.

"With no pre-determined venue for the staging of the Grand Final, the board has agreed the following principles to determine where the biggest game in the history of the Magners League shall be played.

"The team that reaches the Grand Final having achieved the highest finishing position in the regular Magners League shall have the right to nominate a venue of more than 18k capacity within its own Union's jurisdiction to host the game".

"All nominated venues will have to meet with the approval of the Celtic Rugby board, and its commercial requirements, and, in the unlikely event of neither finalist being able to nominate a suitable venue, the board will take the game to a ground of its choice."

The ruling on where the Grand Final will be staged follows the Super 14 model, where the highest placed team from the regular league season that reaches the final enjoys home advantage. This will add spice and excitement to the remaining 10 rounds of Magners League matches and ensure there is more than just a top four, Play-Off place to be won.

We may see a Munster vs Leinster final at Thomond Park!

Also interesting that the ML final takes place after the Heineken Cup Final..

PhatPiggins

Here's hoping.

Can you imagine trying to have to pick yourself up for a ML final after losing a HC final.

thomond2006

With Aviva not ready yet, the Croke Park question may crop up for this..

shawpower

It isn't clear having read it earlier as well, but my assumption would be that you couldn't nominate your own ground?

Reason being is that it gives a huge advantage to the bigger teams. Basically Munster or Leinster could host the final at home, but Ulster couldn't?? I can't see that being agreed. Probably that you can pick another ground in your jurisdiction. So maybe we'll see a Leinster v Edinburgh final in Thomond? ;)

wixfjord

If it were Leinster, I would rather see it played in the RDS than Croker, especially if it was Munster we were playing. 18500 is a bit low, but as the article says, above 18000 is the cut off point.

Also why the hell wasnt this decided before the season started?!

zenmonk

Would be surprised to see a Munster Leinster final. Both would do well to make the playoffs.
Ulster, Glasgow, Edinburgh and Ospreys will be thereabouts too. If Munster (probably) and Leinster (certainty) qualify for the HCup knockouts, along with the 6 nations the ML will come down the pecking list.
Ulster would be my long shot for the ML this year.

wixfjord

Isnt the Super 14 model that the team thats top gets to play at home? Seem to remember a final at Christchurch and this years was at Loftus Versfield wasnt it?

zenmonk

shawpower wrote: »

It isn't clear having read it earlier as well, but my assumption would be that you couldn't nominate your own ground?

Reason being is that it gives a huge advantage to the bigger teams. Basically Munster or Leinster could host the final at home, but Ulster couldn't?? I can't see that being agreed. Probably that you can pick another ground in your jurisdiction. So maybe we'll see a Leinster v Edinburgh final in Thomond? ;)

Good point about Ulster, where would they play a final?
Ravenhill is about 12000 if I remember correctly. Probably the RDS?
I'd imagine Murrayfield for the Scottish teams and home grounds for the Welsh.

thomond2006

ML final at the Sportsgrounds FTW! :pac::P

zenmonk

I would love to see Connacht with a 8,000 seater stadium and some decent funds. Their results in Europe are a credit to them. 2-0 win over a premiership side. An away win in France. Hats off.

louthandproud

thomond2006 wrote: »

With Aviva not ready yet, the Croke Park question may crop up for this..

Isn't the new Aviva stadium due to be ready at the end of April?

Podge_irl

louthandproud wrote: »

Isn't the new Aviva stadium due to be ready at the end of April?

Something like that, but construction being finished is not the same as it being ready to host a match. Besides, they already have big plans for the opening events at the stadium so hosting it there would be a non-runner.

I doubt they'd look for Croker tbh, I imagine Thomond or the RDS are the most likely if it came down to it. Personally, I don't think the Irish teams will end up being the top ranked team in the final though so I dont think its going to be an issue.

thomond2006

Podge_irl wrote: »

I doubt they'd look for Croker tbh, I imagine Thomond or the RDS are the most likely if it came down to it. Personally, I don't think the Irish teams will end up being the top ranked team in the final though so I dont think its going to be an issue.

Edinburgh and Glasgow will struggle to stay top imo.

The Welsh sides bar Ospreys (who are inconsistent anyway) won't make a challenge.

Ulster may make a late push and Connacht will finish bottom.

Don't really understand your statement.

shawpower

zenmonk wrote: »

Would be surprised to see a Munster Leinster final. Both would do well to make the playoffs.

Really? Or did you forget a smilie face?

History would show that both are very likely to finish in the top four. Leinster have finished in the top four every year since 2003/04 season. Munster have missed out twice in that time (with neither coming during HEC winning years which is a bit surprising).

zenmonk wrote: »

Ulster, Glasgow, Edinburgh and Ospreys will be thereabouts too. If Munster (probably) and Leinster (certainty) qualify for the HCup knockouts, along with the 6 nations the ML will come down the pecking list.

