Pitfalls of getting website built in India etc

regandy

Hi there

Im currently attending DCU doing a Masters in eCommerce.

I am looking to build a website similar to wordpress.com, a quality blogging site that is also a social network.

I was thinking Id get the back end work done in India for €10-15 per hour and get someone who who knows what he's doing to project manage this, someone who has outsourced work before many times. The specing out will be done first along with front end work to help guide the build. We would be using elance.com to source a professional company in India.

I was going to budget €12.5k for this. I have a few question and would appreciate any advice.


Do you think this is a good way to go about achieving my goal?

What are the disadvantages of having a site built with opensource software native to Indian programmers that Irish programmers are unfamiliar with?

It sounds to me like a good way to go but this is my first time doing this and I have very little knowledge of the area. I think I might be rushing into this and am not sure of all the pitfalls.

If anyone has advice for me on this I would really appreciate it.


Thanks and regards
Dylan

Tony Almeida

Im doing the masters in EComm in NUIG,

Firstly, is this a project your doing, as in the benefits and drawbacks of outsourcing to India,

Or is this about exploring an option of outsourcing as part of a project on the webdesign aspect of a business

Or are you actually looking to build a fully functioning website for a business?
If its option 3, what sort of thing do you need to build?

kmick

Having been there done that here are my 2 cents.

Advantages
1) Cost - its a bit cheaper I would say 30% tops.
2) They will be on call 24/7 once you are paying them.

Disadvantages
1) Communication is always a problem - its harder to get non-english speakers (first language) to understand what you want.
2) Much slower by a factor of double I would say. Indians want to know everything before they start. Unless you use 2 week sprints a la agile it can take a while to see results.

RoadKillTs

Other

Haven't had a website done but got other design work done and I wouldn't do it again.
The communication was a real problem. I'd go with an Irish company if I was you.

conman

building a website and go live is only the beginning..
you need to build and be supported, easy to upload to have affiliated services such as facebook, twitter etc depending on your business type.

so get a solid company to build, but only pay them in full a month after go live.
as then u can iron out difficulties and so forth, have a means to always be able to keep your website up with the times

MOH

Other

Your first poll option - give a developer 50% equity - is very unlikely to find any takers, particularly if you're talking a 12k project.

regandy

The fact that Im doing eCommerce in DCU is actually irrelevant actually. Except that I could work on this as a final year project with 2 others. However if I did that I would have to split everything 3 ways. I have a business background and I know even the technical guys wont have the required expertise for social network software and XML.

Im looking to build this as a business for real. My local enterprise board has given me €7.5K based on the idea's merits. I just don’t know the best way of achieving a quality build that doesn’t cost a ridiculous amount of money and that is not made in a way that ties me in with a particular firm – something that can be continuously improved and built upon as time goes with as little hassle as possible.

Tony Almeida

Can i ask, what features you need on the website?

I make websites myself, perhaps i could give you some tips on what you would need

regandy

have a look at wordpress.com

Tony Almeida

Pm me...

I dont understand why you cant use wordpress software

Let me know what you need

Atlas_IRL

Dylan this is Andrew here in your course(ngm group) im doing the same thing atm. Have a site being built by scripltance(99%) complete and have a site being made now on elance, so if you need help i can give you some advice. I dont think you will be able to outsource a college project but thats something you will have to ask Theo.

regandy wrote: »

Hi there

Im currently attending DCU doing a Masters in eCommerce.

I am looking to build a website similar to wordpress.com, a quality blogging site that is also a social network.

I was thinking Id get the back end work done in India for €10-15 per hour and get someone who who knows what he's doing to project manage this, someone who has outsourced work before many times. The specing out will be done first along with front end work to help guide the build. We would be using elance.com to source a professional company in India.

I was going to budget €12.5k for this. I have a few question and would appreciate any advice.


Do you think this is a good way to go about achieving my goal?

Yes and no. I have had one bad experience with scriptlance but my developer on Elance seems to be better. An Irish company will do a better job and quicker as it is easier to communicate but imo Irish companies are very expensive. My family business had a site built for 20k by an Irish company who done a terrible job then were quoting 45k+ to link in with the database
I am getting the site redone on ELance now for less than 1.6k. The link in to the database is another 5 k but that is my licence fee to get the hookup and is nothing to do with the elance payment.

What are the disadvantages of having a site built with opensource software native to Indian programmers that Irish programmers are unfamiliar with?

They should be better with opensource software but you should try get someone who has done a lot of sites and is very comfortable with the opensource software you want to use. My scriptlance guys are 3 months late on development as we have had to constantly monitor and fix bugs they have made. (Custom build)

It sounds to me like a good way to go but this is my first time doing this and I have very little knowledge of the area. I think I might be rushing into this and am not sure of all the pitfalls.

I can show you the plus and minus points of choosing the right companies if you want. You will probably get 30+ offers and you will have to weed this down to a few select ones that stand out, you may still not see a standout offer. I would suggest using a few freelance sites so you can have your pick from 100+ offers.

If anyone has advice for me on this I would really appreciate it.



