Ireland (somehow) moves up the prosperity and wellbeing index of 2009 to #11

ei.sdraob

Well i figure we need some good news around this forum for once

Ireland moves from #20 to #11
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legatum_Prosperity_Index

the index measures 44 different indicators

UK is @ #12
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/6438706/UK--fails-to-make-top-10-prosperous-nations.html


here is the full report (loads of graphs included)
http://prosperity.com/downloads/2009LegatumProsperityIndexReport.pdf

Rob67

Interestingly, people seem to be more focused on the negatives in the economy than they are in this rather positive report! It is good news, but I'm sure someone will eventually find a negative aspect to it (I'm surmising that it's taking a bit of time!)

Here's hoping for more positive reportage!!!:)

musky

[font=Comic Sans MS, Courier New, Arial]Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. 14% of people know that.[/font] - Homer Simpson

enough said

Dannyboy83

Those numbers on page 4 look wonky. Uber Wonky.

Health Got 2?
France got 14 for health, despite having the best health system in the world?

Economic Fundamentals got 5???
Who the fcuk conducted the tests? John McCain?
Perhaps the testing was conducted before we started borrowing 2 billion per month?

Governance, 15? WTF?

The area where we scored worst, personal freedom, was the area where we should have scored best (I guess the blasphemy laws killed it)

Rob67

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Those numbers on page 4 look wonky. Uber Wonky.

Health Got 2?
France got 14 for health, despite having the best health system in the world?

Economic Fundamentals got 5???
Who the fcuk conducted the tests? John McCain?
Perhaps the testing was conducted before we started borrowing 2 billion per month?

Governance, 15? WTF?

The area where we scored worst, personal freedom, was the area where we should have scored best (I guess the blasphemy laws killed it)

It took a while, but the prize for the first person to find the negatives goes to:......... Dannyboy!!

Ehem... well there would have been a prize except the country (nor I) couldn't really afford it!

Well done, anyway!!:D

Chris_533976

Very surprised that North Korea isnt in the bottom 20.

nesf

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Health Got 2?
France got 14 for health, despite having the best health system in the world?

I've never seen any data that suggests that France has the best healthcare system in the world, though yes, Ireland ranking 2nd is a bit weird. We've a decent healthcare system but nothing special.

ei.sdraob

nesf wrote: »

I've never seen any data that suggests that France has the best healthcare system in the world, though yes, Ireland ranking 2nd is a bit weird. We've a decent healthcare system but nothing special.

thats not a rank of 2nd

thats a score for that criteria, the lower the better

greendom

nesf wrote: »

I've never seen any data that suggests that France has the best healthcare system in the world, though yes, Ireland ranking 2nd is a bit weird. We've a decent healthcare system but nothing special.

http://ezinearticles.com/?France-Has-the-Best-Healthcare-System-in-the-World&id=2643603

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

http://healthcare-economist.com/2008/04/14/health-care-around-the-world-an-introduction/

Slugs

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Those numbers on page 4 look wonky. Uber Wonky.

Health Got 2?
France got 14 for health, despite having the best health system in the world?

Economic Fundamentals got 5???
Who the fcuk conducted the tests? John McCain?
Perhaps the testing was conducted before we started borrowing 2 billion per month?

Governance, 15? WTF?

The area where we scored worst, personal freedom, was the area where we should have scored best (I guess the blasphemy laws killed it)

It's wiki, expect nothing less...

dvpower

I dunno why, but I tend to distrust reports by institutions whose logo is an archer standing on a horse drawn chariot.

(I guess I should have a quick read anyway)

bangersandmash

I think there may be some lag in how their rankings are calculated.

Ireland has a low unemployment rate of 4.6%, however, annual inflation rate, at nearly 5%, is well above the European average. Contrastingly, the number of non-performing loans in Ireland is extremely low

http://www.prosperity.com/country.aspx?id=EI

I wonder where we will be positioned in the list next year. Closer to our current FIFA ranking perhaps? :rolleyes:

dvpower

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Health Got 2?
France got 14 for health, despite having the best health system in the world?

Heres what they say.

As one of the top ranked health systems in the world, the vast majority of the Irish are satisfied with their well being
Ireland has a high number of medical professionals and hospital beds, ranking in the top 30 on both variables. Health-adjusted life expectancy is very high at 70, and only 3% of citizens are undernourished, a very low proportion internationally. Infant mortality rates are very low, ranking the country inside the top 20, globally. There is universal access to improved sanitation, and a high 86% are satisfied with the quality of water, ranking Ireland 20th overall.* On subjective variables, Ireland performs very well as 90% of the population are satisfied with their quality of health while only 14% report debilitating health problems, the 14th lowest rate, worldwide.* Additionally, three-quarters of Irish people consider themselves well rested, and only 15% reported having experienced prolonged periods of physical pain recently.*

TBH, everyone complains about their health service. My (thankfully) few interactions with it have been positive. In any case, the index takes a much broader view of health.

johnnyskeleton

Rob67 wrote: »

It took a while, but the prize for the first person to find the negatives goes to:......... Dannyboy!!

Ehem... well there would have been a prize except the country (nor I) couldn't really afford it!

Well done, anyway!!:D

He didn't find negatives in it, but rather queried the veracity of a report which puts the Ireland at number 2 in the world for health and also queried what exactly was meant by economic fundamentals.

Economic fundamentals is defined as "a growing, sound economy that provides opportunity for wealth creation". To say that Ireland is number 5 in the world seems at odds with the IMF's finding that Ireland's recession is the deepest among the advanced nations (link). Particularly since Germany (23rd in economic fundamentals) and France (17th) are supposed to be back to growth at the moment.

