looking for partner

mulrook1

I have a business ready to go but need a partner willing to fund it for me. The returns are very high for a small outlay. The partner would not need to work as its home based and can be run by one person. I had worked in this business for 15 years so i know it inside out. Would anyone have any ideas as to how i might find a partner?

Atlas_IRL

Do you actually need a partner or just funding? You will have to give equity to a partner. In terms of raising finance before the bank you can go to debtors, grant aid, personal cash, friends and equity.


Enterprise Ireland, local enterprise boards, banks would be the other options.

Depends on how much you are after really.

Tomthepost

mulrook1 wrote: »

I have a business ready to go but need a partner willing to fund it for me. The returns are very high for a small outlay. The partner would not need to work as its home based and can be run by one person. I had worked in this business for 15 years so i know it inside out. Would anyone have any ideas as to how i might find a partner?

Dont we all;)
I presume you have done a detailed business plan?
If not see
http://www.enterprise-ireland.com/StartBusiness/What+is+a+HPSU/BusinessPlan.htm
The first question I would ask you as a potential investor is If you have been in the business for 15 years and know it inside out how come you need a 'small outlay' in the first place.
My advise is that if you feel your business is fool proof then you don't need a partner just a professional business plan that can back this up.
Alternatively there are lots on online dating sites where you might find a partner!

mulrook1

First of all i was an employed in the business for 15 yrs, but let go as my employer took on a family member in my place. As for looking for a partner on a online dating site, sorry tomthepost i have a beautiful wife and 3 beautiful children, that end of my life needs no help thank you. But i would add that you need to check them out yourself as you seem to have noting better to do but send stupid answers to people. Get yourself a life your not very funny.

Linoge

mulrook1 wrote: »

First of all i was an employed in the business for 15 yrs, but let go as my employer took on a family member in my place. As for looking for a partner on a online dating site, sorry tomthepost i have a beautiful wife and 3 beautiful children, that end of my life needs no help thank you. But i would add that you need to check them out yourself as you seem to have noting better to do but send stupid answers to people. Get yourself a life your not very funny.

I thought Tom was pretty helpful! I doubt you are going to get any more help on here with a remark like above, especially from such a new member.

gaz wac

/Thread :mad:

betonit

mulrook1 wrote: »

First of all i was an employed in the business for 15 yrs, but let go as my employer took on a family member in my place. As for looking for a partner on a online dating site, sorry tomthepost i have a beautiful wife and 3 beautiful children, that end of my life needs no help thank you. But i would add that you need to check them out yourself as you seem to have noting better to do but send stupid answers to people. Get yourself a life your not very funny.

That was a humerous comment after he gave he some good advice. Outside of that if you think its not funny its not funny just leave it at that. There was no need for that response.

suey71

I think its nice that he put a bit of humour into his post, it shows he cares,:D.

OP everyone here gives advice differently, some may sound rude, abnoxious etc. but everyone means well and genuinly want to see each other do well.

Tom might have had a great day/ you may have had a bad one etc.etc.

Everyone gather round and have a group hug and then lets get back to writing our business plans.

RoadKillTs

But i would add that you need to check them out yourself as you seem to have noting better to do but send stupid answers to people. Get yourself a life your not very funny.

I suggest you ask Santa for a sense of humor this Christmas and maybe thicker skin if you have been really good.

mulrook1

Your right lifes too short for bad blood, and maybe i took him up wrong.

RoadKillTs

Your right lifes too short for bad blood, and maybe i took him up wrong.

Right so back OT. Do you need money or a partner?
If you just need the money maybe you could look for it elsewhere without having to give away any equity.

xabi

Whats the business?

maddogcollins

As above, is it money or a partner you need?

Money: get a detailed business plan together and start visiting banks, venture capitalist, credit unions etc..

Partner: If you have worked in the sector for 15 years you should have a few contacts. Without stepping on peoples toes (very hard to do in this case) approach them and see they are interested in a partnership or would know of other people in your situation who have been let go and want to make a new start.

Its not known from the OP what the industry/sector is so the above might not be relevant.

Tomthepost

mulrook1 wrote: »

Your right lifes too short for bad blood, and maybe i took him up wrong.

You did!
If you want to find an investor you will come across plenty more rude then me. Believe me I going through the process.
Sorry to hear about the job but many of us here are going through the same thing.
Good luck with the business but be prepared for a long hard slog if you are going to be successful.

mulrook1

xabi wrote: »

Whats the business?

Bookmaking, laying bets on the internet but not having the overheads bookmaker shops would have.

Linoge

Quote:
Originally Posted by mulrook1
I can take a joke but ive been let go from work and finding it very hard to get this business up and running. I thought his remark about dating sites was not funny.

Fair enough, but obviously people do not know the intricasies of your personal life and problems. It might have been an unhelpful remark, but it is by some who you don't know, on an internet message board and who owes you nothing.

