Getting paid - 4 months and still waiting

daymobrew

During April and May I did some work for a web company. I submitted my timesheet and invoice in the middle of June and was told I would be paid in 5-10 days. It is less than 800 euro but not trivial to me.

I have emailed them a number of times and phoned too. AFAIK there are only 3 people in the office - an admin and 2 designers. I only dealt with one of them - the one who is never there and never returns any of my calls. The other guy says that the absent one is the one that deals with the cheques. I obviously don't believe a word they say.

On one occasion the other guy told me that they were having cash flow issues and that some of their clients were not forthcoming with money.

Any suggestions?
I am not sure of Small Claims covers this:

Type of claims dealt with

(a) a claim for goods or services bought for private use from someone selling them in the course of a business (consumer claims)
(b) a claim for minor damage to property
(c) a claim for the non-return of a rent deposit - snip.

RedCardinal

Small Claims Court is only for consumers sadly.

You may just have to take it on the chin sadly, but perhaps the last try will be to write a strongly worded letter informing them that you'll forward this to your solicitor if they do not pay within a set number of days. Getting a solicitor to send a letter will likely cost you about ~€100, but if they're cute they'll simply ignore.

Sadly for €800 going legal isn't really an option. Did you have a written contract?

AARRRGH

I used to do credit control. You need to ring them every day. Eventually they will commit to writing a cheque. As soon as they do that, tell them not to post it as you are on your way to their office. You then go to their office and tell the recptionist you are there to pick up a cheque. I found it embarrasses/intimidates them enough to make payment.

It worked for me every time.

Cadiz

AARRRGH wrote: »

I used to do credit control. You need to ring them every day. Eventually they will commit to writing a cheque. As soon as they do that, tell them not to post it as you are on your way to their office. You then go to their office and tell the recptionist you are there to pick up a cheque. I found it embarrasses/intimidates them enough to make payment.

It worked for me every time.

Would totally concur with this. When I have had payment problems the last resort solution has been to be a bit of a pest - ring every day, keep on it. I did physically call at an office on one occasion and discussed payment politely but loudly with accounts person in the middle of reception. And bingo, after months of delay I got paid. Not enjoyable though .

Being a thorn in their side and keeping ringing them at least means they are likely to pay you just to get rid of you.

Good luck with it.

That stuff about person who signs cheques being away blah blah is flannel.

daymobrew

AARRRGH wrote: »

As soon as they do that, tell them not to post it as you are on your way to their office. You then go to their office and tell the recptionist you are there to pick up a cheque. I found it embarrasses/intimidates them enough to make payment.

I am in Dublin and they are on the outskirts of Galway.

One time I was told that I'd be sent a cheque but not to cash it. It never arrived.

Red Cardinal wrote:

Did you have a written contract?

No. I only have the "You'll be paid in 5-10 days" email.

tomED

You could send a letter from a solicitor from as little as €25 on www.debtcollection.ie - but this doesn't seem to be enough to frighten many into paying.

Don't forget you are legally entitled to charge interest on the monies owed, so let them know this and tell them you will be sending them another invoice for the Interest.

The only other option then is to out them! I've seen on more than one occassion now people standing outside establishments with plackards with "xxx don't pay their bills" and they don't seem to have to march for very long!

CamperMan

I found I was having the same problem, now I ask for payment up front..

Cadiz

Very few freelancers are in a postion where they have the leverage to insist on payment upfront, unfortunately.

link8r

RedCardinal wrote: »

Sadly for €800 going legal isn't really an option. Did you have a written contract?

That's true * but * depending on what other documentation you have, if you were to sue them and win, you could win your costs back. This is hugely dependent on what kind of contract/agreement you have. If you have documentation that proves they hired you, the price and the fact they've accpeted your work, then you could sue them and claim that the cost of which should be borne by them, as you were forced to take such action.

Whats more likely is that they're experiencing huge cash flow issues and you could be taking further risk of loss by going to court. Unless your solicitor thought it was worth taking on a no-win, no-fee basis

Trojan

You might be able to get them around by asking for it as 300, 300, 200 over 3 months, or 100 a month for 8 months, etc. Remember, the business owner might be in a desperate situation. Or you might be the least annoying creditor, so you go to the bottom of the pile until your next call.

Sometimes you have to write these things off, and put processes in place to try prevent them in future. E.g. deposits/partial payments upfront, staged delivery/milestones, even potentially escrow.

I've experienced it to significantly higher amounts than that, but it's all the same. You cannot allow the experience or the amount to drag you and your business down though, that could cost you a lot more than than the owed sum.

nkay1985

daymobrew wrote: »

I am in Dublin and they are on the outskirts of Galway.

