How much 2 bed apartments Dun Laoghaire

none

Hi,
Just curious what is the real value of the likes of Harbour View or Harbour Court in Dun Laoghaire?
For example, these 2 bed apartments on DAFT:
http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?limit=10&id=488036
http://www.daft.ie/1471610
They're both roughly 76 sq. metres and almost brand new.
Cheers

spockety

They are worth in or around €150,000.

The likelihood of the vendors accepting such a price, however, is probably remote to the point of none existant.

none

Is it just €150,000? I'm surprised:eek:

Klingon Hamlet

none wrote: »

Is it just €150,000? I'm surprised:eek:

There is a huge difference between current market value and future market value. Everything's overpriced. Wages will stall or fall, jobs will vanish, interest rates will rise and so will taxes.

The crash is only truly beginning now. Everyone expected a sudden collapse, but it's a slow, inevitable slide to the bottom, slowed only by the giant black hole named NAMA.

gurramok

There are 2bed apts available for 220k in the south docklands on the Affordable Housing open to everyone on a first come first served basis, in the business district. And yet they can't even sell these despite their golden location, nothing wrong with the apts and they have been on the market for at least a yr.

Now what has Dun Laoighaire got to command a 400k price for a 2bed??

spockety

none wrote: »

Is it just €150,000? I'm surprised:eek:

Well you did ask what the real value was.

As an investment if you want a half decent yield, they are worth 150,000 assuming you can pull in 900 euro per month in rent.

none

Dun Laoighaire is certainly not a business district but I don't think it's bad. I actually think it's the best place in Ireland but, of course, that's personal. I do agree it's overpriced and that's why I asked about the others' opinions. The only figure put forward so far was 150K which isn't probably very serious so I would be happy to hear more thoughts Cheers!

Theboinkmaster

none wrote: »

Dun Laoighaire is certainly not a business district but I don't think it's bad. I actually think it's the best place in Ireland but, of course, that's personal. I do agree it's overpriced and that's why I asked about the others' opinions. The only figure put forward so far was 150K which isn't probably very serious so I would be happy to hear more thoughts Cheers!

I'd agree with the €150k valuation - no way are they worth more than that and will probably decline in value past that

oceanclub

none wrote: »

Dun Laoighaire is certainly not a business district but I don't think it's bad. I actually think it's the best place in Ireland but, of course, that's personal. I do agree it's overpriced and that's why I asked about the others' opinions. The only figure put forward so far was 150K which isn't probably very serious so I would be happy to hear more thoughts Cheers!

Well, the country is chock full of 2 bed apartments and the problem with Ireland is, apartments are so badly built with so few amenities, noone wants to live in them after they start a family. So apartments are mainly either for people getting on the property ladder or for rental.

Problem is, rents are now through the floor, and the whole "property ladder" myth has been busted.

P.

none

oceanclub wrote: »

Well, the country is chock full of 2 bed apartments and the problem with Ireland is, apartments are so badly built with so few amenities, noone wants to live in them after they start a family. So apartments are mainly either for people getting on the property ladder or for rental.

Problem is, rents are now through the floor, and the whole "property ladder" myth has been busted.

P.

These two are of a pretty high standard. I hoped to hear comments from somebody who knows the area and the complexes.

Theboinkmaster

none wrote: »

These two are of a pretty high standard. I hoped to hear comments from somebody who knows the area and the complexes.

You seem dead set on these - who cares about the complexes or areas.

The simple fact is they are selling for at least double of what their true value is.

who what when

The reason the asking price is so high is that the developer probably bought the land for an extortionate amount and built them at a time when building was much more expensive. And on top of that he probably still wants to make a profit!

I think if that development was built at current prices the asking price would be in the region of €240,000-€280,000. Although you'd still be mad to pay that.

The €150,000 figure that someone mentioned is a little low when you consider the location etc. Around €180,000-€200,000 would be a realistic value of what they are actually worth. IMO obviously

oceanclub

none wrote: »

These two are of a pretty high standard. I hoped to hear comments from somebody who knows the area and the complexes.

What "high standards" are these? Looking at the pics, they're small than mine, especially the kitchen.

P.

spockety

none wrote: »

Dun Laoighaire is certainly not a business district but I don't think it's bad. I actually think it's the best place in Ireland but, of course, that's personal. I do agree it's overpriced and that's why I asked about the others' opinions. The only figure put forward so far was 150K which isn't probably very serious so I would be happy to hear more thoughts Cheers!

Actually my quote of 150k was deadly serious.

It's based on the assumption that you could pull in 900 per month in rent on them.

Buying them for 150k would give you a 7% yield.

