Atheists Are Jealous Of The Holiday!

zod

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX_URHACJPw

5uspect

Why do they loath the Baby Jesus?
He's just a baby.

I agree!

robby^5

Bill O'Reilly you troll you.

marco_polo

Not really Bill, I get presents and a sleep in on Christmas morning.

Xluna

Nonsense. Atheists have the best of both worlds at XMAS. We get all the pressies and food but don't have to go to church and guilt trips. Maybe it's the Christians who are jealous of us.

liamw

I have a lot of respect for Bill. He handled Dawkins very well too :rolleyes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FARDDcdFaQ

GLaDOS

Nothing new there, once again, either deliberatly or not, they imply atheism/agnosticism = hating Chritianity. I think they need a new angle, it's getting old

Zombrex

And now for our in-depth analysis two idiots who already agree with me.

Someone should tell them that one of "America's cultural traditions" is a deep scepticism of religion and belief in absolute separation of Church and State.

Dave!

Fox news

OK-Cancel-Apply

You know I think they do this kind of thing because they know people will talk about them for it. And if there's one thing that Bill likes, it's ratings!

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

Galvasean

45 seconds in he can't remember who his guests are. Good start Bill.

Rb

I found myself getting slightly wound up there but one has to remember that the joke is entirely on him.

Weidii

How can they allow this stuff on the news? More proof that they should have some strict standards in place as to placing opinions in newsreels, rather than just news/fact. What church is paying them, like?

Rb

Weidii wrote: »

How can they allow this stuff on the news? More proof that they should have some strict standards in place as to placing opinions in newsreels, rather than just news/fact. What church is paying them, like?

Well, you have to keep in mind it is Fox news. Have a read of the Fox News Channel Controversies. It's not exactly the best but afaik they now own a few media outlets here too.

PDN

Rb wrote: »

Well, you have to keep in mind it is Fox news. Have a read of the Fox News Channel Controversies. It's not exactly the best but afaik they now own a few media outlets here too.

A few?

Fox News is owned by Rupert Murdoch's Newscorp. They also own the 20th Century Fox film studios, BSkyB (including Sky News), 50% of the National Geographic Channel, Harper Collins publishing house, The News of the World, the Sun, the Times, the Sunday Times, the Wall Street Journal, MySpace and Photobucket.

Rb

PDN wrote: »

A few?

Fox News is owned by Rupert Murdoch's Newscorp. They also own the 20th Century Fox film studios, BSkyB (including Sky News), 50% of the National Geographic Channel, Harper Collins publishing house, The News of the World, the Sun, the Times, the Sunday Times, the Wall Street Journal, MySpace and Photobucket.

Noooo! Not the Sun!

eoin5

Bill is brilliant, hes such a caricature of himself.

darjeeling

Bill-O wrote:

The question [my fellow Fox fundies] is why do they do it?

No Bill, get 'them' on and ask them 'Why do you do it?'

aidan24326

eoin5 wrote: »

Bill is brilliant, hes such a caricature of himself.

It's actually not a laughing matter though, since millions of Americans hang on this guy's word. His nonsense is no doubt lapped up by the vast majority of your typical Sunday morning bible club types, and that country has an awful lot of those.

eoin5

aidan24326 wrote: »

It's actually not a laughing matter though, since millions of Americans hang on this guy's word. His nonsense is no doubt lapped up by the vast majority of your typical Sunday morning bible club types, and that country has an awful lot of those.

Bill entertains me, the fact that people listen to him doesn't. Hate-filled rambling crap that goes nowhere. His talent is managing to figure out the middle of a line so he can interrupt it, then proceed to raise his voice in a collage of half-sentences until the discussion is out of time. Its the wierdest thing ever.

MongOrgyInferno

Xluna wrote: »

Nonsense. Atheists have the best of both worlds at XMAS. We get all the pressies and food but don't have to go to church and guilt trips. Maybe it's the Christians who are jealous of us.

if you get the presents and the food, then you're celebrating christmas, therefore that would make you are a hypocrite and not really an atheist

5uspect

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

if you get the presents and the food, then you're celebrating christmas, therefore that would make you are a hypocrite and not really an atheist

zOMG, that's right, cos Jesus had turkey and ham and a tree and selection boxes and mulled wine and santa and mistletoe and an office party and minced pies and pudding and loads of socks.