Do agree that a HEC semi or final appearance would put the strain on priorities. But I think you mixed up your (probable) and (Certainty) post. Munster are practically guaranteed qualification now with their run in. Leinster still have to get something from London Irish away in all likelihood, although they look decent for a chance at best 2nd place spot either. Hopefully we won't need that though.

zenmonk wrote: »

Ulster would be my long shot for the ML this year.

Wouldn't argue with that. They have a good chance if they keep going the way they are.

Podge_irl

thomond2006 wrote: »

Edinburgh and Glasgow will struggle to stay top imo.

The Welsh sides bar Ospreys (who are inconsistent anyway) won't make a challenge.

Ulster may make a late push and Connacht will finish bottom.

Don't really understand your statement.

Leinster are the only Irish team who could conceivably come top imo but I think its silly to write off Edinburgh and Glasgow. They're developing into fine teams and with both effectively out of the HEC they'll be gunning for the ML. I think Munster and to a lesser degree Leinster may only aim to be in the top 4 and not worry too much about getting the top spot, especially with the restrictions on Irish internationals playing too many games.

shawpower

Podge_irl wrote: »

I think Munster and to a lesser degree Leinster may only aim to be in the top 4 and not worry too much about getting the top spot, especially with the restrictions on Irish internationals playing too many games.

I certainly think this was the case.

But I wonder whether Cheika/McGahern knew about this venue plan at the start of the season? Going by the youth team that Cheika brought to the Dragons I'd doubt it.

OldJay

thomond2006 wrote: »

With Aviva not ready yet, the Croke Park question may crop up for this..

It won't.

Podge_irl

shawpower wrote: »

I certainly think this was the case.

But I wonder whether Cheika/McGahern knew about this venue plan at the start of the season? Going by the youth team that Cheika brought to the Dragons I'd doubt it.

Cheika had no choice but to bring that team to the Dragons due to the limit on the number of games Irish international players could play. Judging by his past form in the ML he wouldn't have done that by choice.

shawpower

Podge_irl wrote: »

Cheika had no choice but to bring that team to the Dragons due to the limit on the number of games Irish international players could play. Judging by his past form in the ML he wouldn't have done that by choice.

Not really. He had a limit to the number of games the international players could play between the November internationals and the 6N. However, it was his choice to rest them all at the same time for that one game. He could have rested 2 per game etc. and gone with a much stronger panel to that game. Plus he rested guys like Isa, Ross, Girve also without any need. (Although did Isa miss that game due to birth of kids?)

That said, he wasn't to know the bigger guns like Jackman were going to perform quite as woefully as they did.

ALH-06

thomond2006 wrote: »

With Aviva Lansdowne Road not ready yet, the Croke Park question may crop up for this..

louthandproud wrote: »

Isn't the new Aviva stadium Lansdowne Road due to be ready at the end of April?

Come on lads - the oldest site of international rugby in the world....

Aviva? Never! Don't give in!

(Slight tangent, apologies).

thomond2006

Eligible Stadiums:

Ireland
Thomond Park (26,500)
RDS Arena (18,500)

Scotland
Murrayfield (67,130)

Wales
Cardiff City Stadium (26,828)
Liberty Stadium (20,532)

Chucky the tree

It's GAA season by the end of May so zero chance this is held in croke park.

thomond2006

Chucky the tree wrote: »

It's GAA season by the end of May so zero chance this is held in croke park.

True enough.

sock puppet

I think this is grand for the first season, but what if the event starts getting really big?

I think the venues should be restricted to the AvLandsdowne Road, Millenium Stadium and Murrayfield soon enough. Somewhere like Thomond would be suitable too. Even this year I think the RDS would be too small.

thomond2006

sock puppet wrote: »

I think this is grand for the first season, but what if the event starts getting really big?

I think the venues should be restricted to the AvLandsdowne Road, Millenium Stadium and Murrayfield soon enough. Somewhere like Thomond would be suitable too. Even this year I think the RDS would be too small.

I agree, the GP final gets a full house every year at Twickenham.

Afaik though, tickets aren't expensive...

sock puppet

thomond2006 wrote: »

I agree, the GP final gets a full house every year at Twickenham.

Afaik though, tickets aren't expensive...

Yeah I'd love for it to grow to that size. Though it could end up being almost embarassingly small too. Imagine Edinburgh v Ospreys in Murrayfield....

thomond2006

sock puppet wrote: »

Yeah I'd love for it to grow to that size. Though it could end up being almost embarassingly small too. Imagine Edinburgh v Ospreys in Murrayfield....

Imagine Edinburgh vs Munster/Leinster, the Irish would outnumber the Scots.

On other note, 3000 posts, w00t!

Legion2008

Hmmmmm anyone else notice the dates .....May could be potentially a big month for games and if it came down to it would either Leinster/Munster prioritise the league if they were still involved in the Heineken Cup

May 1/2 - Heineken Semi Final
May 15 - Magners League Semi Final
May 22 - Heineken Cup Final
May 29 - Magners League Final

Distraction anyone ..... ?

