Is there a denial of racism in Ireland? - Note mod warnings

ih8northsiders

They say sport can give an insight into society and Ireland is no exception. We have seen in Spain, Carlos Kameni and Samuel Eto'o to name just a few being abused as well as English players when they played a friendly in Madrid and we hear this is a reflection on Spanish society so lets take an incident right here in Dublin between Bohemians and Shamrock Rovers in the Dublin derby last week.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fretxesAwI

Joey Ndo is quite clearly the target of monkey chants by what seems like a large portion of the rovers support.

It seems like this has not even been commented on and the FAI seem to be doing little to punish Rovers. In other countries there would be public outcry.

lugha

Soccer really is a funny old game. There seems to be a sub culture amongst some of its more hardened followers of behaving appallingly. And I don’t mean the racism or even the violence. David Beckham had spoken of threatening chants from crowds against his wife and even children. And I think Simon Webb who plays (played?) in the league of Ireland was taunted some time back after his wife died. I don’t know where this comes from but I think (hope!) it reflects nothing of mainstream society.

Not sure what this has to do with politics though?

Sand

I wouldnt say theres no racism in Ireland, theres something like 4.5 million people here. Odds are at least one of them is a racist or bigot. But I think you're extrapolating too much from a very small subset and applying conclusions to a much larger group:

a large portion of the rovers support.

Dare I say, a large portion of the rovers support, at least those making the money chants, would be scumbags. Id be getting more worried if it was decent people with jobs and some humanity who were making those monkey noises.

But yeah, the FAI ought to stamp that sort of thing out very harshly - banning Rovers supporters from stadiums for a couple of games would very much concentrate minds on self policing. FAI might not want to do that though because theyd be afraid of pushing fragile club finances over the edge.

sceptre

Moved from Politics to Humanities

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

From a sporting point of view? No, it's copycatism, pure and simple.
1 - What do do on the continent, Irish fans copy. Good and bad. Very little imagiantion out there - as someone else said,we can't even come up with an original chant.
2 - If Didier Drogba turned around and pledged his heart and signed for Shamrock Rovers, how long do you think there'd be monkey chants from the Rovers' fans?

From a societal point of view? More xenophobic than racist, I would have said.

Dudess

If people say Ireland isn't a racist society (which it isn't - I don't see crosses burning on people's lawns, or "Coloureds only"/"Whites only" signs) it isn't a denial of racism in Ireland.

There are of course racists in Ireland, as everywhere - these people do not make Ireland a racist society though.

zenith

This thread is on mod watch.

At issue is the 'denial of racism in Ireland'.

Generalised commentary about the proportion of a team's fans who are racist/not racist is off-topic, and if pursued further, will result in bannings.

zenith

This is not the soccer forum: please move to more generalised discussion of the matter at hand, or the thread will be closed.

Fratton Fred

when people chanting racist abuse are given excuses like "They are just a bunch of Scumbags" then yes, there is a denial of racism in Ireland.

there is a thread on here by a foreign national who was racially abused and she got the same thing, they are'nt racist, they are just scum bags.

People need to stand up to racism, not make excuses for it, making excuses is just another form of denial.

OhNoYouDidn't

Can we put this debate in a bit of context here.

The 'racism' that Ndo, a former Rovers player who is well liked in the club, got is at best unproven. The match officials didn't hear it. The media didn't hear it. The away fans didn't hear it. I didn't hear it and I was nearby in the stand. It did not come across on television. Most importantly, Ndo and Bohs didn't complain.

Two weeks after the game a youtube clip 'appears' and an orchestrated campaign begins on the Bohs forum. Astonishngley, none of these conciencious Bohs fans managed to complain to SARI, the media or the authorities about the sectarian abuse the Rovers keeper had to endure from them. Funny that.

I can assure you, if there was a problem of racism at Rovers, I and others will deal with it. But this simply is a group of malcontents who cannot accept their beating and are trying to create a media storm with a view to having their main rivals, who are about to win the league in front of full houses with a huge bandwagon forming, landed in the soup. Whether the abuse happened or not is essentially irrelevant, if it wasn't this it would be another thing.

SARI have been manipulated badly here.

OhNoYouDidn't

Fratton Fred wrote: »

when people chanting racist abuse are given excuses like "They are just a bunch of Scumbags" then yes, there is a denial of racism in Ireland.

there is a thread on here by a foreign national who was racially abused and she got the same thing, they are'nt racist, they are just scum bags.

People need to stand up to racism, not make excuses for it, making excuses is just another form of denial.

But they weren't chanting racist abuse, hence this Bohs fans letter writing campaign had been totally ignored until SARI put it on their website.

You know the score here, rival fans trying to score cheap points with what appears to be a doctored youtube clip.

All this does is make SARI look very foolish and there will be a 'boy who cried wolf' deal when the next one comes along.

OhNoYouDidn't

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

So, original question coming up, lads: is there a denial of racism in Ireland?

I don't believe there is.

But I think its very important to quantify what racism exists and deal with it effectively, not have the agenda set by some pimply keyboard activists.

stovelid

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

If Didier Drogba turned around and pledged his heart and signed for Shamrock Rovers

The player in the OP played for Rover last season, IckyPoo. And he's very well liked there still.

Personally I think there is a wider denial of racism in Ireland in many spheres of life, but I'm avoiding this thread (and will do so now) because I question the partisan motive behind it, and indeed some of the lame, ineffectual baiting that's going on.

Hope that helps.

OhNoYouDidn't

Just to tie up the story, the case in the op was investigated by Sports Against Racism Ireland and the FAI and they found no racial abuse occured, and indeed praised Rovers anti-racist policies as best in class.

The video footage was doctored.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.