Good news is good, but it must be reliable information first.

ei.sdraob

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

He didn't find negatives in it, but rather queried the veracity of a report which puts the Ireland at number 2 in the world for health and also queried what exactly was meant by economic fundamentals.

Economic fundamentals is defined as "a growing, sound economy that provides opportunity for wealth creation". To say that Ireland is number 5 in the world seems at odds with the IMF's finding that Ireland's recession is the deepest among the advanced nations (link). Particularly since Germany (23rd in economic fundamentals) and France (17th) are supposed to be back to growth at the moment.

Good news is good, but it must be reliable information first.

ahem

ei.sdraob wrote: »

thats not a rank of 2nd

thats a score for that criteria, the lower the better

johnnyskeleton

ei.sdraob wrote: »

ahem

But if it is a score for that criteria, the lower the better, and only Austria has a lower score than Ireland, then what rank in world health is Ireland?

bangersandmash

ei.sdraob wrote: »

thats not a rank of 2nd

thats a score for that criteria, the lower the better

Are you sure about that? The terminology is pretty vague. While they do talk about calculating scores for 9 different "building blocks", the table at the start of the report PDF appears to show rankings for each of these. Hence why the columns on pages 4-5 are coloured in terms of "strong rank", "average rank" and "weak rank". Notice that all of the values in the column seem to be distinct numbers in the range 1-104. According to the health column Austria is 1st, Ireland is 2nd, Switzerland is 3rd...

Edit: On Page 31 of the report they provide the same numbers in the table for "Health Sub-Index Rank Order". I think we can safely say that Ireland does achieve a rank of 2nd for health in this report, based on pre-recession figures at least.

ei.sdraob

bangersandmash wrote: »

Are you sure about that? The terminology is pretty vague. While they do talk about calculating scores for 9 different "building blocks", the table at the start of the report PDF appears to show rankings for each of these. Hence why the columns on pages 4-5 are coloured in terms of "strong rank", "average rank" and "weak rank". Notice that all of the values in the column seem to be distinct numbers in the range 1-104. According to the health column Austria is 1st, Ireland is 2nd, Switzerland is 3rd...

Edit: On Page 31 of the report they provide the same numbers in the table for "Health Sub-Index Rank Order". I think we can safely say that Ireland does achieve a rank of 2nd for health in this report, based on pre-recession figures at least.

hmm ok your right

anyways i started this thread to brighten things up around here


people keep moaning how bad things are but they forget quite a large part of the worlds population is much worse off

_Kooli_

I always wondered where this recession was.
I have everyone telling me how bad things are, yet they are all working. Those not working dont actually want to be working because they are getting plenty of money on the dole.

Irish people just like to moan. They are not happy unless they are unhappy.

nesf

greendom wrote: »

http://ezinearticles.com/?France-Has-the-Best-Healthcare-System-in-the-World&id=2643603

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

http://healthcare-economist.com/2008/04/14/health-care-around-the-world-an-introduction/

The first is an opinion piece not an article!!!

The second I accept (though 9 years old so meh really), the third quotes the second for its ranking table.

Recent numbers from the European Health Consumer Index from the last few years can be found here: http://www.healthpowerhouse.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=36&Itemid=55

Interesting reading. The Dutch Healthsystem wins each year pretty much.

Jesus Wept

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

The area where we scored worst, personal freedom, was the area where we should have scored best (I guess the blasphemy laws killed it)

I can think of many reasons why we should have a crap score for 'personal freedom'.

ronano

_Kooli_ wrote: »

I always wondered where this recession was.
I have everyone telling me how bad things are, yet they are all working. Those not working dont actually want to be working because they are getting plenty of money on the dole.

Irish people just like to moan. They are not happy unless they are unhappy.

Is this a joke? if not i'd like to point you in the direction of the state benefits forum to see people at their wits' end. A small section of the population spend their life on benefits everyone else on them would rather not be and are in the situation due to economic circumstance,life on the dole isn't fun it's a safety net nothing more.

_Kooli_

ronano wrote: »

Is this a joke? if not i'd like to point you in the direction of the state benefits forum to see people at their wits' end. A small section of the population spend their life on benefits everyone else on them would rather not be and are in the situation due to economic circumstance,life on the dole isn't fun it's a safety net nothing more.

Its not a joke.
And its also a small section of the population who actually will be staying on the dole.
I know some people cant get jobs. Im sure theyre taking the easy options in the good times is what lead them where they are now. Anyone i know who lost a job got one fast enough. Life on the dole is €900 a month tax free plus rent allowance and medical card. Easy street. Why would they be bothered getting off the dole. If you cant live on that you have worse problems than not having a job.

greendom

nesf wrote: »

The first is an opinion piece not an article!!!

The second I accept (though 9 years old so meh really), the third quotes the second for its ranking table.

Recent numbers from the European Health Consumer Index from the last few years can be found here: http://www.healthpowerhouse.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=36&Itemid=55

Interesting reading. The Dutch Healthsystem wins each year pretty much.

Fair enough but

I've never seen any data that suggests that France has the best healthcare system in the world

Well, now you have - even if it is a little out of date

nesf

greendom wrote: »

Well, now you have - even if it is a little out of date

Indeed. Only been following it since 2005 or so.

Liam Byrne

Maybe we haven't "moved up"; maybe others have moved down ?

Although how that could even happen given the ongoing fiascos in this country at the moment is beyond me....