I know you are new to boards, and maybe even message boards in general, so you have to realise that on here your online personality is very important. What you say to one poster is read by everyone, and people judge you on what you said. Ultimately people are on here for entertainment, not solely to help random passer by's with useful information, so keep a sense of humour on here in order to keep your head.

If you want professional advice, without smart arse remarks, pay an accountant. If you want some free advise go to a message board and be nice, but you have to take the rough with the smooth. Don;t take everything (or anything) personally.

Hope this helps you a bit more on here.
Cormac

shoutman

Mod note: Lads and ladies you know yourself, please stay on topic, no personal abuse etc.

Mulrook1, do you not think the big sites have this market cornered? I don't see where your niche or USP is.

antog86

As per Shoutman, i would have thought this market was sown up, NO? You have me interested now though, so please explain rationale and why you can survive where the likes of Dermot Desmond is struggling (Betdaq). High cost industry to compete in i would guess!

mulrook1

I dont want to open a new exchange business. What i want to do is lay horses (act as a bookmaker) on the betfair site. I know most of the people working in the business, so i can get all the information of the day. I want to lay only one horse in a race (Not like bookmakers who lay most in a race) and hope that horse LOSES for me to win. I would have done all my homework on this race, do they need a run, would they like the ground, the trip, etc etc. If you lay only one horse in a race of ten then you hope any of the other nine win, which means you win. Another advantage i have is i can talk to the people in the know (Business) this is a part of the business you must have.

xabi

mulrook1 wrote: »

I dont want to open a new exchange business. What i want to do is lay horses (act as a bookmaker) on the betfair site. I know most of the people working in the business, so i can get all the information of the day. I want to lay only one horse in a race (Not like bookmakers who lay most in a race) and hope that horse LOSES for me to win. I would have done all my homework on this race, do they need a run, would they like the ground, the trip, etc etc. If you lay only one horse in a race of ten then you hope any of the other nine win, which means you win. Another advantage i have is i can talk to the people in the know (Business) this is a part of the business you must have.

Not sure if im understanding this. If i want to place a bet on a race and goto your site, i only have the option of betting on the horse you think will lose?

X.

mulrook1

No anyone using betfair can back or lay any horse they want. But i would only lay the horse i think will lose.

antog86

Got you now. So you need a partner to put capital in behind you to ensure that you can take a hit on a couple of races in a rowe etc and still be able to lay on the next race.

Its interesting, but you would need to demonstrate credentials to anybody willing to put money behind you. I think you will struggle here! After all this is gambling and not a business!

However, if you can get set up there is definitely money to be made. I have a friend who does this part time. He earned in excess of 22k profit last year (tax free). A nice touch if you can get it.

xabi

How do you get the punters to back 'your' horse? If i goto befair and decide to place a bet on Red Rum in the 1:30 in Mallow, how do you get my custom?

X.

mickos

mulrook1 wrote: »

I dont want to open a new exchange business. What i want to do is lay horses (act as a bookmaker) on the betfair site. I know most of the people working in the business, so i can get all the information of the day. I want to lay only one horse in a race (Not like bookmakers who lay most in a race) and hope that horse LOSES for me to win. I would have done all my homework on this race, do they need a run, would they like the ground, the trip, etc etc. If you lay only one horse in a race of ten then you hope any of the other nine win, which means you win. Another advantage i have is i can talk to the people in the know (Business) this is a part of the business you must have.

This doesn't sound like a business to me. More like you are looking for someone to fund your gambling. Good luck with that.

antog86

xabi wrote: »

How do you get the punters to back 'your' horse? If i goto befair and decide to place a bet on Red Rum in the 1:30 in Mallow, how do you get my custom?

X.

You place a bet of €10 on red rum in Mallow at 3.0 (2 to 1). I on the otherside say that i wish to lay red rum at 3.0 (2 to 1). So all the backing funds at that price are put in a pool, and matched against all the laying funds on a first come first serve basis. I never actually kn ow who im backing with......

Hope that partly explains the concept

xabi

Im out.

X.

shoutman

I'm sorry but your concept is void. There is a reason why bookmakers have a book for the entire field in a race, its because it is +ev for them to do so.

What you are looking to do is a very small scale version and in my opinion definately not a business.

Fair enough do it on the side through betfair or what have you but please don't think for one second that this is an investable business.

Bandara

This is simply not in any way shapoe or form a proposal that any investor would ever go for.

You are lookig for a slush fund to start gambling with, and no matter how much knowledge/tip offs etc etc etc you have its still blatently a gamble.

And what really would wind me up is that you could get your hands on ten grand easily to start off this venture with your own money and if after 3-6 months you have twenty grand then you can go to an investor and pitch the idea with proven success.

Just my opinion but no one is going to go near it, there is thousands of people doing what your doing every single day.

