New Van With TACHO

fiestaman

Hi i am a parts sales rep for a commercial company. they have just bought a new transit van noting special just a van not over 3.5 tonnes. anyway theres a tacho fiited in it and i was woundering if it has to be used,say they dont require me to use it but because its in it do i have to use it. im very upset really because im employed as a rep and not a lorry driver,seems to me they want to keep track of me day which is strange im with them 2yrs and my sales are always spot on. anyone any info on this??

R.O.R

fiestaman wrote: »

Hi i am a parts sales rep for a commercial company. they have just bought a new transit van noting special just a van not over 3.5 tonnes. anyway theres a tacho fiited in it and i was woundering if it has to be used,say they dont require me to use it but because its in it do i have to use it. im very upset really because im employed as a rep and not a lorry driver,seems to me they want to keep track of me day which is strange im with them 2yrs and my sales are always spot on. anyone any info on this??

Is there a tow bar on the back of the Van? If so, then the Gross Train Weight (I think it's called) is over 3.5 ton so technically it needs a Tacho. I think this is another of those rules on commercials that is widely ignored.

Alternatively, it's possible the Transit was built like that specifically for a customer who then cancelled the order and it went in to Ford stock. I know Ford have been giving some very good discounts on Vans that have been in stock for over 365 days.

fiestaman

hi yea i think there is a hitch and i think your right, id say it was a cancelled order because they said they got it at a price they couldnt refuse. so because its in it it will have to be used then??

R.O.R

fiestaman wrote: »

so because its in it it will have to be used then??

Technically yes, but you'd have to meet someone very clued up on the regulations to know it needs a Tacho because of the hitch.

You might be best off on the 4x4 forum - I think the Mod Slidey is a DOE tester so might know more than I do.

Anan1

OP - I'll move this thread to the 4x4 forum if you like?

gofaster_s13

Unless you are pulling a trailer and grossing more than 3.5 tonnes you do not need to use a tacho just make sure it is a 3.5 tonne transit as we have seen a few here for DOE with a 3,560 gross weight which look like the standard Transits in every way, the weights sticker is on the passanger door piller.

darragh o meara

to the letter of the law yes you need to use it when the wieght is over 3.5 tonne. The traffic corp have been doing a lot of checks recently and have mobile wieght scales at the roadside. The majority of the corp have machines to check tacho cards now also. To be honest the new tacho systems are fairly worry free ie. Insert card and go.. If i was in your sutuation i would just apply for the card and use it saving any problems further on.

trad

Omeara_darragh wrote: »

to the letter of the law yes you need to use it when the wieght is over 3.5 tonne. The traffic corp have been doing a lot of checks recently and have mobile wieght scales at the roadside. The majority of the corp have machines to check tacho cards now also. To be honest the new tacho systems are fairly worry free ie. Insert card and go.. If i was in your sutuation i would just apply for the card and use it saving any problems further on.

You can only drive 90 hours a fortnite with a tacho, max 9 hours per day with some exceptions, have a 45 minute break after 4.5 hours driving and have at least 36 hours contineous rest once a week meaning you can't drive it as a car over the week end. If it is not required you don't have to use it. Check the GDW of your van. Some high capacity transits may have a DGW of over 3.5 tonne.

fiestaman

Anan1 wrote: »

OP - I'll move this thread to the 4x4 forum if you like?

no il leave it here, i think i have all the answers now. Just one thing maybe ye are not getting, the van is not over 3.5tonne and will never have a trailer--so my question is...do i still have to use a card if the van is going to be just a van under 3.5 tonne OR do i have to use it just because its fitted with it?

gofaster_s13

fiestaman wrote: »

no il leave it here, i think i have all the answers now. Just one thing maybe ye are not getting, the van is not over 3.5tonne and will never have a trailer--so my question is...do i still have to use a card if the van is going to be just a van under 3.5 tonne OR do i have to use it just because its fitted with it?

If its not grossing more than 3.5 tonnes you do not need to use the tacho.

milltown

Please clarify. If the "Design GVW" as stamped on the chassis plate is over 3500kg is the tacho required to be used? i.e. Regardless of whether there's anything hitched up to it. I'm sure there's thousands of 3.5 tonne Transits on the roads that will never come next or near to weighing 3.5 tonnes all-in, delivering clothes, toys, crisps, pillows and any other bulky but light goods.

If the tacho has to be used then there's also an onus on his employer to keep the records, no? Aren't the guards allowed to request tacho cards up to two years old or something?

R.O.R

milltown wrote: »

Please clarify. If the "Design GVW" as stamped on the chassis plate is over 3500kg is the tacho required to be used? i.e. Regardless of whether there's anything hitched up to it. I'm sure there's thousands of 3.5 tonne Transits on the roads that will never come next or near to weighing 3.5 tonnes all-in, delivering clothes, toys, crisps, pillows and any other bulky but light goods.

If the tacho has to be used then there's also an onus on his employer to keep the records, no? Aren't the guards allowed to request tacho cards up to two years old or something?

The Design GVW of the van will be under 3.5Ton (as stated by the OP). Most of the Vans on the road are under 3.5Ton so don't need a Tacho.