MongOrgyInferno

5uspect wrote: »

zOMG, that's right, cos Jesus had turkey and ham and a tree and selection boxes and mulled wine and santa and mistletoe and an office party and minced pies and pudding and loads of socks.

they are all symbolic of the christian celebration, it really does make me chuckle how every atheist I know celebrates christmas

dvpower

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

if you get the presents and the food, then you're celebrating christmas, therefore that would make you are a hypocrite and not really an atheist

The entry criteria to Christianity just gets lower and lower.

sink

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

they are all symbolic of the christian celebration, it really does make me chuckle how every atheist I know celebrates christmas

In the same way you no doubt chuckle at every (false) Christian who celebrates Halloween.

MongOrgyInferno

sink wrote: »

In the same way you no doubt chuckle at every (false) Christian who celebrates Halloween.

not the same thing though is it, and I don't know any christians who celebrate halloween

Doctor DooM

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

not the same thing though is it, and I don't know any christians who celebrate halloween

You don't know any Christians who engage in the empty rituals that surround halloween such as dressing up, having a party or eating too much?

Cos that's what atheists do at christmas.

BTW this topic is done every year

5uspect

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

they are all symbolic of the christian celebration, it really does make me chuckle how every atheist I know celebrates christmas

No they're not.
They're symbolic of the kind of winter celebrations that have been going on well before and irrespective of any Christian mythology. The fact that Christian mythology has assimilated much of it is irrelevant to the enjoyment of Atheists.

sink

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

not the same thing though is it, and I don't know any christians who celebrate halloween

It is exactly the same thing and I find it hard to believe you don't know any Christians who dress up and light bonfires on the the 31st of October. Unless you're professing the belief that anyone who does so is technically not a Christian.

Ickle Magoo

MongOrgyInferno wrote: »

if you get the presents and the food, then you're celebrating christmas, therefore that would make you are a hypocrite and not really an atheist

I thought early Christians didn't actually celebrate Jesus birth (which is actually in Sept, isn't it?!), that was brought in much later?

...and isn't the whole winter celebration a mix of the pagan feast of Isis (traditionally on 25th Dec - coincidence or wha? :eek: );celebrated by eating and present giving & the Roman holiday of Saturnalia (where the Mummers went from house to house singing songs)?

Trees come from the druids, Yule logs from the pagan sun god Mithras, as does mistletoe...in fact the 25th of Dec wasn't declared a Christian festival until Pope Julius I - so by all means the presents and food can help you to celebrate your Christmas but please don't think people who are carrying on the traditions set in place before Christianity was ever heard of are hypocrites or by default, Christians. :cool:

5uspect

Timely post from PZ
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/12/let_the_christmas_caroling_beg.php

cavedave

Whats your favorite Christmas song. I am going with this cheery ditty

Genghiz Cohen

Winrar!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujZsFOGT-Ko

liamw

Posted by: Steve Jeffers | December 13, 2009 4:03 PM

You atheists have it all wrong - no one these days thinks of Father Christmas as an old man with a white beard flying around on a magical sleigh.

We Christians understand now that 'Santa' is far more awesome than that - the name we give for the perfect expression of Christmas presents, or gifts generally. More of an energy field. In fact, modern quantum physics certainly doesn't rule out the existence of Santa at all. And this is a view shared by many Eastern spiritual traditions. And so that means it must be true.

Presents have to come from somewhere. Even if the theory of parental selection is true, then surely it's Santa working through the medium of parents. If a parent earns money, gives a lot of thought to a gift, goes to the shop, buys it, carefully wraps it and then hands it to their child, then surely Father Christmas is working through them and deserves all the credit? There's nothing incompatible with that and my belief.

A flying red nosed reindeer could not evolve by natural selection, but don't tar us with the 'creationist' brush. Rudolph is clearly symbolic - a metaphor for something or other.

