[split thread] Pens - which one is for me in DCM?

Rebelrunner

I'm doing the marathon this Monday and this is 2nd marathon (did Cork earlier this year).
I'm in the 3:30-4:15 category and plan is for less than 3:45 (all going to plan) - sticking with the 3:45 pacer until 20 miles and if I feel good then plough on from there.
I was thinking of finding the 3:45 pacer and starting out a bit behind them so when it comes to the finish if I'm with pacer I should be ok.
But other runners are telling me that I should move up as far as I can at the start otherwise I could get blocked at the start!
What are the recomendations of more experienced marathoners? Thx.

misty floyd

b and if you feel good at later stages (24-25 miles) go for it. Thats what I would do anyway.

TFBubendorfer

Rebelrunner wrote: »

But other runners are telling me that I should move up as far as I can at the start otherwise I could get blocked at the start!
What are the recomendations of more experienced marathoners? Thx.

Look, there is chip timing. Your time won't start until you cross the actual starting line. It doesn't matter if that takes 2 minutes, it won't show up in your final time.

We can't all start at the front of the pen. In fact, if you're surrounded by 3:30 runners and you're aiming for 3:45, you will most likely start too fast and end up paying for it big time.

I strongly recommend staying with your pacer from the beginning. There is always a certain amount of blocking by slower runners during the first mile, but you won't lose more than a couple of seconds that way.

Krusty_Clown

Rebelrunner wrote: »

But other runners are telling me that I should move up as far as I can at the start otherwise I could get blocked at the start!
What are the recomendations of more experienced marathoners? Thx.

That's dreadful advice. If you move up to the start of the pen, then you become the person blocking all of the people aiming for between 3:30 and your target (that's almost a thousand people, based on last year's figures). It's my one pet peeve about races in Ireland. Everyone seems to think that moving to the front will help them in some way. But it is exactly because of this mentality that races become a lesser experience. Not having a go at you Reberunner, just a general comment. Best of luck in the race, wherever you decide to start.

actwithoutwords

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

That's dreadful advice. If you move up to the start of the pen, then you become the person blocking all of the people aiming for between 3:30 and your target (that's almost a thousand people, based on last year's figures). It's my one pet peeve about races in Ireland. Everyone seems to think that moving to the front will help them in some way. But it is exactly because of this mentality that races become a lesser experience. Not having a go at you Reberunner, just a general comment. Best of luck in the race, wherever you decide to start.

Yeah it's something of a self-fulfilling prophecy. "I'd better get near the front of the pen as I don't want to get stuck behind loads of idiots starting too far forward for their ability." Ergo you become part of the problem. Difficult mentality to escape though. Being stuck behind people for the first mile drives me crazy.

Speedy44

It's a tough call really. The most important thing is to have confidence in your ability. Therefore, getting to the front of the pen is just ensuring that you will not be stuck behind all the 'chancers' who havn't done their homework, of which there always seems to be 1000's.

average_runner

Sorry lets face it in the dublin marathon, if you want to get a good run you need to be in the 3:30 paddock of the race. I ran in the 4 hour paddock last year and it was a disaster, nothing but walkers ahead of me, lost alot of time and you waste more energy trying to gain that time back.


Now if your a 4:40 runner dont go into the 3:30 area either but if your a 3:48-3:35 runner get into the 3:30 paddock. You could be a bit slower than some people there means you create some space for yourself, but i doubt you be one of the slowest as load of walkers be there too.


Also a load of walkers get close to the front!!!

Thats why i aint running with the 3:45 pacers as i believe they will get stuck for awhile and have to pick the pace up for a few miles which is not ideal.


My adivce if your decent runner looking for a time between 3:50-3:35 get into the 3:30 paddock.

I know i be slated for this and i dont agree with what i said above myself but it has to be done as too many selfish people jump ahead, and you trained too long to let them ruin your race.


I be in the 3:30 group and a good bit to make up for my mistakes from last year!

Also watch out for O'Connell street, its a nightmare, not wide enough for the runners so you try to run on the path but you cant see the path due to all the same color and people supporting standing there. Not giving out about supporters as they are brill just think thast a dangerous part of the course!

Rebelrunner

Thanks for the advice - Think I'll go with my own instinct (and advice given)and aim for 10-25metres or so behind the 3:45 pacer, and if I am slowed down at the first couple of miles - it might not be a bad thing if I stay calm about it, and make up the ground gradually rather than over 1 mile.

Woddle

average_runner wrote: »

Sorry lets face it in the dublin marathon, if you want to get a good run you need to be in the 3:30 paddock of the race. I ran in the 4 hour paddock last year and it was a disaster, nothing but walkers ahead of me, lost alot of time and you waste more energy trying to gain that time back.


