Connemara Ultra...

belcarra

Just dipping my toe in the water here, so to speak, but anybody got any helpful tips regarding training regimes, nutrition, expected times, etc. for the Connemara Ultra? Any alternative websites that could offer more info?

I've done 8 marathons so far (Connemara twice), mostly in and around 4.5hrs but would be hoping to attempt another before Christmas (Possibly Florence on Nov 29th) to see what sort of shape I'm in.

PB for Half Marathon is 1:48 so I know a sub 4hr marathon is in me if I trained properly which is what I'd intend doing for the next 6 months (for the Ultra).
(Aside for newbie DCM'ers: I believe my failings to go sub 4hrs are mainly down to not doing quite enough LSRs.)

As I say, any advice welcome:)!

Aimman

Me too, was going to wait until after Dublin to start up a thread, you beat me to it. I need a bit more of a challege next year. Any info would be great.:D

Highway_To_Hell

Aimman wrote: »

Me too, was going to wait until after Dublin to start up a thread, you beat me to it. I need a bit more of a challege next year. Any info would be great.:D

And another Ultra hopeful here. Started researching ultra marathon plans online but only found either 30mile or 50mile plans, once DCM is out of the way I will start working on my training/schedule plans. The thoughts of running over the marathon distance as a training run is a bit daunting. I would hope to do the Ultra in between 6-6.5 hrs.

scottreynolds

Highway_To_Hell wrote: »

The thoughts of running over the marathon distance as a training run is a bit daunting. I would hope to do the Ultra in between 6-6.5 hrs.

Me three -- I'm planning on doing this. Hopefully it fits my schedule as thata not decided yet.

As for longer than marathon training runs from what I read very few races (especially at this distance) require that. The recommendation is more back to back long runs of about 20 miles each... yes I know that doesn't sound much easier.

hunnymonster

The approach I've used a couple of times is changing the Saturday LSR from the marathon training plan to the LSRs weekend where I would do say 18 miles on Saturday morning and 15 on Sunday. That way, the Sunday run sort of (!) simulates the tiredness you'll experience in the latter miles of an ultramarathon but it doesn't appear to increase the recovery time needed or the injury risk the way a sinlge 30+ mile run would. I would also probably make one of the midweek runs longer (up to say 16 miles) but otherwise would follow a typical marathon training plan. If anyone wants an individual plan done up for them following this approach, send me a recent marathon time (and the HM splits so I can see if you run constant pace or slow in latter part) and I'll write one up.

Mick Rice

The Connemara Ultra is very beginner friendly for a number of reasons. The most obvious thing is that it's not too much of a stretch beyond the standard marathon distance. Basically, if you've trained for, and completed a marathon, you won't have to change very much to train for and complete the Connemara Ultra.

Some people I've talked with before seem convinced that their training should change dramatically once the decision is made to take on the 39.3 miles through Connemara, but in my own experience that isn't necessarily true. When Ray O'Connor first decided to hold this race a few years back we talked about it and agreed that we'd test out the course during the summer before the first actual event the following April. Ray drove ahead of me with water and gels and a few club-mates of mine kept me company along sections of the route. I was far from my usual marathon fitness and so slowed right down to the slowest comfortable stride I felt I could manage. The miles ticked by, I got a bit more tired, but the miles kept passing and I eventually made it back to Maam Cross in more or less one piece. The lesson I took from the day was that being able to cover the 39.3 miles was less to do with being mega-fit and more to do with how you paced the run.

This is a beautiful race that almost anyone can complete if they approach it sensibly. For me, having the chance to run the Connemara Marathon races has been one of the best things that ever happened to me. If you're an experienced marathoner (that is you've done two or three) all you need to do is to increase your weekly mileage a little, extend your long run a little, avoid injury at all costs and refuse to get intimidated by the few extra miles. After all, even if it were all to go 'Pete Tong', what a beautiful place for a long walk :-)

TFBubendorfer

In marked contrast to Mick I'm a mere mortal, but I've done the Ultra twice and will be back for more next year.