Spinnaker

mulrook1 wrote: »

I have a business ready to go but need a partner willing to fund it for me.

It's getting easier and easier to get into that 'space' but many have been burnt. It seems to be both ready and successful in that business a partner will need to see or provide

1. A license. Are you a licensed bookmaker for 'online' in Ireland or say Malta (Class 4?). If Ireland beware of draft bill passing through the committee stages.

2. Liquidity.. you are looking. I doubt small outlays will suffice ? Gotta be asking for it all in traunches to be credible I'd say.

3. A large contact base. Assuming you have an opt-in one from your past. Right ?

4. A unique proposition for the punter. So many "samey" sites out there.The one you have reads too much like investor gambling for me. It seems you are trying to identify one. Keep it up.

5. Knowledge. You got 15 years of it :-)

mulrook1

antog86 wrote: »

You place a bet of €10 on red rum in Mallow at 3.0 (2 to 1). I on the otherside say that i wish to lay red rum at 3.0 (2 to 1). So all the backing funds at that price are put in a pool, and matched against all the laying funds on a first come first serve basis. I never actually kn ow who im backing with......

Hope that partly explains the concept

Your right to a point. All english accounts in betfair are pools (betting and laying against another person) but the irish side of things is done against betfair itself. Anyway some people think what i want to do is gambling, well then you could say the bookmakers gamble. They take a bet off you and if you win they lose, same as having a bet? To a point yes. Do bookmakers lose, yes they can lose on a book (meaning a race they took bets on) Can they win, also yes they can, more times than they lose.
Its not a gambling fund im looking for, its a fund to run a business that i know inside out.

Bandara

mulrook1 wrote: »

Your right to a point. All english accounts in betfair are pools (betting and laying against another person) but the irish side of things is done against betfair itself. Anyway some people think what i want to do is gambling, well then you could say the bookmakers gamble. They take a bet off you and if you win they lose, same as having a bet? To a point yes. Do bookmakers lose, yes they can lose on a book (meaning a race they took bets on) Can they win, also yes they can, more times than they lose.
Its not a gambling fund im looking for, its a fund to run a business that i know inside out.

Ok, lets say I come to you and say there is 50k off you go.

How are you going to turn that into a profit, what % profit are you predicting, how do you come to that %, in what time frame will you acheive that profit ?

mulrook1

This all depends on unit stakes, the more you stake, the bigger the profit.

arctictree

To be honest, everything in business is a gamble/risk and we make money by stacking the odds in our favour with knowledge that we hope the competition aren't aware of.

IF the OP thinks that he has better knowledge than others in this business and can therefore offer better odds which will attract punters but still make an overall profit, then I dont see why this would not work. (But that is a big IF!).

I am curious though why you would need investment. Would it not be better to throw a few grand in yourself and then slowly build it up over time and build an undisputable track record?

Then a year down the road, you have a much stronger business proposition.

Tomthepost

I know nothing about this area to be honest but from what you have said there seems to be a lot of ifs, buts and maybes.
As suggested before if you are serious about this business I really think you should really do a proper business plan including financial predictions for the business.
Once you got the christmas tree standing its easy to decorate it and all that.
(Just a saying easy now!)

nice1franko

mulrook1 wrote: »

... What i want to do is lay horses (act as a bookmaker) on the betfair site. I know most of the people working in the business, so i can get all the information of the day. I want to lay only one horse in a race ... and hope that horse LOSES for me to win.

^^^
This is gambling - no two ways about it.

If you're so good at picking losers you'd have a respectable balance already and wouldn't be looking for someone to bankroll you.

mulrook1

Was employee in the business and pay bills like everyone else. If you know anyone in this business ask them the kind of pay we are on. As for the gambling bit, no two ways about it you know best. ITS NOT GAMBLING ITS LAYING. Anyone and i mean anyone that gambles will lose, and if they won a sum of money its only a loan from the bookie, they always give it back and MORE. To be honest i used to hate watching people lose their money to the bookie, thats one of the reasons i want to lay against BETFAIR the company.

suey71

Maybe I'm out of line here/call me nosey but how much money would set you up?

nice1franko

mulrook1 wrote: »

ITS NOT GAMBLING ITS LAYING.

Laying can be gambling as much as backing can be gambling. Laying a single selection in a race is gambling. You may have +EV with insider knowledge but it still pure and simple gambling.

mulrook1 wrote: »

i used to hate watching people lose their money to the bookie, thats one of the reasons i want to lay against BETFAIR the company.

You can't lay against Betfair. All they do is provide a website where people can bet against each other (and charge commish - a real business).

Bookies use BF but so do people and you've no idea who's money you're taking (or who you'll be giving it to :pac:)... They make their commission regardless of who wins or loses.

Anyway, good luck. You'll need it.

mulrook1

suey71 wrote: »

Maybe I'm out of line here/call me nosey but how much money would set you up?

