Space Marines?

Naessens

I currently collect orks in warhammer but want to start collecting 40k.

I love hoard armies because of the fact that you can have more than twice the amount of troops than your opponents, but i hate the fact that its so exspensive to buy all the models.

So... i want an army that is expensive pointswise but cheap moneywise:D

the space marines seem good and are mostly plastic so they would seem the choice for me.

Any advice?

hairyheretic

Space Marines or Chaos Space Marines, either would probably fit your criteria.

Do you favour a particular chapter?

Do you favour a particular style of play?

We'd want to know a bit more about what you like before we start offering advice on units and such.

Naessens

im not sure what tactics id like to use, id kind of like them to unfold the more i use the army. I suppose good shooting until i get up close and then butchering them in close combat, im not too sure what tactics are effective in 40k:(

hinduhamster

It's always worth looking for good Warhammer sellers on eBay. Depends where you shop yourself but if it is Games Workshop you'll likely get a better deal online.

If you can get your hands on a codexes, check out the nids and orks. They're the two horde armies that I know of anyway.

Naessens

yeah ive benn looking at space marines on ebay. they're alll at least half price!

I dont want another hoard army, because i dont want to spend loads of money and i want to try new tactics

hinduhamster

Oh sorry! completely missed the point:rolleyes:

Marines are pretty diverse so they're good if you are only starting off. You can opt between heavy firepower and close combat or a balanced mix. Hairyheretic summed it up well, it's hard to advise until you find out a bit more what you're after.

Maybe think about a small 750 point army and see what that will cost you?

Don't know if that's any help.

themurphyfella

If you like amrine armies I'd reccommend heading over to the bolter and chainsword forum. They;ve got army list dicussions and samples, chapter background and some great converting and painting forums.

Cy_Revenant

Naessens wrote: »

im not sure what tactics id like to use, id kind of like them to unfold the more i use the army. I suppose good shooting until i get up close and then butchering them in close combat, im not too sure what tactics are effective in 40k:(

Space Marines are good at everything. You can do whatever you want with them.

Mantel

Well the basics of the Marine army are either scouts or tactical squads, your troop choices. You could have a third option (bikes) but we'll forget that for now.

The cheapest most basic army you could do is a HQ choice and 2 tactical squads (you could throw in two Rhino transports to get them around a bit faster and have some mobile terrain) Two obvious options if you want to spend the least amount of monies either the Black Reach set (you should be able to find lots of black reach mini's on ebay for cheap) or the battleforce (you'd have to buy a HQ to be able to play the battleforce set, cheap black reach captain on ebay!) If you go with chaos it shouldn't be too hard to convert the black reach marines, lots of people have done it.

You say you want to try some different tactics, what tactics have you been using with your Ork amry? I don't know fantasy so I don't know if you can do shooty, assualt or mechanised armies.

Ayrtonf7

to be honest alot of Armys in WFB tend to be extremly expensive, horde or not. Due to the fact nearly all elite units are made of Metal.

As for Space marines I know they are ideal for new players as they are so vesatile, But saying that they can be transformed into an elite strike force at the same time. Your best bet is to buy a codex, look around the rules a little bit, ask a few fellow games on some of your sample army lists, and take it from there.

Warmaster

New Space Wolf Codex is out soon, it will be made up of small elite units that cost a lot of points, wait one month and have a look at that codex mate.

Lemming

Warmaster wrote: »

New Space Wolf Codex is out soon, it will be made up of small elite units that cost a lot of points, wait one month and have a look at that codex mate.

Space Wolves - like some other armies - are a very specialised & stylised army list and whilst outstanding in some areas, are weak in others thus requiring you know what you're doing with them. Not a particularly newbie-friendly army in fairness.

Naessens

i was thinking of getting assault on black reach for the rule book and dice etc. mine are mostly missing or botched.

with the orcs i usually move my army quickly to be able to get into close combat, weakening units with fanatics and artillery and using the etra units to get flank and out numbering bonuses to win combat resolution.

but as far as i know theres no flanking in 40k and combat resouloution is easier to avoid. so those tactics aren't much good.

if the units are versatile i can try different weapons in different games to see what i like.

i think ill just paint the marines the way i would like to and make up a new chapter, i can do that right?

Ayrtonf7

Naessens wrote: »

i was thinking of getting assault on black reach for the rule book and dice etc. mine are mostly missing or botched.

with the orcs i usually move my army quickly to be able to get into close combat, weakening units with fanatics and artillery and using the etra units to get flank and out numbering bonuses to win combat resolution.

but as far as i know theres no flanking in 40k and combat resouloution is easier to avoid. so those tactics aren't much good.

if the units are versatile i can try different weapons in different games to see what i like.

i think ill just paint the marines the way i would like to and make up a new chapter, i can do that right?

You most certainly cant paint your models the way you like.

And yeah your best bet is to take it from black reach after you have purchased it. It really is great value.

Naessens

So i have to use a pre-set chapter? But don't they all have specific rules?

Also on bolter and chainsword they have a chapter name generator and a space marine painter.

These seem to indicate that i can make my own chapter and just use basic space marine rules.

Cy_Revenant

Ayrtonf7 wrote: »

You most certainly cant paint your models the way you like.

And yeah your best bet is to take it from black reach after you have purchased it. It really is great value.

Why not?

I can paint my marines in sky blue and electric pink.