The training was very similar to standard marathon training, but I did several 20 mile back-to-back runs, just like previous posters have mentioned.

Having said that, I did suffer badly from mile 30 onwards on both occasions, slowing down to 12-minute-miles and experiencing a world of pain. For my next try I'm definitely planning on doing at least two 30-mile training runs, but can't tell you yet if I'm in cloud-cuckoo land here.

I guess I'll know more in half a year

Mick Rice

TFB - We all feel fairly mortal after coming up the Hell of the West - or is that 'brutal'

hunnymonster

It's not much fun doing it in the other direction either.

TFBubendorfer

Mick Rice wrote: »

TFB - We all feel fairly mortal after coming up the Hell of the West - or is that 'brutal'

Last year I actually started feeling better once I got to the Hell. The 5 miles before that were an entirely different matter, though. It was between miles 30-35 that I swore I'd never do anything like that again, ever; what's more, I really meant it.

RacoonQueen

Just signed up for 2010 last night. Last year I didn't really change my training much and I still completed it within my target time and would have finished faster if I hadn't started yapping to random strangers over the last 5 miles. The only thing I really changed was putting in some back to back longish runs like doing 12/13 milers two days in a row. I'm hoping to cut a big chunk off my time this year though.

aburke

belcarra wrote: »

As I say, any advice welcome:)!

Enter early.

Aimman

I was looking at this earlier in the year and the cuttof times were 2 hours for the first 13M and 4 hours for the 26M, for anyone doing the Ultra. In recent weeks, its changed to 2.5hours for 13M and 5 hours for the 26.2M, which, although I should make the original cut off times, it puts less pressure on, in case I was having a bad day.

I'd hate to get to the 26M point and being told by someone that I dont qualify for the last 13M. They could have Bill Cullen there to tell you 'you're fired'

Nearly 110 people finished it last year, dont know how many started (even Robbie Williams completed it, accoring to the results)

I'll take you up on that schedule hunnymonster. I'll send you my info after the Dublin marathon, as I'm hoping it will be my best time this year. :cool:

TFBubendorfer

Aimman wrote: »

I was looking at this earlier in the year and the cuttof times were 2 hours for the first 13M and 4 hours for the 26M, for anyone doing the Ultra. In recent weeks, its changed to 2.5hours for 13M and 5 hours for the 26.2M,

Unless my memory fails me, the cutoff times in previous years were always 2.5/5 hours. Although, looking through the results, they can't have been very strict in enforcing them.

Abhainn

This is a great event no doubt about it. If you have experienced a couple of marathons and want another challenge then this is should be your next goal.
The support from fellow runners was brilliant, as I was lucky enough to encounter the majority of the marathon runners and many doing he half.
Having done the half in 2007 and full in 2008 in Connemara I stepped up to the Ultra in 2009.
My training plan didn’t differ too much from a normal marathon one.
I loosely followed the Hal Higdon Ultra plan. It’s basically all about your weekend long runs and building those up gradually. You need to be used to running on tired legs and the Sunday long run was challenging more mentally than physically I found. But Connemara Ultra really gets going when you hit 26 miles in Leenane so you need that preparation
Below are some details on my Ultra training plan. This worked great for me. Every one will have a different view though.
But before I attempted the back to back long runs I had built my legs up to 20 miler and I had a good base. I always have a step back week at least every 4th week In general there was a gradual build up of weekend long runs. My weekend long runs in the last 11 weeks looked like:


Week 11 Saturday 12 miles
Sunday 16 miles
Week 10 Saturday 14 miles
Sunday 18 miles
Week 9 Saturday 16 miles
Sunday 20 miles
Week 8 Saturday 4 miles Step back week
Sunday Race 10 miles
Week 7 Saturday 20 miles
Sunday 20 miles
Week 6 Saturday 24 miles
Sunday 20 miles
Week 5 Saturday off Step back week (Wedding)
Sunday off
Week 4 Saturday 24 miles
Sunday 21 miles
Week 3 Saturday 12miles
Sunday 16 miles
Week 2 Saturday – Indoor tri
Sunday 11 miles
Week 1 Saturday 0 miles
Sunday Race



On long runs I did incorporate some big hills (when there was no frost). The longest I ran midweek was 10 miles. Majority of weeks I took 2 rest days
Looks like Ill be back for more in April 2010.

scottreynolds

Abhainn wrote: »

Week 11 Saturday 12 miles Sunday 16 miles
Week 10 Saturday 14 miles Sunday 18 miles
Week 9 Saturday 16 miles Sunday 20 miles
.......................

