Should I say something or step back?

LegacyUser

Hi guys

Sorry about the length of this, I just wanted to give as much background as possible. I could do with some insight.

I have a friend / work colleague who is really not doing herself any favours with her behaviour. We work in quite a stressful, competitive environment, quite a lively and interesting job but with a lot of downsides too. This girl focuses exclusively on those downsides, talks down the place, b1tches about co-workers and bosses in a very obvious and open way and generally comes into work with a puss on her face that doesn't leave all day. The long hours, tough conditions etc seem to really be beating her down but it's getting downright irritating to listen to.

It obviously worries me as well, what with office politics and whatnot, as I don't want to associated with that sort of negativity in a company I would like to move up in.

But this is just one aspect of it.

We've had a string of work nights out lately where she has seriously let herself down, getting absolutely hammered, launching an attack on whoever is with her, crying hysterically, using anything and everything (generally absolutely nothing) as an excuse to start an argument. She'll also launch into a tirade of self pity, b1tching about the fact that she's not being promoted at work, she has so few friends because of the long hours, she's 29 and still single, etc etc

I don't want to get too specific, but an example of this behaviour is a few weeks back at a work celebration night out, she decided she had a crush on a client, who is apparently single, and who was hosting a barbecue that night. She doesn't know this guy from Adam, but wanted to go to the barbecue in the hope that she would hook up with him. Early in the evening, in jovial spirit, we all made vaguely enthusiastic noises about it, along the lines of 'ah sure we'll see where the night takes us', 9 o'clock comes and we're clearly not going anywhere (bearing in mind there's a group of 15 or 20 of us) and she launches a verbal attack on a few of us, telling us how selfish and self centred we are. And starts crying hysterically.

Just last weekend the same thing happened, she went from apparently happy and in good spirits one second, to more hysterical crying over apparently nothing the next second. Then stormed out of the place, shouting at anyone who went near her and then five minutes later sending a friendly text to one of my colleagues thanking them for a great night ??!!

She will invariably act like everything is normal the next day, with, if anything, a joking reference to how drunk she was and how hilarious it all was.

This girl is 29.

As you can imagine, it's causing a lot of office friction as we're at the point now where several of my colleagues won't even talk to her. I consider her a friend - besides all the drama, I enjoy her company, she's been a good friend to me in the past, and I don't want to turn my back on her.

At this point I am concerned about her, as she is clearly miserable, maybe even depressed?I'm also conflicted though because I think her behaviour is so incredibly immature, irresponsible, selfish...and at her age, with her intelligence, she should have some more cop on.

I can't think of a way to approach her that wouldn't end up in an argument, with her going on the defence and becoming aggressive towards me - this is always the end result when anyone pulls her up on something.

What should I do?

tbh

talk to your HR department. Don't get involved personally, she won't thank you

kittenkiller

Sounds terrible OP.
Whatever you decide to do, do it sober!
This girls's just lucky that the people she lets rip at are much more mature than she is.
Otherwise she could land herself in a lot of trouble.

If you really feel that the relationship is worth salvaging, speak to her about her behaviour.
Have clear instances of when she has been out of line recently to hand.
Be kind, make sure she knows that you're speaking with her about it, not only for her good, but for yours too.

Best of luck.

Oh The Humanity

I would advise you to distance yourself from this girl. She may be a friend to you in more sober moments but she is going to drag your down.

I would go to HR also and seek advice. She really could have a detrimental effact on your career so you need to ensure people dont associate you with her and tar you with the same brush.

As for the girl herself, sounds like she has some mental health issues. But she is unlikely to seek help unless she can recognise a problem herself. Do you know if her family are aware of her problems...?

dudara

It really sounds as if she has some mental health issues going on. Is there anyway that you could suggest to her that she seek some help?