(900x12x14) = 151K

This assumes that the achievable rent on those properties does not fall below 900, which is a bit of a rich assumption.

newestUser

spockety wrote: »

Well you did ask what the real value was.

As an investment if you want a half decent yield, they are worth 150,000 assuming you can pull in 900 euro per month in rent.

Playing devil's advocate:

Is it useful compare historic yields to yields today when interest rates (and the cost of servicing mortgages) vary so greatly across time?

Property can be a leveraged investment: you only provide x% deposit, and renters pay off remainder of mortgage. Real yield on the money you've invested is greater than annual rent/purchase price of property.

Any thoughts?

PullOutMethod

Absolute max. of 152K.
By the time this bubble has deflated it will be a rare and special apartment that will command more than 2K / m2.

I use the alternative compare-with-rest-of-Western-Europe method of valuing.

none

spockety wrote: »

Actually my quote of 150k was deadly serious.

It's based on the assumption that you could pull in 900 per month in rent on them.

Buying them for 150k would give you a 7% yield.

(900x12x14) = 151K

This assumes that the achievable rent on those properties does not fall below 900, which is a bit of a rich assumption.

I think the average rent on similar apartments in the same buildings doesn't go below E1200. I do live in the area and keep a close eye on the rent rates in Harbour Court and Harbour View for more than a year. But I was actually considering it to live there myself

spockety

none wrote: »

I think the average rent on similar apartments in the same buildings doesn't go below E1200. I do live in the area and keep a close eye on the rent rates in Harbour Court and Harbour View for more than a year. But I was actually considering it to live there myself

Achievable rent of 1200 would value the property at about €200K.

Anyone paying 1200 euro rent per month for a 2 bed apartment in Dun Laoighre could probably do with having their heads examined, I would say.

:eek:

none

spockety wrote: »

Achievable rent of 1200 would value the property at about €200K.
Anyone paying 1200 euro rent per month for a 2 bed apartment in Dun Laoighre could probably do with having their heads examined, I would say.
:eek:

Sorry but all I can say you probably don't know Dun Laoghaire. I've been living there for almost 10 years and I never saw good 2 bed accommodation for less than EUR 1000 to rent and less than EUR 300K to buy. I don't know what will happen tomorrow but I'm pretty certain about these figures in the past.

oceanclub

none wrote: »

Sorry but all I can say you probably don't know Dun Laoghaire. I've been living there for almost 10 years and I never saw good 2 bed accommodation for less than EUR 1000 to rent and less than EUR 300K to buy.

Ah, during the last 10 years.

During the bubble, you mean?

You've heard that rents have dropped, right?

P.

bangersandmash

oceanclub wrote: »

Ah, during the last 10 years.

During the bubble, you mean?

You've heard that rents have dropped, right?

To be fair None is probably factoring in recent rent drops. Decent 2 bed apartments in DL (as opposed to neglected hovels) still seem to be around the €1000-1200 mark. Of course that's before you haggle. Also I'd expect further drops after the budget.

On the other hand I honestly can't see where the demand for €300k+ apartments in DL would come from in the foreseeable future.

gurramok

208k for a 1bed at Harbour View on AH for people earning up to what is it 60k(?) and they still can't sell.
http://www.affordablehome.ie/My-Local-Authority/Dun-Laoghaire---Rathdown-County-Council/09-11-26-Harbour-View-Spec-Sheet.aspx

God help what the management fees are. :eek:

spockety

none wrote: »

Sorry but all I can say you probably don't know Dun Laoghaire. I've been living there for almost 10 years and I never saw good 2 bed accommodation for less than EUR 1000 to rent and less than EUR 300K to buy. I don't know what will happen tomorrow but I'm pretty certain about these figures in the past.

It sounds odd to me. But as I say, if you think 1200 euro rent per month is achievable then the property is valued at around 200K.

You came on here asking for "real" prices, and if you have got a better way of putting the value on such an investment I'm all ears...?

none

spockety wrote: »

It sounds odd to me. But as I say, if you think 1200 euro rent per month is achievable then the property is valued at around 200K.

You came on here asking for "real" prices, and if you have got a better way of putting the value on such an investment I'm all ears...?

I don't know the current real value but I can make assumptions. And ask for opinions. But I do know what it was in the past and I believe it was quite real as not many of these are left on the market. These two buildings were selling apartments at 500K upwards. So 300K seems reasonable in comparison. Well, they are actually asking more than 300K at the moment but that's my estimate - they're worth 300K now. I see most people believe it's rather 200K but, again, I think it's without the local knowledge. It's not Clondalkin or Ballymun after all. Not even Stillorgan or Swords. It may not be Ballsbridge but that's probably the only area I can think of right now that can, more or less deservedly, command better prices in Greater Dublin. Sorry for all the questions and doubts but I really just want to clarify it a bit for myself. And so really appreciate any input Ideally, I'd love to hear what people who know Dun Laoghaire well think. It's not that I'm biased towards Dun Laoghaire but I do believe it's one of few places that has everything for comfortable living.