And, yes, many of the various Santas that we know of in malls and department store grottos have been proved by so-called 'science' to not be the real thing, but that just goes to show how naive scientists are. This isn't a valid area for science to study. It's not as though 'this exists' is some kind of meaningful or testable claim, is it? If I say 'Father Christmas lives at the North Pole', it's not like scientists could go up there to check, is it? What does 'North Pole' even mean?

Anyway, I don't envy you atheists. Without Father Christmas, what would stop me being naughty instead of nice? If I wasn't going to get presents at the end of the year, I might as well go around stabbing people and raping animals. What a horrible, empty life you atheists lead. Why are you so obsessed with animal rape?

Even if Father Christmas didn't exist, we should act as if he did. There's nothing to lose. If we're wrong, we won't get any presents.

Hitler didn't believe in Santa Claus. Although he made speeches saying he did, and there are photographs of him dressed as Father Christmas, that in no way means he really believed

Only 52% of Americans would vote for a politician who didn't believe in Father Christmas.

Santa Claus demands total faith. It says that in my Bumper Anthology of Santa Stories. Belief in him is, basically, the only thing he values. He doesn't even mind if you're naughty, as long as you believe in him. Oh, and he recently sent some of his elves to Uganda to lobby their government to criminalize homosexuality. Not that I condone that personally.

Merry Christmas, atheists.

Comment from the PZ blog

pH

We Christians understand now that 'Santa' is far more awesome than that - the name we give for the perfect expression of Christmas presents, or gifts generally. More of an energy field. In fact, modern quantum physics certainly doesn't rule out the existence of Santa at all. And this is a view shared by many Eastern spiritual traditions. And so that means it must be true.

In fact, quantum physics helps us understand Father Christmas even more.

For a start it explains how he can deliver his presents all over the planet in a single night. Newtonian physics cannot, it fact Newtonian scientists have gone as far as to say that the velocities and accelerations involved make it impossible. However it's well understood how a quantum particle can be in more than one place at the one time, making a quantum Claus the only soultion for world-wide present delivery.

Secondly it explains the long-held prohibition to staying awake on Christmas Eve for a glimpse of Santa, quantum physicists know that observation collapses the quantum waveform - so observation of Santa could easily collapse a Quantum Claus into a "no presents" state - hence the "No Observing" Claus(e).

Ickle Magoo

Quantum Claus.

Stargazer7

pH wrote: »

In fact, quantum physics helps us understand Father Christmas even more.

For a start it explains how he can deliver his presents all over the planet in a single night. Newtonian physics cannot, it fact Newtonian scientists have gone as far as to say that the velocities and accelerations involved make it impossible. However it's well understood how a quantum particle can be in more than one place at the one time, making a quantum Claus the only soultion for world-wide present delivery.

Secondly it explains the long-held prohibition to staying awake on Christmas Eve for a glimpse of Santa, quantum physicists know that observation collapses the quantum waveform - so observation of Santa could easily collapse a Quantum Claus into a "no presents" state - hence the "No Observing" Claus(e).

Awesome post. As a physics college student who's an agnostic

I'm going to enjoy listening to hymns this Christmas as many of them are beautiful, eat lots of lovely food, give and receive presents and enjoy my time off. The fact that the state/economy in ireland chooses to take a few days off around the 25th of December suits me just fine.

Kooli

I know I already posted some of my opinions in the other thread, but I feel this is also a relevant thread.

I am an atheist who celebrates Christmas - in the sense that I celebrate all the non-religious elements of the festival. Most atheists do the same, but probably say they are celebrating something else, some 'winter festival' or something.

It may make me a hypocrite. What makes me wonder if it really does make me a hypocrite, is if tomorrow the government decided Ireland was to become a completely secular society. Woohoo - no primary schools run by the church, no all-powerful priest held accountable to no one (there would still be priests of course, just not as powerful), no angelus at 6pm etc. etc.

BUT - no Christmas? I would be GUTTED!!! Obviously Christmas itself wouldn't go away, but if we had to go to work on Christmas day!! I imagine I would still treat Christmas the same, and probably take the same days off using my annual leave, and still continue with all the same traditions. Which leaves me in NO doubt that it is 'Christmas' I am celebrating and not some non-specific winter festival some time in December.

sink

Kooli wrote: »

I know I already posted some of my opinions in the other thread, but I feel this is also a relevant thread.