All depends on how much you want to lay them for.............

mulrook1

nice1franko wrote: »

Laying can be gambling as much as backing can be gambling. Laying a single selection in a race is gambling. You may have +EV with insider knowledge but it still pure and simple gambling.


You can't lay against Betfair. All they do is provide a website where people can bet against each other (and charge commish - a real business).

Bookies use BF but so do people and you've no idea who's money you're taking (or who you'll be giving it to :pac:)... They make their commission regardless of who wins or loses.

Anyway, good luck. You'll need it.

Sorry but you do lay against betfair on the irish side, but against other accounts in any other part of the world, inc (England) They used to have the irish accounts against each other but they got so big they had no choice but to change. Their biggest problem was the exchange rate between all the accounts in Ireland and in England. Check it ouy Betfair free phone number 1800944777 tell them i sent you. haha

Bandara

Mulrook,

With respect you came here asking for advice etc, several people myself included have asked you relevant questions concerning the business and expected returns, etc etc

You have not answered any of them, instead you are going on about betfair England and betfair Ireland which is utterly irrelevant. If you are sure you can lay the correct horse then the person you lay it too is irrelevant because once the horse loses you win.

Also you have been asked several times about how much you would require, you keep saying 'that depends on how much you want to lay them for", well I'm sorry but no it doesn't. The amount you require is a fixed amount that you should have worked out based on the probabilities of the horses you are laying, and the chances that you will sometimes lose. For example if you ask me how much I need to play 1/2 NL holdem professionally the answer is I need 25 buyins, of which a buyin is going to be €200, so I need €200 x 25 = €5,000 in order to be able to make my advantage at this level pay and also allowing me to account for the envitable variance that goes with any form of gambling (ie the miracle card will sometimes appear). the fact you do not seem to have a similar equation is scary.

By your reply of 'that depends on how much you want to lay them for" it sounds like you are putting your eggs in one basket, you should never ever have more than 5% of your bankroll on the line at any one time. You are aware of that I presume?

And finally its been asked a few times why do you not just start yourself with a seed of 10k, and watch it grow. Once you have proven success you will either 1.) no longer require a backer or 2.) be able to attract a backer based on your proven results. Again you have failed to answer that. And if its the case that you have no money then immediately all your credibility goes out the window, as for someone to work in such an industry for 15 years and never to have made anything out of the experience but then to suddenly to announce that its a failsafe way to make money ! This does not really sound very convincing.

I'm sorry if it feels like your being attacked here but I'm getting frustrated (and I get the sense that others are too) by your lack of any detail/proof/knowledge of what you are proposing.

Its simply seems like you want to be a professional gambler with others money. And yes laying is the same as backing, except instead of you cheering for your horse to win, you are cheering for it to lose.

So in summary, what is the business plan?, projected %'s of profit? over what period of time? Why do you not simply start of yourself with a small sum? How much do you require and why?

Regards
HT.

arctictree

Mulrook - Would love to know how you are getting on here! I am tinkering around with an idea in the same area myself...

mulrook1

Hello arctictree im finding out that there is still lots of people ouy there with funds to invest. Im not doing too well from this site, but i really wanted to see what people think first. Anyway i took a few adds out in some of the news papers and found this very helpful. I have two people to see and funny thing one knew me from the races. Hes a horse owner and knows the game which is a help. The other is an invester who i was sending my picks to for the last week and he found this business outstanding. Yes thats the word he used. I gave him 14 picks on tuesday, all lost (WHICH MEANS WE WOULD HAVE WON), wed only 9 picks all lost, thur 12 picks 11 lost and one won, fri 13 picks 12 lost and one non runner, sat 19 picks 18 lost and 1 won. Anyway thats 67 picks, 65 winning for us and only 2 losing. Also i was writing some picks to another person on this site and he would have won on all my picks except one yesterday to make him a very good profit for the two days. To cut a long story short im sure i have an invester.
I would like to thank all the people who answered this message and sorry to the person who i took up wrong at the start, hope you all have a nice Christmas and ill let you all know how i get on in time.

mulrook1

Hello halfthetrack, thanks for taking an intrest in my business. As you were sending me private messages on this site asking how the business works and investing in it, well you should know by now with all the winning lays i have sent you. Anyway I hope you got some FREE MONEY or maybe some QUICK CASH because i cant give you any more QUICK PAYDAY LOANS as you made all the money from my picks. All i can say to you is dont gamble or give tips for horses because the bookies are the only ones to give you a HAIRCUT (Take your money) Best bet of the lot is to open a SMALL BARBERS and give them a haircut!
I think you know what i mean, Sorry my private message service is now CLOSED.

arctictree

OK, a bit off topic but does anyone know if is it illegal to setup a betting website in Ireland? Do you need a license for it?!