Jesus, if it was me €800 would be worth a spin to Galway! I'd agree with the people saying to keep bugging them. You're not going to work for them again after this so it's not like you're burning any bridges. As they're a small business, they probably can't afford to avoid phone calls.

At least if you annoy them enough and come clean about their finincial situation you could work something out then. But as long they're just constantly fobbing you off with promises of cheques "next week" or whatever, you're getting nowhere.

515

They clearly have cash-flow problems. Why not offer a structured repayment option to them? Say 100 a week for 2 months... it would be a lot easier for them to find that than the full amount upfront.

West Briton

Cadiz wrote: »

Would totally concur with this. When I have had payment problems the last resort solution has been to be a bit of a pest - ring every day, keep on it. I did physically call at an office on one occasion and discussed payment politely but loudly with accounts person in the middle of reception. And bingo, after months of delay I got paid. Not enjoyable though .

Being a thorn in their side and keeping ringing them at least means they are likely to pay you just to get rid of you.

Good luck with it.

That stuff about person who signs cheques being away blah blah is flannel.

Annoying the front line staff is never any way to get paid. Talk to the owners. In addition, if you get consistent reasons why you are not being paid then ringing the girl in accounts seventy five times after your second call will not get you paid any faster. Fact. Be mindful that you won't get work again from any company you harass and they in turn will bad mouth you to their mates. This is Ireland - a small place after all.

p

Cadiz wrote: »

Very few freelancers are in a postion where they have the leverage to insist on payment upfront, unfortunately.

Asking for a portion of money upfront is fairly standard practice.

Cadiz

West Briton wrote: »

Annoying the front line staff is never any way to get paid. Talk to the owners. In addition, if you get consistent reasons why you are not being paid then ringing the girl in accounts seventy five times after your second call will not get you paid any faster. Fact. Be mindful that you won't get work again from any company you harass and they in turn will bad mouth you to their mates. This is Ireland - a small place after all.

Lol, I love the 'fact', as if the poster were the bearer of incontravertible truths :rolleyes:

When things get to the stage where a company isn't paying or cheques aren't showing up as promised, owners and managers become as elusive as the Scarlet fecking Pimpernel.

As for bad mouthing me, a company that can't pay people or promises cheques on the never doesn't have any word of mouth value left.

Sometimes pester power is all that works, that is my experience.

But more importantly, OP - did you ever get paid??

Cadiz

p wrote: »

Asking for a portion of money upfront is fairly standard practice.

For who? In your line of work? Not in mine it isn't.

spyro_2001ie

Send a Letter........
Wait 1 week.........
Brick Windows......
Sleep well that night.

Id make sure they were €800 out of pocket, regardless if it went to me.

kippy

spyro_2001ie wrote: »

Send a Letter........
Wait 1 week.........
Brick Windows......
Sleep well that night.

Id make sure they were €800 out of pocket, regardless if it went to me.

Thats a completely pointless and ignorant way to do business.....

West Briton

Cadiz wrote: »

Lol, I love the 'fact', as if the poster were the bearer of incontravertible truths :rolleyes:

When things get to the stage where a company isn't paying or cheques aren't showing up as promised, owners and managers become as elusive as the Scarlet fecking Pimpernel.

As for bad mouthing me, a company that can't pay people or promises cheques on the never doesn't have any word of mouth value left.

Sometimes pester power is all that works, that is my experience.

But more importantly, OP - did you ever get paid??

No need to roll your eyes, I do books for a company and stopping me doing my job by pestering me doesn't get anyone paid any faster.

Cadiz

West Briton wrote: »

No need to roll your eyes, I do books for a company and stopping me doing my job by pestering me doesn't get anyone paid any faster.

Is that a fact?

Perhaps your boss pays his contractors on time and without phantom cheque ruses, but where companies don't then people like you are in the front line and it's part of their job to deal with understandably exasperated unpaid creditors.

If they don't like it that's too bad. I don't like having to chase elusive clients for my money.

daymobrew

[QUOTE=Cadiz;63183284But more importantly, OP - did you ever get paid??[/QUOTE] No.
I rang the owner's mobile recently (his colleague was quick to give it to me - presumably so he wouldn't have to deal with me). I think I caught him by surprise. He talked for ages (I barely said anything) with a load of excuses, the main one being that they haven't been paid.

Last week I emailed saying I hadn't forgotten that I had not been paid and asked if I should start emailing their clients (and included a link to their portfolio). I got an immediate reply :P it asked for a little more time.

I replied asking for a definition of "a little more time" and was told 45 days.

thehunter

This one has worked for me a few times.
Arrive in reception and if there is someone else waiting just politely
ask them "are you waiting for a cheque too" in full earshot of reception. Works a treat if there is a few waiting.....worth a shot