OH No that looks crazy!

Abhainn

scottreynolds wrote: »

OH No that looks crazy!

Some say you have to be crazy to do an Ultra:)

hunnymonster

just saw this:
10. No matter the metric --- per mile, per minute (or per feet climbed) --- ultras are more cost-effective than 10Ks or marathons.
9. You get to accumulate belt buckles to keep your pants from falling down.
8. You get your ratio of travel time to race time well below one.
7. You get your ratio of toenails to toes also below one.
6. You learn to think of an eight-minute mile as a "sprint".
5. You experience God's creation in a unique and wonderful way: Pre-dawn starts! Mountain tops! Point-to-point trails!
4. Beer and pizza is a traditional pre-race meal.
3. Be part of a sport that will never, ever, be glamorous.
2. Learn that, if you're patient and willing to work hard, there isn't really much that's impossible.
... and the number one reason to run ultras:
1. Coffee and donuts at the start line!

from

http://www.hornetjuice.com/marathon-quotes.html#toprea

Enduro

For the OP and anyone running their first ultra....

Remember, an ultra is just another race. There is nothing fundamentally significant or magically different to running an ultra. It just has a different name! In the same way that people step up through standard track distances... 1500m - 5000m -10000m, you can just as easily slide up half-marathon - marathon - Conn Ultra.

When I started running ultras the only changes I made to my training was upping the training time (and therefore distance) to make it a little longer. Nothing outragous.

My other tip for ultra training, particularly for a hilly course like connemara, would be to add in some cycling into your weekly training. It'll relieve the potential boredom of non-stop running somewhat, and will strenghten up your quad muscles (which will be more than likely the first point of failure in a hilly ultra, from my experience)

belcarra

Hey everyone,

Thanks a million for the feedback! Reading about it in such a matter-of-fact way makes it seem quite reasonable until you take a step back and see what's actually involved like a back to back 20+ miler, etc!!

I'm planning on building up a solid base over the next couple of months before starting an actual 16 week schedule.
However HM, if you are willing to create a schedule that takes me from now until the race that would also be great!;)
My details are:
4.5 hrs typical marathon time with HM split approx 2 hrs - I fade badly over the last 6 miles which I assume is down to not enough quality LSRs..?
A typical week's training which i'm about to embark on is:

Mon - 8 miles
Tues - Football training (1hr of 5 a side)
Wed - 5 a side with work (1hr)
Thurs - Rest day
Fri - LSR #1 (I have Fri afternoons free)
Sat - Football Match / LSR #2
Sun - Rest day

I imagine come the New Year and the training building up i'll need to drop the football which should free up the Tues and Sat for more running...?

If you need any more details let me know.

Thanks!

TFBubendorfer

Belcarra, that's running twice a week. And you really think that is going to build a "solid base"?

My advice: drop either the football, or the Ultra.

belcarra

Hey TFB,

Thanks for your comments.

I know it looks a bit short on the pure running but the 5 a side on 2 nights would be the equivalent of approx 5 miles in terms of effort. I appreciate it's not the same thing as pure running though and so can't be directly compared.
However, I forgot to mention that the Tues night I run to and from football which is 2 miles each way. This would add 4 miles of running to the approx 5 miles of workout.
The football match on the Sat would be equivalent to approx 8-9 miles. This would be more closely related to running but again not directly comparable. This is the reason why I'd drop it come the new year and focus solely on the running.
Do you think this would be too late (approx 14 weeks before Connemara)?

I could add in an extra running session on the Thurs rest day if required...
And just to mention I've done 2 Half Marathons (1hr50mins) in the past 5 weeks and also completed the Gaelforcewest in August in 5hrs19mins.