Thanks and regards
Dylan

My advice would be to not do a good business idea for your final year project. You will have 4 people who may not be as passionate about it as you are and will want their equity after. Why give away 75% of your company, especially after getting 7.5k form your local enterprise board.

petergfiffin

Other

regandy wrote: »

I was thinking Id get the back end work done in India for €10-15 per hour and get someone who who knows what he's doing to project manage this, someone who has outsourced work before many times. The specing out will be done first along with front end work to help guide the build. We would be using elance.com to source a professional company in India.

It's kind of a catch 22, if you're going to hire somebody who's experienced in outsourcing - who would probably be relatively expensive -, are you then just going to cancel out any benefit in hiring cheaper coders? Also, how many iterations are you going to go through with people in a different country, different time zone, with a different language who may require more detailed explanations of what you're trying to achieve.

regandy wrote: »

I was going to budget €12.5k for this. I have a few question and would appreciate any advice.

Have you calculated this figure or is this the amount available to you? If it's the amount you've calculated it would seem a little on the low side to be honest, especially considering what you're hoping to build, don't forget, estimates (particularly IT ones) are notoriously optimistic, you will never get it done as quickly as you hoped, always build in a generous margin of error into any estimates.

regandy wrote: »

What are the disadvantages of having a site built with opensource software native to Indian programmers that Irish programmers are unfamiliar with?

Not to be pedantic here but if it's opensource then it's highly unlikely it will be native to Indians (or any other nationality), besides, all code is written in English anyway (apart from comments) so regardless of where it would be written an Irish programmer should still be able to understand it.

My own feeling is outsourcing works when you can give people very precise specs as to what you want and you're looking at something that requires a significant amount of effort so you can maximise the benefit. If it were me I'd be more inclined to look locally bearing in mind you're in a buyer's market with regard to IT at the moment, OK, IT companies aren't as badly hit as some others but I would shop around, play them off against each other and get the best deal you can. Giving somebody 50% equity for the work could prove v v costly in the future if the company is a big success, it also limits your ability to raise funds through equity in the future as you will either have to convince your partner to surrender some of theirs or you will have to dilute your share even more. Also, don't try and do it all on the first release, start small, get the site up and running, prove the concept and it would be easier to raise further capital, either through advertising or investment.....my 2 cents

ShadowFax

check out www.getafreelancer.com.

Ive used this site, its great. Some highly skilled people on it, and there DIRT CHEAP in comparison to over here. India, Pakistan...there the best and cheapest

Most providers come with feedback, portfolio, and you can get to pick from bids on your project.

Great site, worth checking out!
Hope this helps

IRE60

ShadowFax wrote: »

check out www.getafreelancer.com.

Ive used this site, its great. Some highly skilled people on it, and there DIRT CHEAP in comparison to over here. India, Pakistan...there the best and cheapest

Most providers come with feedback, portfolio, and you can get to pick from bids on your project.

Great site, worth checking out!
Hope this helps

a fella on getafrelancer told me he had designed the New York Times website.... we didn't get on after that gaff

a fella on elance is currently being spit roasted by me for, my fault, having some money of mine and not coming up with the goods. And "not coming up with the goods' would be a euphemism for supplying absolute rubbish and being canned 1/4 way through.

odesk i used recently and will know on Friday of it stands up to the test!

b.t.w. well done on smuggling 7.5 large out of enterprise. nice start.

ShadowFax

Well you should obviously check their feedback and portfolio before you go with anyone. If they dont have feedback, dont go with them

Also, in sites like this, you should only Escrow Money Service as a form of payment. You deposit the money with them, and the provider only gets paid, when the work is completed successfully! If there is a problem with the job, they intervene and check the work you asked for, if it doesnt comply...the provider doesnt get paid, you get your money back.

This service should be built into the payment system of any good freelance / work site.

Ive used both GAF and Elance and had nothing but positive experiences.

regandy

I think I'll probably get the work done in India with a professional company sourced through elance. I mean if you pay €5K you get 500 hours of work. In Ireland skilled labour would cost 5 to 8 times that amount. Plus your not paying VAT.

I believe that front end stuff should be done here as you want it to be top notch. Id pay a rate of €70 or €80 for quality front end work. Say 60 hours.

If this means paying someone who outsources work all the time to project manage the process I still think this is the best option. Even if he charges €75 per hour for say 60 hours work.

So the math as I understand it would be(Approx):

All done in Ireland: Say 400 hours back end work, 60 hours front end work @ €50 per hour = €23,000 + 21% vat = €27,830

Back end done in India, project managed by Irish pro, front end done by Irish professional company: 400 hrs * €15 + 60 hrs* €75 + 60 hrs * €75 = €6000 + 4500 + 4500 = 15,000 + vat on the 9K = Total 16,890

Id say I could get it done the second way for 13K in total. This is about half the price of the other.

Call me crazy but this makes a lot of sense to me.

Sparkx

I have had software devoloped recently by an indian company.They were over 10 times cheaper than everyone else. I got quotes from Ireland, UK & USA.
I got these via elance.Great set-up.
I would have liked to use an Irish company but they simply charge to much.
The Indian company compiled a full spec for me and they were excellent.
I wouldnt disclose your budget to anyone doing work for you.

Sparkx

I would get change out of 7.5K.