Now if your a 4:40 runner dont go into the 3:30 area either but if your a 3:48-3:35 runner get into the 3:30 paddock. You could be a bit slower than some people there means you create some space for yourself, but i doubt you be one of the slowest as load of walkers be there too.


Also a load of walkers get close to the front!!!

!

Again terrible advise, if you go into the 3'30 pen and your not in 3'30 shape you'll be running at someone elses pace and not yours which will be a disaster. Hasn't the start been changed to allow runners to get the best possible start?

robinph

You are always going to get held up at the start unless you are stood on the line itself.

You have 15,000 people stood shoulder to shoulder, then come 9am they all need to be spaced out with a meter or two all around each other. There just isn't the space for that to happen so for the first mile or so whilst everyone get spaced out you will always be tripping over each other. Other than keeping to the outside of the corners at the start there is not much more you can do to gain a bit of room for yourself.

average_runner

No the start hasnt been changed give the runners the best start.

Because any fool can click on the section they want when sigining up so its no different from last year. And thats what alot of walkers do!

Yes i do realise I am one of those describing which is sad

Because you are in the 3:30 pen doesnt mean you be running faster than you ment, you still have your own watch to pace yourself, and actually it could mean you could get more space in front of you to run your race.

Also negative splits arent a good thing, its theory that some people buy into, ideally your splits should be very close to each other to say you done the perfect race!!


Most the clubs have even told their runners to move up this year due to the problems from last year and bigger numbers!

Speedy44

Have to agree with Average Runner on this. There is simply too many walkers or joggers in the wrong place, and by been in the 3:30 pen or whatever does not mean that you are going to be running faster than you should, it should just mean that there will not be as many obstacles in the way. If you are smart you will just stick to your own pace anyway.

Krusty_Clown

average_runner wrote: »

Also negative splits arent a good thing, its theory that some people buy into, ideally your splits should be very close to each other to say you done the perfect race!!

This should probably be moved from the Pacers thread, as we're heading down avenues of debate that have no place being part of this thread, and some of the advice being offered is very debatable.
Krusty (36 second negative split in Berlin).

Woddle

average_runner wrote: »

No the start hasnt been changed give the runners the best start.

Because any fool can click on the section they want when sigining up so its no different from last year. And thats what alot of walkers do!

Yes i do realise I am one of those describing which is sad

Because you are in the 3:30 pen doesnt mean you be running faster than you ment, you still have your own watch to pace yourself, and actually it could mean you could get more space in front of you to run your race.

Also negative splits arent a good thing, its theory that some people buy into, ideally your splits should be very close to each other to say you done the perfect race!!


Most the clubs have even told their runners to move up this year due to the problems from last year and bigger numbers!

Again I think your wrong the start has been changed so as not to have so many turns which causes alot of the stop/starting and if you are in the wrong pen it is very easy to get sucked into the fast pace regardless of having a watch.

Woddle 30 min positive split and disaster

--amadeus--

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

This should probably be moved from the Pacers thread, as we're heading down avenues of debate that have no place being part of this thread, and some of the advice being offered is very debatable.
Krusty (36 second negative split in Berlin).

Agreed - this has gone way OT and should be split. I'm on a client site at the moment so can't do it now but will later (if HM or R. don't see it 1st?)

hunnymonster

done. and to add my 2c, remember the speech your mammy used to give you that two wrongs don't make a right, it's a bit like that, tut loudly at the walkers as you pass and feel doubly smug at the finish for having just run a marathon, and having done it considerately :-)

louthandproud

hunnymonster wrote: »

done. and to add my 2c, remember the speech your mammy used to give you that two wrongs don't make a right, it's a bit like that, tut loudly at the walkers as you pass and feel doubly smug at the finish for having just run a marathon, and having done it considerately :-)

I'll be tutting away right behind you in the :45 group!

hunnymonster

naw you'll be joining the sing song
"everywhere we go-ooh, people always ask us, who we arrrrre and where do we come from......"
"he wheels on the bus go round and round, round...."

HardyEustace

hunnymonster wrote: »

naw you'll be joining the sing song
"everywhere we go-ooh, people always ask us, who we arrrrre and where do we come from......"
"he wheels on the bus go round and round, round...."

Perhaps given the topic, it should really be
"oh you're all a bunch of chancers up the front, up the front..."

BeepBeep67

robinph wrote: »

everyone get spaced out you will always be tripping

I think this is the best advice - couldn't resist

kingQuez

Relax, stick to your plan, and don't buy into the hype. And most importantly have a great day!