TFBubendorfer

belcarra wrote: »

I know it looks a bit short on the pure running but the 5 a side on 2 nights would be the equivalent of approx 5 miles in terms of effort. I appreciate it's not the same thing as pure running though and so can't be directly compared.
However, I forgot to mention that the Tues night I run to and from football which is 2 miles each way. This would add 4 miles of running to the approx 5 miles of workout.
The football match on the Sat would be equivalent to approx 8-9 miles. This would be more closely related to running but again not directly comparable. This is the reason why I'd drop it come the new year and focus solely on the running.
Do you think this would be too late (approx 14 weeks before Connemara)?

I do have to disagree with your point "5 a side on 2 nights would be the equivalent of approx 5 miles". I do play an hour on indoor soccer per week, and don't even count it as training. The stop-start nature makes it an entirely different exercise.

Running to/from training is good, but 2 miles each way won't give you ultra fitness.

Basically, you had 2 days of running, 3 days of football and 2 days of rest. That's a decent amount of exercise, but ultra training it is not. It certainly won't give you the "solid base" you mentioned. And no, 14 weeks of training is not much.

This is all my personal view, of course, and I am neither a coach nor have I studied sports science. I just go from my own experience, and that tells me that the Connemara Ultra requires dedicated preparation. As I've mentioned earlier, I've done it twice with plenty of 20/20 back-to-back runs, and still felt woefully under-prepared once I got to 30 miles.

belcarra

Thanks again TFB!

Any chance you might be able to attach one of your plans from the past couple of years? That may be easier for me to fit into my schedule rather than drawing up a totally new one.
If it came to it I could easily drop the Wed 5 a side immediately.
As I say all feedback welcome from those that have been there and done it.
And that's the reason i'm asking now and not at the start of next year so i can be properly prepared.

Just to clarify the 14 weeks was in relation to dropping the football.
I intend training specifically for the Ultra from now which is 26 weeks away.
(Just don't want to do too much too soon and end up lacking motivation when it's really needed in the couple of months leading into the Ultra itself.)

TFBubendorfer

Sorry, I haven't got my training plans here with me. The one from 2008 wouldn't help you much anyway, because I spent 3 weeks of January in bed, coughing up half my lungs after contracting pneumonia. This left me with about 6 or 7 weeks of proper training once I made it back out onto the road. Not the ideal preparation, though the fact that I had built up a decent base with weeks of 80-90 miles in November/December got me round the course.

If I remember correctly, in 2007 I ran 6 days a week. I built up the back-to-back runs from 15/15 to 20/20, and I ran it on the hilliest roads I could find. I think I did those 20/20 3 times, and the highest weekly mileage would have been around 85.

I did the ultra in 5:40 in 2007 and 5:50 in 2008.

Aimman

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

I did the ultra in 5:40 in 2007 and 5:50 in 2008.

Wow, well done. Looks like I'll be completing the 1000mile thread earlier next year

Magnet

I did it this yr and my advice would be to tell Everyone and his Mother that you`re doin it and that way you will do the training throughout the winter-I also used this method when I was giving up smoking !?!?!....:P

Just follow the usual marathon plan and add a longish run the day after your long run instead of a recovery run or rest and you`ll be grand.
Here`s my race report,
http://www.athenryac.com/long-version-short-runner

See you at the startline in 2010...!

RacoonQueen

Thats the only place I'll be seeing Magnet before I finish anyway. You going to do the Dingle Ultra Magnet?

Magnet

We`ll see but its not on the list so far for 2010 but then again You never know I`m easily led...
Maybe you do it and I`ll do jam-sandwich duty?!?!

911sc

Best motivator to get out running in dark cold winter mornings/evenings is to have an objective: 11th April 2010 it is.

Just registered for the Ultra and joined the "Nuts" club at the same time. Anyway, i had been thinking about it for the last few months...so better get training now. I also have to find a couple of marathons to run in Feb and March (Spain Seville ?).

kingQuez

Going to give the training for this a go and see how it pans out; cheers to HM for the schedule!