Western Men are DOOMED!!! (maybe)

southsiderosie

Two regular columnists in the NY Times had an online debate about the status of Western men facing the rise of China...and women.

An excerpt:

David Brooks: I actually don’t care if this is genetic or cultural (to the extent there is a difference between these things). My point is that in a service economy, the ability to pick up social cues is a huge advantage.

Basically, I’m saying that two groups I’m a member of — Westernized men — may have been well adapted to the agricultural and industrial societies, but our thinking styles are not well adapted to the networked age of social information flows.

I’m not just saying the West is doomed. I think Western men, like me, are doomed unless we change and adapt quickly!

Gail Collins: Ah, what I hear is the sound of a group that was on top for so long and then goes into a funk at the first sign of really serious competition...As a gender, guys who were perfectly fine with the idea of women in business or in Congress are totally unnerved with the thought that their gender someday actually might not be running the show.

The one advantage China definitely has is its longer view of history. One day you’re perfecting gunpowder and toothpaste and moveable type — then you fall into a 500-year slump. There’s no inevitable winner — in fact, there doesn’t need to be a winner at all. We can all do fine...

...For Western men, the good news is that we Western women do not intend to maintain economic prowess on our own. You’re coming along, too. Otherwise, it really wouldn’t be any fun.

So are Western men really doomed? Are women really better at picking up social cues? And should we all be learning Mandarin?

(not sure this is the right thread, but I'll stick it in AH for now...)

extra-ordinary_

No

meditraitor

southsiderosie wrote: »

Two regular columnists in the NY Times ...)

stopped readin at this point, back to the daily mail fo me:D

Prof.Badass

China will never be economically more powerful than us because the white countries ahem, western world simply wouldn't let it happen.

Women will never have more power than men because a substantial amount of them will continue choosing children over their careers.

AnonoBoy

Western Men are dying out alright. Sure isn't only one of The Magnificent Seven still alive?

jimi_t

vinylmesh wrote: »

China will never be economically more powerful than us because the white countries ahem, western world simply wouldn't let it happen.

Sorry to let you know, but they pretty much are and are buying out large chunks of blue chip american businesses while the prices are nice and low.

hooradiation

vinylmesh wrote: »

China will never be economically more powerful than us because the white countries ahem, western world simply wouldn't let it happen.

You mean the way that China holds $798.9 billion worth of U.S. Treasuries, and Japan owns $751.5 billion worth of U.S. Treasuries (which is over 40% of total) would never be allowed to happen?

oops.

johnathan woss

Memo to Southsiderosie and the NY Times ..... The "service economy" is dead.

opinion guy

No
No
Yes

Lux23

vinylmesh wrote: »

China will never be economically more powerful than us because the white countries ahem, western world simply wouldn't let it happen.

.

That's what the British thought before they had to hand back almost all of their empire.

TheZohanS

southsiderosie wrote: »

So are Western men really doomed? Are women really better at picking up social cues? And should we all be learning Mandarin?

Whats with all the men vs women threads?

stevedublin

opinion guy wrote: »

No
No
Yes

could you explain and justify your opinions please?

AnonoBoy

TheZohan wrote: »

Whats with all the men vs women threads?

The battle of the sexes has escalated to a war I hear. Apparently troops are massing on the border as we speak.

typical male poster response wrote:

I'd like to mass on her border if you know what I mean.
Huh! Huh! Huh!

God damn it - that's exactly why the chicks are going to win this one.

opinion guy

stevedublin wrote: »

could you explain and justify your opinions please?

I could, but I actually have work to do so I'm not going to

CreepingDeath

southsiderosie wrote: »

Are women really better at picking up social cues?

No.

Last week there were 4 girls in a car in front of me in the fast lane of the M1 only doing 100kph.

I flashed (the lights) a couple of times and they didn't pick it up... had to undertake them.

southsiderosie

TheZohan wrote: »

Whats with all the men vs women threads?

Hm, I guess I saw this more of a "clash of civilizations" framework than purely gender...I loves the menfolk.

Prof.Badass

My mistake, I used the complete wrong words without thinking (was posting in a hurry). Basically i can never see a situation where china is a more developed nation than the countries of the western world. For the best part of this century at least, I can't see us working in factories for them while they take all the good jobs.

I don't know much about economics, but i thought a huge chunk of their economy is based on manufacturing goods for the west. What's their minimum wage? What sort of purchasing power does your average chinese person have?

Especially with their communist regime, I suspect the eu and us would start imposing trade restrictions and globalisation would cease, ultimately benifiting other countries, but stopping short of harming us.

Wagon

southsiderosie wrote: »

So are Western men really doomed? Are women really better at picking up social cues? And should we all be learning Mandarin?

No we aren't doomed. There's loads of factories in China working for pitiful pay because it's a communist country. And gender shouldn't be bought into it in the first place. The stupid bítch in the article just wanted to get a reaction.

southsiderosie

Wagon wrote: »

No we aren't doomed. There's loads of factories in China working for pitiful pay because it's a communist country. And gender shouldn't be bought into it in the first place. The stupid bítch in the article just wanted to get a reaction.

Actually the male columnist brought up the gender issue.

I think there is legitimate concern that nobody in the US government seems to have any long-term vision. The Chinese are investing billions in infrastructure and educating their young population. The US is pouring billions into Iraq and Afghanistan, and in the meantime our infrastructure is so bad that half of a major US city literally washed away in a storm. I worry that what's happened to California over the last 15 years (collapse of educational system, unaffordable housing, ridiculous taxes and regulation, political gridlock) is happening to the rest of the country, and it will be difficult to right the ship again.

Nevyn

Well what does it mean to be a man in western culture?
What do we tell young boys that they have to do as the aspire to grow into being men?
As certain jobs and roles in our society are no longer as gender defined what makes a man?

PFJSplitter

No...
NO!
Hahahahaha - No...

TheZohanS

Moved to The Cukoo's Nest, where it belongs.

Sarky

Oh noes! I'm DOOMED!

If I'm going down, I'm gonna take a lot of western women with me :pac:

extra-ordinary_

where's the thanks?

Sarky

It was surgically removed from TCN to stop girly care-bear style hippy love-ins. Real men don't need thanks, and looking for it is accepting this DOOM that's coming (maybe). Don't let the wet blanket girly girls win.

TheZohanS

extra-ordinary_ wrote: »

where's the thanks?

You can ask here.

Nerin

TheZohan wrote: »

Moved to The Cukoo's Nest, where it belongs.

delicious. om nom nom

Sarky

Tastes like After Hours. Sweaty.