The unusual thing about this case is the Gross Train Weight is over 3.5Ton due to the Tow Bar. As long as there is a Tow Bar the vehicle will always have a capability of weighing over 3.5Ton if fully laden and towing. Whether this means he needs the tacho on or not - I haven't a clue. The above information was given to me by a very knowlegeable dealer when I was ordering a couple of 350LWB Transits with tow bars.

Second question I'd ask is whether the driver is OK on a B licence to drive a van that needs a tacho as it's over 3.5Ton train weight?

cormie

Jeez, them tacho's sound like a pain :eek:

ROR, if a transit is 3.5tn GVW, and you fit a tow bar, does that mean a B license isn't good enough anymore if your GTW is over 3.5tn?

I thought the combined weight of the trailer/towed item plus van had to be under 3.5tn if the GVW was 3.5tn? As in, if you want to tow a car, you can't have a van full of books at the same time

Slidey

Any van that is 3.5t gross will have a train weight over over 3.5t and should have a tacho fitted. The vast majority of them don't though.

I would be quite confident that the van was for Leaseplan. They are the only people I have seen fitting them to LGV vans for the purposes of towing a trailer.

You do not have to use the tacho unless you are over 3.5t. AFAIK you would also need an EC1 licence to drive a van and trailer in excess of 3.5t

You should probably just get it removed to save grief if you are not going to need it

R.O.R

cormie wrote: »

Jeez, them tacho's sound like a pain :eek:

ROR, if a transit is 3.5tn GVW, and you fit a tow bar, does that mean a B license isn't good enough anymore if your GTW is over 3.5tn?

I thought the combined weight of the trailer/towed item plus van had to be under 3.5tn if the GVW was 3.5tn? As in, if you want to tow a car, you can't have a van full of books at the same time

Ermmmm.......

TBH, haven't a clue on the ins and outs of the regulations, just know what I've stated above.

Come to think of it, I've a good few Sprinter 313's on the road with Tow Bars and Tacho's. Didn't think anything of it at order time as they are specced the same as their UK vans.

Marlow

R.O.R wrote: »

Second question I'd ask is whether the driver is OK on a B licence to drive a van that needs a tacho as it's over 3.5Ton train weight?

You'd need a B/E license, once you hitch a trailer on it. As long you're not hauling anything and the gross weight is 3.5t or less you are ok on a B license. Tacho makes no difference to that rule.

/M

fiestaman

right im back again and this is me last post on this. i only have a full car licence so i cant drive a van over 3.5tonne. but do i need a lorry licence to avail of a tacho card???

Slidey

For a drivers tacho card I believe you do.

corktina

take off the towbar, then youve no need for a tacho... dont worry about it, you are fine to drive a standard transit under 3 1/2 tonnes on your license.

R.O.R

corktina wrote: »

take off the towbar, then youve no need for a tacho... dont worry about it, you are fine to drive a standard transit under 3 1/2 tonnes on your license.

That would be my suggestion to. If you never plan on towing anything, just un bolt it.

cormie

Give you a tenner for it

Leman-Russ

Right I will keep this simple:
IF a commercial vehicle of any kind has a tacho fitted it MUST be used NO exceptions.(Including operating under the weight limit)

However if you want to remove it you will have to get the van replated at a DOE center with the towbar "permenantly" removed and a new GVW plate fitted under the threshold weight.

corktina

thats not so easy on a transit, usually they are integral with the dash...

Slidey

Leman-Russ wrote: »

Right I will keep this simple:
IF a commercial vehicle of any kind has a tacho fitted it MUST be used NO exceptions.(Including operating under the weight limit)

However if you want to remove it you will have to get the van replated at a DOE center with the towbar "permenantly" removed and a new GVW plate fitted under the threshold weight.

Replated?

I would be interested to know what you mean by this.

As the GVW is below 3500kg it would not need to be ''Measured & Plated'' like a HGV.

If you mean the manufacturers plate, well tbh you are also wrong. The train weight on the manufacturers plate is often over 3500 and has no meaning in the DOE test. It is not even checked nor mentioned in the testers manual.

A DOE centre cannot alter a manufacturers plate either up or down. This is solely the job of the manufacturer, or a Dept approved vehicle engineer in the case of uprating or adding weights.

Leman-Russ

In the case of the OP the van is plated over 3,495kg and has a tacho fitted which is the problem.

And yes the DOE can up or downrate a vehicle so long as it does not exceed the designed GVW for the vehicle.

Slidey

Leman-Russ wrote: »

In the case of the OP the van is plated over 3,495kg and has a tacho fitted which is the problem.

No, it has to be over 3500kg. The tacho is only for when it is towing a trailer and its weight exceeds 3500kg.

Here is some bed time reading for you. Take note of exemption No. 1

Leman-Russ wrote: »

And yes the DOE can up or downrate a vehicle so long as it does not exceed the designed GVW for the vehicle.

Complete shyte.

The only people in this country who can down plate are the manufacturers. AFAIK the only manufacturer in the country is Harris and that is because he used to assemble Hinos in Dublin.

I have seen 4.6t Sprinters down plated to 3.5t but it supposed to be done in Germany

The reason they don't allow down plating in this country but do in the UK is because Paddy will downplate a van so he can drive it on a car licence but he will still freight it to its original DGVW (and probably more)