ALH-06

Legion2008 wrote: »

Hmmmmm anyone else notice the dates .....May could be potentially a big month for games and if it came down to it would either Leinster/Munster prioritise the league if they were still involved in the Heineken Cup

May 1/2 - Heineken Semi Final
May 15 - Magners League Semi Final
May 22 - Heineken Cup Final
May 29 - Magners League Final

Distraction anyone ..... ?

Right in the middle of exam time as well. Excellent.

thomond2006

http://www.magnersleague.com/matchcentre/table.php

Looking at that table, you could probably only write off Scarlets and Connacht for a top 4 spot.

Cardiff's results may improve now that they're out the Heineken Cup. It's been a poor season for them so far.

PhatPiggins

Chucky the tree wrote: »

It's GAA season by the end of May so zero chance this is held in croke park.

Considering the money the GAA have been making off Rugby/Soccer and the falling attendances they've been getting for the may GAA fixtures the last few seasons I think they'd at least entertain the notion.

Having said that if there's a direct fixture class, and I have'nt checked their calander, your on the money with zero chance.

funky penguin

From here.

IF THE inaugural Magners League grand final includes two Irish provinces then Croke Park will be considered as a venue, in a repeat of last season’s Heineken Cup semi-final between Leinster and Munster, Celtic Rugby chief David Jordan has confirmed.

Celtic Rugby have set a deadline of March 8th for all clubs to nominate a home venue should they reach the final, scheduled for May 29th, if they finish as the highest ranked team from the regular season. Leinster will chose the RDS Showgrounds and Munster will go for Thomond Park, while it remains unclear if Ravenhill would be able to cater for a final. Naturally, Murrayfield and the Millennium Stadium would be the obvious places to showcase a final in Scotland and Wales.

An 18,000 capacity along with suitable broadcasting and corporate facilities are required to stage the event but a Leinster versus Munster showdown at Croke Park would be a dream inaugural final for Celtic Rugby.

It remains the obvious venue for an all-Irish final, especially considering the demand for tickets that would follow – incidentally, the fixture is a week after the European decider, but all teams are permitted to put forward a second option.

“The teams involved can nominate an alternative venue,” said Jordan yesterday. “After that it is up to Celtic rugby to assess that. It is a little premature to be thinking about that now but from a practical point of view we can work out all the possibilities should such a situation arise.

“There will only be two weeks between our semi-finals and the grand final so we will try and anticipate where the final may be hosted so we can be ready to go.”

Croke Park Stadium’s director Peter McKenna was understandably hesitant to comment on hosting another major rugby match before next April’s GAA annual congress vote on the issue. Congress is widely expected to give permanent power to Central Council to decide on renting out the stadium for major events when they arise. International rugby and soccer will permanently return to the newly-renovated Aviva Stadium in August.

This situation, like last season, could also arise for the knockout stages of the Heineken Cup.

Current GAA president Christy Cooney, who was against the current agreement to allow the use of Croke Park for international soccer and rugby matches while their headquarters was being modernised, admitted last week that he believes congress will pass the decision on the use of Croke Park to Central Council on a permanent basis. The cost of renting out Croke Park for a sporting event is €1.3 million.

There are no GAA fixtures in the stadium on the weekend of May 29th. There is a Westlife concert on June 5th. “We can’t close the door on (Croke Park) but our first choice would be the RDS,” said a Leinster spokesman. “But we can’t really decide upon this until after a semi-final, presuming we reach that stage.”

A provisional kick-off time of 6.30pm has been made for the grand final, brought in this season to evolve the competitive levels of the Magners League by adopting the Super 14 (southern hemisphere tournament) model.

“Getting the date and proposed kick-off time for the grand final was the first step, along with underlining the format for the play-off matches,” Jordan continued.

“As stated at the start of the season, the top four teams in the regular league will progress into the play-offs, with the top two teams enjoying home advantage.

“With no pre-determined venue for the staging of the grand final, the board has agreed the following principles to determine where the biggest game in the history of the Magners League shall be played.

“The team that reaches the grand final having achieved the highest finishing position in the regular Magners League shall have the right to nominate a venue of more than 18,000 capacity within its own union’s jurisdiction to host the game.

“All nominated venues will have to meet with the approval of the Celtic Rugby board, and its commercial requirements, and, in the unlikely event of neither finalist being able to nominate a suitable venue, the board will take the game to a ground of its choice.”

Riskymove

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Considering the money the GAA have been making off Rugby/Soccer and the falling attendances they've been getting for the may GAA fixtures the last few seasons I think they'd at least entertain the notion.

Having said that if there's a direct fixture class, and I have'nt checked their calander, your on the money with zero chance.

I dont think croker is used that often for league/early stages of the championships