It would be an awful thing if she lost her job/got report to HR over something that she isn't essentially in control of.

seahorse

Oh The Humanity's post seems a bit harsh... so I'm sorry to say I agree with it. I'd keep my distance if I were you OP. A lot of people put stock in that old saying 'Birds of a feather flock together', and you don't need to be associated with someone as unhinged as this woman.

seamus

Are you actually a friend, or someone who talks to her because you work with her? Many people don't know the difference. A friend is someone who you call over to for coffee on a Saturday or who you ask to give you a hand moving house or who you go for a walk with on a Sunday.
A friend who works with you is still your friend, you'll only call them a colleague when you're talking to customers. If you refer to someone you work with as a "colleague", then they are not a friend. You might get on with them and you might go out for a couple of drinks after work some evening, but unless you would actually ring them outside of work, sober and spend time with them in a non-work environment, then they are not a friend, they are a colleague.

I make that distinction because a friend would sit her down and talk to her about it. A colleague would do nothing about it because it's none of your business and from a professional standpoint she stands to do damage to your career if you do interfere.

LegacyUser

Thanks to all for the replies.

I'm in two minds about some of you saying she has mental health issues. This girl is neurotic, VERY highly strung and the kind of girl who flies off the handle at the drop of a hat, and we've all witnessed it - with clients in the office, or a waiter who brings the wrong order when we're out for dinner...I mean, the girl even takes offence to a bit of tongue-in-cheek drunken banter outside a nightclub at 3am. So part of me feels like, this is just who she is (and it gets exaccerbated x 20 with drink...) and I feel sorry for her for it, because she has a bit of a reputation in the office for it.

But then, I feel like this sort of negative, me-against-the-world attitude can't exactly be mentally healthy / normal? It has to stem from something?

I can't speak for her family because I don't know them but I know for a fact that she has driven away friends outside of work because of the way she is. And at work, she 'gets away' with certain behaviours that the rest of us wouldn't (turning up late, disorganisation etc) because the bosses don't want to have to handle one of her strops, on top of all the other daily stresses we have to deal with.

Some of my colleagues are saying she's getting worse, and we can all agree she's a highly unhappy individual, but when I look back on the two years I've spent working here with her, she was as bad on Day One and she is today and even then, threatening to leave and to go 'travelling'. That's never going to happen; she's never going to leave.

I know you're all probably wondering why I'm bothering at all, instead of just distancing myself from her, but she really is a good person despite all this, I would consider her a good friend, she's very intelligent and I get on well with her when she's not ranting/b1tching/throwing a strop. We have similar interests.
Seamus - we're friends through work, but we would meet up over the weekend, go for drinks, cinema etc and I get on with her (when she's behaving!) in the same way I'd get on with any other friend. You're right about pointing out the distinction though, as it is making me hesitant in approaching her, whereas if it was any other friend I would feel it was my duty to say something. Here, I feel like I am walking on egg shells and don't know what the right thing to do is.

Terodil

I agree with the posters urging caution about contacting HR.

Doing that will pretty much destroy her career, and by your OP you don't really want to do that.

I think you have two options:

1. Talk to her in private. If you two are friends it may be a strain initially but ultimately chances are she'll realise you were right, and a wonderful friendship may evolve.

2. If you aren't friends, distance yourself and leave her alone. It's not your business to rat her out to HR. I agree you need to protect yourself, but you can do that in ways that do not push her further into the dirt.

tbh

I don't mean report her to HR, I mean mention to HR that she may be having problems, and maybe they could bring her in to chat to her.

LegacyUser

Oh I know a girl like this (Username) Best thing to do is talk to her about getting professional help ASAP. She simply can't go on like this or she will probably loose her job!

Terodil

tbh wrote: »

I don't mean report her to HR, I mean mention to HR that she may be having problems, and maybe they could bring her in to chat to her.

I would say that entirely depends on the HR dept. In most (read: all) companies I know the result would be the same: A big fat <UNDERPERFORMER> or <UNSUITABLE FOR FURTHER DEVELOPMENT> stamp on her HR file. Another option would be to find a mentor for her in the company, but you can't really take that step without her wanting to do it. So it all goes through addressing the topic with her directly and then taking next steps.

LegacyUser

If you care about her, talk to her. She might be depressed or having some problems. Probably she knows about this behaviour but she cant stop it.

