It was 20 years ago today....

mike65

Does anyone think it would have been better if the Iron Cutain never buckled? Did we gain anything apart from cheap pumbing and <snip>?

AnonoBoy

mike65 wrote: »

Does anyone think it would have been better if the Iron Cutain never buckled? Did we gain anything apart from cheap pumbing and <snip>?

Do not badmouth <snip> you heartless fiend. :mad:

ejmaztec

The Russian mafia would have stayed at home, and the likes of Abramovich would only have been worth a couple of Rubles.

...and I wouldn't be getting spam emails from some single mother called Tatiana, on the scrounge for an oil heater.

GavRedKing

Would be interesting to see how the global downturn would have effected the countries behind it, sure some of them are not so well off now but back then :eek:

Pacing Mule

It was 20 years ago today

Sgt. Pepper taught the band to play
They've been going in and out of style
But they're guaranteed to raise a smile.
So may I introduce to you
The act you've known for all these years,
Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band.

I expected a Beatles thread

AckwelFoley

The walls down?

Menengroth™

ejmaztec wrote: »

The Russian mafia would have stayed at home, and the likes of Abramovich would only have been worth a couple of Rubles.

...and I wouldn't be getting spam emails from some single mother called Tatiana, on the scrounge for an oil heater.

WHAT

she told me i was the only one!?

she lied to me =[

topper75

I used to love all those parades on TV with the missiles and stuff.

Seriously though, I wouldn't wish that regime type on anyone. I always observe a strong 'suspicion' culture from people who come from these territories. They had 3 or 4 generations of secret police and informers etc. and it seems to have warped them indefinately, even affecting people under 20 today. Hopefully they'll lighten up some day.

SEPT 23 1989

far too many footballing banana skins of countries since that bloody wall came down,bring back the Soviet team:D

ejmaztec

topper75 wrote: »

I used to love all those parades on TV with the missiles and stuff.

Seriously though, I wouldn't wish that regime type on anyone. I always observe a strong 'suspicion' culture from people who come from these territories. They had 3 or 4 generations of secret police and informers etc. and it seems to have warped them indefinately, even affecting people under 20 today. Hopefully they'll lighten up some day.

Now, the Russians "think" that they're living in a democracy, but they just swapped flags.:eek:

4zn76tysfajdxp

ejmaztec wrote: »

Now, the Russians "think" that they're living in a democracy, but they just swapped flags.:eek:

And you "think" you've used sarcastic quotations "marks" correctly, but you're "wrong."

ejmaztec

Esteban Dry Forearm wrote: »

And you "think" you've used sarcastic quotations "marks" correctly, but you're "wrong."

Neamhshuntasach

Seems to be a fair few people who didn't like the collapse of the wall. Or free market capitalism.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/8347409.stm

Wazdakka

Esteban Dry Forearm wrote: »

And you "think" you've used sarcastic quotations "marks" correctly, but you're "wrong."

That's a bit pointlessly confrontational for this early in the week Esteban Dry Forearm.

ScumLord

snyper wrote: »

The walls down?

So much for German build quality, there's a wall out the back of my house that's at least 100 years old and it doesn't even have any mortar holding it together.

mike65

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

Seems to be a fair few people who didn't like the collapse of the wall. Or free market capitalism.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/8347409.stm

You can tell which countries used to get military support from USSR (the ones who think its demise was a bad thing)

orourkeda

I thinks its fair that the wall coming down didnt really change the course of history as it was suggested at the time. Communism was going to fall anyway and Europe probably wouldnt be much different today had it stayed up

peasant

Purely viewed through German glasses it was a vast missed opportunity.

There could (and should) have been a re-think about the basic values and the general make-up of German society. The German people were supposed to give themselves a new constitution upon re-unification.

But that didn't happen, there was no re-unification. Just an anexxation of the GDR into the BRD. In their minds, the German people is still very much more devided than unified.

ejmaztec

Wazdakka wrote: »

That's a bit pointlessly confrontational for this early in the week Frada.

