Massa: Renault stole my F1 title

unkel

Article

I mentioned it in the crashgate thread that imho the crash cost Massa the F1 title and it seems he agrees.

11811

Yeah in fairness he does have a point. Be interesting to see how he gets on with Alonso next year so!

unkel

Well as it stands it seems that Alonso knew nothing about the Renault tactics of deliberately causing a crash, so he can't really be blamed for anything, can he?

11811

Yeah it seems so anyway, I just hoping for a little "in team" rivalry to spice things up a bit!
Even if the standings were stuck out, it would be a fairly awful way to win a championship.

Ghost Train

Do think the FIA should have made that win null and void as the team cheated. Don't think the points at the end of the race should be changed for any of the other drivers, Rosberg still came second, Hamilton still came third etc. Massa no points

Can see why Massa might feel a bit angry but Ferrari screwed up his race not Renault. Theres always pressure at a pitstop and the engineer might still have pressed the button even with fewer cars pitting. Rosberg and Hamilton and there respective teams had the same pressures on them that Massa had and to award him any points or the championship would be a joke

unkel

Ghost Train wrote: »

Do think the FIA should have made that win null and void as the team cheated. Don't think the points at the end of the race should be changed for any of the other drivers, Rosberg still came second, Hamilton still came third etc. Massa no points

You're missing the point. Massa was leading the race when the accident happened!

EvilMonkey

He just said he feels it cost him the title which it probably did although no one can say how the last few races would have paned out if he won.
He is not saying anything should be changed other than taking the win off Renault, which most people would agree with.

Ghost Train

unkel wrote: »

You're missing the point. Massa was leading the race when the accident happened!

Story says "Massa says renault stole his title".... if there was no crash whos to say the same pit stop mess up wouldn't have happened during a regular scheduled stop

Didn't Kimi also have a dodgy pitstop with the traffic light system?

If Massa had gained more points in Singapore, who to say McLaren wouldn't have been more agressive with their stragegies in the races that followed, it all what ifs.

G-Money

I was a bit surprised at that, but not so surprised that he forgot how he inherited the Spa victory that was rightly Hamilton's.

unkel

Ghost Train wrote: »

it all what ifs.

Indeed.

EvilMonkey

grandmaster wrote: »

I was a bit surprised at that, but not so surprised that he forgot how he inherited the Spa victory that was rightly Hamilton's.

He was rightfully given a time penalty for gaining an advantage after cutting a corner.

Ghost Train

Was a great title battle indeed

Right down to the last corner

G-Money

EvilMonkey wrote: »

He was rightfully given a time penalty for gaining an advantage after cutting a corner.

I still think it was unnecessarily harsh. It doesn't matter, the right man won the title in the end

unkel

Ghost Train wrote: »

Was a great title battle indeed

Right down to the last corner

A great title battle at the time. But not so great now we know what's been going on. Massa should be world champion, not Hamilton. But there's nothing we can do about it now...

Ghost Train

unkel wrote: »

A great title battle at the time. But not so great now we know what's been going on. Massa should be world champion, not Hamilton. But there's nothing we can do about it now...

Well I don't agree. Just cause massa had a bad race its easy to say the full results shouldnt stand. Hamilton earned his third place at that race under the same conditions massa raced under.

here hamiltons response

"First, I should say that it's good to hear that Felipe is recovering well and that he's back to his normal self and feeling good," Hamilton said. "I'm shocked to hear him say that because I've always felt him a fair driver and he knows that we had a fair battle right to the end, at least that's how I saw it.

"All we can say is that it was a tough season, things happened. There were lots and lots of 'what-ifs' throughout the season so I'm a bit surprised to hear him say that because I thought we had quite a fair battle and I won it fair and square, so it doesn't matter to me what he said."

Slutmonkey57b

Regardless of whether Alonso deserves the win, Massa certainly doesn't deserve the title. He went out of that race because he drove off with the fuel hose attached. Ferrari had 100% control over that particular situation, and they ballsed it up. If Alonso is stripped of vicotry, Hamilton and Rosberg go up a place, he is still a DNF.

Top Dog

The only possible way (and probably fairest if it were to happen taking all the "what if's" into account) would be to null and void ALL the results from that race. Then Massa would have the title alright.

But its not going to happen. Ferrari aren't going to appeal it, so while Massa has his little hissy-fit about it, it'll all be forgotten soon enough when attention gets diverted to the drivers market.

EvilMonkey

Heres what Massa said

"I was very upset with everything that happened," Massa said. "Not only with what Renault did, which was theft. It created a lot of things, and the safety car with Nelson Piquet meant that most of the cars had to go the pits, and I was one of them. We had 10 cars going in. My stop went wrong. There were too many of us at the same time. A mechanic pressed a button in a situation that would never have happened in a normal pit stop. That's why it bothers me, that Renault stole the win.

"The result remains the same," Massa continued, alluding to Alonso's tarnished victory. "This is not right. For me it should have been changed. I lost the title by one point. But I am not and never will be a driver who thinks, 'I could have been world champion'. Even if they write today in my CV that I am the champion, after a year, I don't think it would make any difference. There comes a time when there is nothing that can be done. It is the rule, and the FIA decide."

He never said he should be world champion, he said he feels it cost him the world championship and Alonsos win should not stand.

He wants the win taken from Rennalt not the drivers championship changed.
Nowhere dose he say he should be world champion he says he could have been world champion and that if it was changed it wouldn't make a difference.

Ghost Train

EvilMonkey wrote: »

Heres what Massa said


He never said he should be world champion, he said he feels it cost him the world championship and Alonsos win should not stand.

He wants the win taken from Rennalt not the drivers championship changed.
Nowhere dose he say he should be world champion he says he could have been world champion and that if it was changed it wouldn't make a difference.

well this is another quote from Massa blaming the crash for him losing the title

“All of what happened was robbery — but regarding the race nothing has happened, the result remains the same,” Massa said on television in Brazil. “This is not right. The robbery changed the outcome of a championship and I lost the title.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article6858518.ece

If the complete race result was annuled and nobody got points for that race massa would have won championship but I think in most other sports when cheaters are disqualified the results still stand for the other competitors, or in f1 in the past an illegal car would just mean that that one car gets no points, the other drivers move up a position.

Might be down to a quote taken out of context by massa or the translation but does come across badly if he feels it was his championship. Maybe all the press coverage has misrepresented him.

EvilMonkey

Ghost Train wrote: »

well this is another quote from Massa blaming the crash for him losing the title


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article6858518.ece

If the complete race result was annuled and nobody got points for that race massa would have won championship but I think in most other sports when cheaters are disqualified the results still stand for the other competitors, or in f1 in the past an illegal car would just mean that that one car gets no points, the other drivers move up a position.

Might be down to a quote taken out of context by massa or the translation but does come across badly if he feels it was his championship. Maybe all the press coverage has misrepresented him.

I don't see where he says the world championship should be taken from Hamilton and given to him. I see stories in the media mostly English that are suggesting that.
From what I have read i think he is talking about the Renault win/lack of punishment, I could be wrong.
Hamilton believes he should have won in spa, Massa believes he should have won the championship both aren't true.