I am an atheist who celebrates Christmas - in the sense that I celebrate all the non-religious elements of the festival. Most atheists do the same, but probably say they are celebrating something else, some 'winter festival' or something.

It may make me a hypocrite. What makes me wonder if it really does make me a hypocrite, is if tomorrow the government decided Ireland was to become a completely secular society. Woohoo - no primary schools run by the church, no all-powerful priest held accountable to no one (there would still be priests of course, just not as powerful), no angelus at 6pm etc. etc.

BUT - no Christmas? I would be GUTTED!!! Obviously Christmas itself wouldn't go away, but if we had to go to work on Christmas day!! I imagine I would still treat Christmas the same, and probably take the same days off using my annual leave, and still continue with all the same traditions. Which leaves me in NO doubt that it is 'Christmas' I am celebrating and not some non-specific winter festival some time in December.

You are like me a Cultural Christian

Kooli

sink wrote: »

You are like me a Cultural Christian

Nice to hear there's a word for it!

Ickle Magoo

Kooli wrote: »

I imagine I would still treat Christmas the same, and probably take the same days off using my annual leave, and still continue with all the same traditions.

What's wrong with that? That's how we got the Christmas we celebrate today, that's the point isn't it. It's such a mishmash of ancient tradition and festivals that no one sect should be able to claim it as specifically "their" holiday. By secularism, I presume you mean schools and so on? I don't think secularism = banning all personal celebration of festivals, you would still be free to celebrate whatever you want. Also, there is no reason why Christmas pretty much as we know it wouldn't remain with mostly secular society and evolve to have less of a specific religious content.

Kooli

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

What's wrong with that? That's how we got the Christmas we celebrate today, that's the point isn't it. It's such a mishmash of ancient tradition and festivals that no one sect should be able to claim it as specifically "their" holiday. By secularism, I presume you mean schools and so on? I don't think secularism = banning all personal celebration of festivals, you would still be free to celebrate whatever you want. Also, there is no reason why Christmas pretty much as we know it wouldn't remain with mostly secular society and evolve to have less of a specific religious content.

Nothing wrong with it at all. Secularism of course does not mean banning all personal celebration of festivals. But it would mean not having public holidays on these festivals, I imagine.

I'd be happy enough to forget Easter exists, but Christmas I am keeping!
I would also hope that it stays as it is. I don't see any need to try and create an alternative secular 'winter festival', give it a different name or pretend we are celebrating something different.

Zombrex

liamw wrote: »

Comment from the PZ blog

I would love to make that my sig, but too long

Ickle Magoo

Kooli wrote: »

Nothing wrong with it at all. Secularism of course does not mean banning all personal celebration of festivals. But it would mean not having public holidays on these festivals, I imagine.

I'd be happy enough to forget Easter exists, but Christmas I am keeping!
I would also hope that it stays as it is. I don't see any need to try and create an alternative secular 'winter festival', give it a different name or pretend we are celebrating something different.

Yeah, I like this time of year too. It wouldn't be "creating" an alternative anything - or pretending; there has been a public festival with feasting and present giving at the end of December from long before Christianity was even thought of - there is no reason for that to change, secularism or no. :cool:

Mike 1972

sink wrote: »

You are like me a Cultural Christian

I have some friends who are Alevis (more in the vauge cultural sense rather than practicing) they have put up a Christmas tree and are doing the santa thing (granted niether are strictly Christian in origin but are nonetheless loosely associated with a Christian festival) mainly for the benefit of their kids.

Is there a term for this ?

eoin5

Mike 1972 wrote: »

I have some friends who are Alevis (more in the vauge cultural sense rather than practicing) they have put up a Christmas tree and are doing the santa thing (granted niether are strictly Christian in origin but are nonetheless loosely associated with a Christian festival) mainly for the benefit of their kids.

Is there a term for this ?

Normal?

--amadeus--

I *know* this is done every year but...

Jeremiah 10:2 KJV Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3* For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4* They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

Sounds like any "real" christian better get that tree out of teh house PDQ!

(quoted from an entertaining page here)