And yes, with regard to that 208K 1 bed on Affordable Housing Scheme. It was reduced last week from, I think, 230K. Still, 2 bed at 300K is better than 1 bed at 200K, at least, in my situation.

So the consensus is that 300K is still an overkill??

stereo_steve

I work in Dun Laoghaire and I often think its a lovely place, the mainstreet , the pier, the park esp on Sunday. However what is it with the people there??!! A huge amount of scangers!!

They seem to congregate around the burger king and McD's. I have heard that there is a methadone clinic somewhere there. Also, the courthouse there probably doesn't help. For what is such a scenic area it really leaves a bad taste in my mouth and wouldn't like to permanently live there.

/Steve

spockety

none wrote: »

I don't know the current real value but I can make assumptions. And ask for opinions. But I do know what it was in the past and I believe it was quite real as not many of these are left on the market. These two buildings were selling apartments at 500K upwards. So 300K seems reasonable in comparison. Well, they are actually asking more than 300K at the moment but that's my estimate - they're worth 300K now. I see most people believe it's rather 200K but, again, I think it's without the local knowledge. It's not Clondalkin or Ballymun after all. Not even Stillorgan or Swords. It may not be Ballsbridge but that's probably the only area I can think of right now that can, more or less deservedly, command better prices in Greater Dublin. Sorry for all the questions and doubts but I really just want to clarify it a bit for myself. And so really appreciate any input Ideally, I'd love to hear what people who know Dun Laoghaire well think. It's not that I'm biased towards Dun Laoghaire but I do believe it's one of few places that has everything for comfortable living.

And yes, with regard to that 208K 1 bed on Affordable Housing Scheme. It was reduced last week from, I think, 230K. Still, 2 bed at 300K is better than 1 bed at 200K, at least, in my situation.

So the consensus is that 300K is still an overkill??

*sigh*

Ok, ok, ok. I will be the one to tell you what you want to hear.

Dun Laoghaire is a unique and special place, it has pretty much everything one could hope for in an area to live. Those apartments look superb, and I have to say that at 340K they would represent quite an amazing purchase given they are in this unique and special place. I would say you will need to be quick, get out there and get your mortgage approval, they will not last long on the market at that price. If you're not quick, someone else will snap them up.

Be sure and ask for a top up on your mortgage to cover the leather suite from Reid's Furniture, the 20 litres of magnolia paint, the 50 square metres of solid oak flooring, and the essential patio heater to occupy half of the 2 square metre 'terrace' outside your living room.

Curl up on the couch, sip some white wine, and be confident that any day now somebody will respond to your ad on daft to rent that 2nd room of yours for 700 euro per month to help you with that 40 year mortgage. After all, you did put that down on the mortgage application, right?

oceanclub

spockety wrote: »

*sigh*

Ok, ok, ok. I will be the one to tell you what you want to hear.

Dun Laoghaire is a unique and special place, it has pretty much everything one could hope for in an area to live.

Are you sure you're not thinking of Belmayne?



P.

bangersandmash

none wrote: »

I see most people believe it's rather 200K but, again, I think it's without the local knowledge. It's not Clondalkin or Ballymun after all. Not even Stillorgan or Swords. It may not be Ballsbridge but that's probably the only area I can think of right now that can, more or less deservedly, command better prices in Greater Dublin. Sorry for all the questions and doubts but I really just want to clarify it a bit for myself. And so really appreciate any input Ideally, I'd love to hear what people who know Dun Laoghaire well think. It's not that I'm biased towards Dun Laoghaire but I do believe it's one of few places that has everything for comfortable living.

Sounds like a very strong bias to me. I'd hardly class Dun Laoghaire as the second most desirable place to live in Dublin after Ballsbridge, or anywhere close to it. I've never really seen the appeal myself, and my experiences of the place would be similar to those of Stereo_steve. There's a reason why it's comparatively cheaper than say Blackrock or Sandymount.

I'm not trying to dissuade you OP as you've made up your mind and different people will naturally prefer different areas, especially if they have a strong affinity with an area. But don't expect everyone to share the same preferences. As I said before, I can't see where the demand will come from for 340K apartments 11km outside the city, now that investors have disappeared from the market.