NCHDs voting with their feet....chickens coming home to roost!

Jane5

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1128/1224259620164.html

Check out the above link. It has finally happened. However, note the attempt at a "solution", ie. "it's okay, we'll be abolishing a lot of NCHD places anyway", right after they admit that services will be affected by the lack of NCHDs when they are all taking off elsewhere.

Do they not get it at all?

Give NCHDs proper, protected and structured training, some degree of job security and decent work conditions that are enforceable. For the above most would gladly take some kind of a pay cut. Then they won't leave, and it will also work out cheaper (less agency staff, retention of our own graduates, drop in overtime payments).

RobFowl

Jane5 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1128/1224259620164.html

Give NCHDs proper, protected and structured training, some degree of job security and decent work conditions that are enforceable. For the above most would gladly take some kind of a pay cut. Then they won't leave, and it will also work out cheaper (less agency staff, retention of our own graduates, drop in overtime payments).

I think Jane is spot on here.
Plenty of Irish graduates go to the states (where the pay for NCHD's is far less) because the standard of post grad education, supervision, teaching and career progression is so much better and structured.
It's not all about the money despite the way it's being spun :rolleyes:

drzhivago

Jane5 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1128/1224259620164.html

Check out the above link. It has finally happened. However, note the attempt at a "solution", ie. "it's okay, we'll be abolishing a lot of NCHD places anyway", right after they admit that services will be affected by the lack of NCHDs when they are all taking off elsewhere.
ts).

Dont want to focus on the training myself, am at the end so hopefully have had all teh training I need BUT the reason we dont have EWTD in most hospitals is because we dont have enough doctors, i have worked in hospitals where they introduced the policy of dropping 2 SHOS for a new consultant, it meant the service lost the rotators who were covering leave when people went away
Now they dont have that they have to go and get locums or increase hours when hours are meant to be decreasing

In the longer run they want to drop NCHD numbers to 2,200

The maths just isnt working out

drzhivago

RobFowl wrote: »

I think Jane is spot on here.
Plenty of Irish graduates go to the states (where the pay for NCHD's is far less) because the standard of post grad education, supervision, teaching and career progression is so much better and structured.
It's not all about the money despite the way it's being spun :rolleyes:

I am sorry i did not go to the US much earlier in my career, pay is worse but not for very long, residency 3 years and then massive jump

Jane5

Hi Dr. Z,
Glad to hear you're getting on well across the water!
Could you tell me honestly, are the USMLEs as terrible as everyone makes out? I've never done them as people have put me off with stories of 9 hour MCQs and having to get time off to travel over to do the final step, etc, but am seriously considering it now to keep my options open. Surely they cannot be a whole pile worse than the medical memberships here, which I have done?
Thanks for any info!
Jane.

Traumadoc

I wonder where this story was picked up;)

Traumadoc wrote: »

There seems to have been a 50-60% drop in applications for NCHD positions , We are having real difficulties filling NCHD positions.
Huge drop in EU and Non-national applications.

Jane5

Well it has recently been made much more difficult for non-national NCHDs, they have introduced a six month only Stamp 2 visa for them which is contingent upon them receiving a contract of employment from the HSE, instead of the previous system of issuing them a Stamp 4 valid for two years regardless.
They have to pay to have it renewed every time, and HSE job applications for NCHDs now have a section where you are required to state whether you are an EU national or not, and whether you will require a work permit or not. And I'm sure that no discrimination takes place when going through the CVs, not at all.
Talk about shooting yourself in the freakin' foot!

DrIndy

Traumadoc wrote: »

I wonder where this story was picked up;)

You would be surprised how often journalists read boards.ie for stories and feedback!

Pete4779

Hey, I thought the pay was fantastic and all posts could be filled by the clamouring hordes of non-Irish doctors as the ungrateful Irish docs took off?

What happened to "fire them if they don't want to work here"?

What? BS? NEVER!

ergo

Jane5 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1128/1224259620164.html

just one line from that story

"The HSE plans to reduce their numbers by extinguishing two NCHD posts for each new consultant employed."

that policy is such a load of crap - I've seen it in action in an A+E situation where they managed to get a new consultant post so had to abolish an SHO post (or if the above policy was being adhered to they would have abolished 2 SHO posts) - the upshot - instead of 7 SHO's covering all the nights and unsocial hours there were only 6 SHO's covering these hours and much more stress put on an already tight roster

you can't really just "extinguish" NCHD posts if the consultants won't be doing nights etc

I know of one overseas trained NCHD that got offered 3 different jobs in 3 hospitals, all on the same day last week - these hospitals are going to seriously struggle to fill their ranks by the sound of it


and as a result of that the HSE is going to end up paying ridiculous amounts of money to locums and locum agencies to cover the gap. I'm already getting about 10 or 20 texts a day from locum agencies offering ridiculously lucrative short term locums in hospitals all over the country who obviously haven't got a full complement of NCHD's.

The whole thing is just short-sighted