I'd be very upset if a "friend" goes to HR before talking to me.

Miss Fluff

tbh wrote: »

talk to your HR department. Don't get involved personally, she won't thank you

What are you advising the OP to say to the HR Department exactly? That she works with a girl who is a mess with drink on her and gets people's backs up? I really don't think that's a very good idea. It could easily be misconstrued as a veiled attempt on the part of the OP accusing the girl of having a drink problem.

If you are friend of this girl like you claim to be then be straight with her. Next time she makes light of the next night out and how hilarious it all was I'd make it clear just how unfunny it was for everyone else there. I'd also maybe suggest to her that she may have been passed by for promotion if she insists on being abusive and aggressive on work nights out.

acorntoast

I think you have to decide which would be worse for you: Not being friends/dealing with her disappointment and ire if you distance yourself/your (perhaps) sense of guilt at not being straight with her vs her reaction to you talking to her about it.

She seriously sounds well beyond a careful word. But it may be worth it for your own piece of mind to try.

Just remember that it's totally possible for people to have good qualities, and yet not make suitable friends/not be worth your concern.

Ultimately it sounds like she causes you more stress than you can do her good, given her instability.

dirtydress

IF you consider this girl a friend and would like to provide help if she needs it then I would ask her to go for a coffee after work, just the two of you and ask her how things are going and if there's anything she would like to get off her chest. Then at least you could be confident in the knowledge that you tried your best and offered help even if she rejects it.

Do NOT contact HR, you will only be putting her career in jeopardy and its really not your place to get involved in that respect.

LegacyUser

acorntoast wrote: »

Just remember that it's totally possible for people to have good qualities, and yet not make suitable friends/not be worth your concern.

Thanks Acorntoast, I think this is the main issue I am grappling with.

I like to think of myself as a loyal friend, and I know this girl is good at the core, but it just seems to be hassle, hassle, hassle. We'll be getting on like a house on fire, then I'll get a glimpse of this neurosis/aggression - it could be blatant jealousy and b1tching about a mutual friend of ours, or snapping at a randomer for no legitimate reason, or taking offense to something said in jest, etc - and I'm just sitting there bewildered and uncomfortable as hell. I wish she'd snap out of it!

A few of my colleagues have already started to avoid all dealings with her, and I find because of this she's leaning more and more on me, so I feel if I decide I need to separate myself from her, it will be blatantly obvious to her and I really don't want to hurt her feelings or make things worse for her.

After last weekend I felt I needed to say something, so dropped her an email asking if she was OK...which she read (read receipt) and promptly ignored. Later when the subject of Saturday night came up she made some petty excuse about not being able to 'handle shots', which annoys me even more.

There's no question of me going to HR, not going to happen. I think I will have to approach her, but I need to have some sort of strategy, because this girl cannot handle criticism, and no matter how gently I broach it, this to her will be criticism. Nothing is ever her fault. I'm stressed even just thinking about it, to be honest.

As acorntoast said, I really feel she is well beyond a careful word, and at this stage this is a deeply ingrained aspect of her personality. Can people like this change? Not without a serious amount of therapy, is what I am beginning to think.

tbh

Miss Fluff wrote: »

What are you advising the OP to say to the HR Department exactly?

.

tbh wrote: »

I don't mean report her to HR, I mean mention to HR that she may be having problems, and maybe they could bring her in to chat to her.

Stu77

Unfortunately, from what you've said, you will eventually have to distance yourself from her. You shouldn't feel obliged to try and help someone who refuses to admit any wrong doing. And boy does she need to cop on.

If she is as intelligent as you say she is, she will be very aware of her behaviour and its effect on other people. If she was 18 or 19 i'd be inclined to help her out as best i could but at 29 she needs to be told to smarten up and take responsibility for her behavior. I wouldn't waste another minute with her if i was you.

By all means, be friendly and courteous with her but try to keep chat work related if possible. I've workes with a few tools like her and they never learn. Its a pointless exercise trying to make them see sense.