I must have been right, because he knew that I was being sarcastic.:pac:

GLaDOS

ScumLord wrote: »

So much for German build quality, there's a wall out the back of my house that's at least 100 years old and it doesn't even have any mortar holding it together.

Shoddy, shoddy worksmanship!

IIMII

mike65 wrote: »

Does anyone think it would have been better if the Iron Cutain never buckled? Did we gain anything apart from cheap pumbing and hungarianhoneys.com?

No. For a start, many European states saw their first opportunity for independence come about. It had to go. With a bit of luck, things will settle down over time.

ejmaztec

Irish tourism got screwed because the Dutch, French and Germans headed East.

.....and then there's Dell.:eek:

Procasinator

ejmaztec wrote: »

You were wrong. They do think the live in a democracy, so the quotation marks should not be around the "think. Unless you mean to say they don't really think much at all.

I don't know why he quoted "marks" and "wrong." though. Maybe you weren't really wrong!

ejmaztec

Procasinator wrote: »

You were wrong. They do think the live in a democracy, so the quotation marks should not be around the "think. Unless you mean to say they don't really think much at all.

I don't know why he quoted "marks" and "wrong." though. Maybe you weren't really wrong!

They think that they have a democracy, but thanks to Putin, they haven't. Anyone daring to criticise the lack of democracy ends up in a heap of trouble.

galah

peasant wrote: »

Purely viewed through German glasses it was a vast missed opportunity.

There could (and should) have been a re-think about the basic values and the general make-up of German society. The German people were supposed to give themselves a new constitution upon re-unification.

But that didn't happen, there was no re-unification. Just an anexxation of the GDR into the BRD. In their minds, the German people is still very much more devided than unified.

and don't forget the "solidarity" tax that (West)Germans are still (to my knowledge anyway) are paying, 20 years on...

Now there's an idea for this government...

HalloweenJack

For one thing, under communism everyone had a job. Wages obviously wouldn't have been great but there was no unemployment. How is that a bad thing?

In East Germany, things still aren't matching up to the West. Wages are still lower and unemployment is higher.

Yes, the personal liberty is infinitely better but the free market isn't as great as it's made out to be. Just look at the **** we're in at the moment and look at what happened in Russia after the transition.

Pygmalion

To be fair in the Soviet Union women for one (that's 50% of the population) are generally accepted to have had it much better than they do now AFAIK.
Women and the newly unemployed could easily form a majority so I'm not that surprised so many people said that they dislike the fall of the USSR.

ScumLord

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Shoddy, shoddy worksmanship!

If only they'd done it Reich the first time.

Rented Mule

I remember exactly where I was at.

I was in the backseat of my new Mustang with my friend's cousin who was in from Germany .....I was trying to get her iron knickers to fall.

Anytime Bono wants to play a concert for this momentous occassion, I am more than willing to recreate this moment.

Jax Teller

The wall didn't cum till 10th November ,

Dudess

Can't believe this hasn't been mentioned - on an internet discussion forum of all places:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=terYQRjnATM

KindOfIrish

mike65 wrote: »

Does anyone think it would have been better if the Iron Cutain never buckled?

Does anyone think it would have been better if the Republic of Ireland never become independent state? Does anyone think it would have been better if Germany won WW II? Does anyone think it would have been better if apartheid never ended in South Africa?
You should think first before posting such questions.:mad:

m3llowship

Pageant Messiah wrote: »

I expected a Beatles thread

You and me both!

Got wicked excited!

HalloweenJack

KindOfIrish wrote: »

You should think first before posting such questions.:mad:

What's wrong with the question?

Dudess

KindOfIrish wrote: »

You should think first before posting such questions.:mad:

You should be less black and white about the issue - watch Goodbye Lenin. Great film.

mike65

Dudess I despair about the IQ of so many here!*


*note for the terminally stoopid, I was being dead pan sarcastic. I would have thought reference to plumbling and glossy porn might be a clue.

TheZohanS

mike65 wrote: »

Dudess I despair about the IQ of so many here!*


*note for the terminally stoopid, I was being dead pan sarcastic. I would have thought reference to plumbling and glossy porn might be a clue.

Maybe they expected more from your post mike65.

I know I did.