I'll call them Moondancers, they'll be the custodians of the Emperors Rose Garden.

Warmaster

Naessens wrote: »

So i have to use a pre-set chapter? But don't they all have specific rules?

Also on bolter and chainsword they have a chapter name generator and a space marine painter.

These seem to indicate that i can make my own chapter and just use basic space marine rules.

Paint your chapter whatever colours you want!! There is absolutely no rule saying you can't!

Mantel

Cy_Revenant wrote: »

Why not?

I can paint my marines in sky blue and electric pink.

I'll call them Moondancers, they'll be the custodians of the Emperors Rose Garden.

Sounds like slanesh worshipers to me!

Naessens

The codex arrived!
I haven't made an army list but if i get assault on black reach and the battalion (i can get both for €100)

i'll have:

2 units of 10 tactical marines
1 combat squad (which ill paint to look like veterans)
5 assault marines
5 terminators
a captain
A dreadnought
A rhino
5 scouts

so i think ill build my army around this, maybe a librarian and a few more troops to bring it up to 1500 points. is this a good idea, what extra troops should i add? all advice welcome

themurphyfella

That's a fine Space marine army based around tac marines and a little bit of everything.

Only problem is it's very light on armour and transport. Meaning it would quiet likely get outmanoeuvred and eaten for lunch by a large number of armies out there.

Not a problem as long as you have a set of gamers who play at the same level but taking that list to a competitive tournament would be a very disheartening experience. I did it for a few tournaments back when I started with my space wolves in 2nd ed.

General good rules of thumb for starting playing marine armies
1. Transports or drop pods for everything. Proptection and movement in one package
2. Play in all the areas of the game unless you've got a specific theme
3. Think carefully about the named characters and if they might enhance your strengths or cover a weakness
4. include some melta weapons
5. Terminators with stormshields are very cool and very tough. Transport is an issue but Landraiders are tough units in their own right.
6. Assault marines are lots of points, tricky to keep alive and need numbers on their side for when they inevitably take casualties
7. Predators and Razorbacks give you mobile heavy weapons that can usually stand up to a bit of punishment
8. Powersword vs powerfist. It's a bit of a personal preference thing and a bit of a "what else do you have " thing. I tend to fall on the Hell yea give me the big hitty thing please. But then again I've been playing a lot of orks recently

My advice to you is to make army lists. Lots of them
Then pick one you think you like and play it unaltered for at least 5-6 games. Resist the temptation to rework your list every game because you'l lconfuse yourself mid game with "did I give xx the yyy thing this game??". At least I do.

After 5-6 games you'll have a feel for how the army works, a list of units that have earned your disgust and an irrattional attachment to a few units or figures that saved your bacon, or at least didn't die horribly

hinduhamster

I'd recommend making a 750 pt list first. Play with that for a while, just to get used to the army. Get a feel for the troops.

Then expand to....maybe 1250-1500. Get a feel of the basics and then expand on what you feel you need. Maybe vehicles or more troops.

Do not go for a "1500 pt" army straight off. Do not go bananas and try have a bit of everything at the beginning.

Start small.... (it sounds crap I know).... then build on it.

Naessens

ill throw up an army list, 750pts, later today and if you see strenghts and weaknesses tell me

Oh at the moment ill be playing against chaos space marines and eldar.

Tenger

Naessens wrote: »

So i have to use a pre-set chapter? But don't they all have specific rules?
Also on bolter and chainsword they have a chapter name generator and a space marine painter.
These seem to indicate that i can make my own chapter and just use basic space marine rules.

I would suggest getting the Assault on black Reach Box followed by the SM Battleforce. You can then add a devastator box and a command squad box. These are priced at EUR 65+80+30+30=205. For this, admittedly, big initial outlay you will have a full 1500 points of space marines. Just quickly did an army list on the PC! (Resulting army- Captain and 5 man command squad with rhino transport, 5 man termie squad, dreadnought, 2 10 man tactical squads, 5 man scout squad, 5 man assault squad,10 man devastator squad.) This is you basic but solid space marine army. From there you can play and decide how you want to alter the army to suit you, more fast assault units, more shooty units, fast bikers, some tanks, more elites etc.........

The Black reach set is great value, its 65 while if you tried to buy the marines models seperately they would cost you 90! In additon you get equivalent amount of Orks models and the very handy pocket sized rulebook.

You also need the SM codex to make your army list and play. The codex also lists about 15 special characters. Each character/heroes is from a particular chapter but the rules allow you to use their profile in your army. Example-you can use Chaplain Cassius of the Ultramarines in your army but call him High Priest Naassens of the Dark Marines if you want. His stats,equipment, rules,points stay the same. Several of the heroes also grant particular abilities/rules to your army so you can fork out cash for the special cahracters (or use your own models as stand ins) and use them to alter the style of your army.

After that you can decide what chapter you prefer 'normal' marines such as Ultramarines, marines with a bit of flavour like Iron Hands, Salamanders, Blood Ravens or Crimson Fists, mechanised marines like White Scars, howling close combat monsters such as Black Templars,Blood Angels or Space Wolves, or the variant rules of the Dark Angels which allow all bikes or all terminator models. Have them undercoated until you decide the coulour scheme you want.

I second the guys above. Start with the Black Reach models, approx 750 points. Try out the rules and army. Then when you have more models add more points, up to 1000 for a few games then up to 1250, finally up to 1500 or 1750. This progressions will give you an idea of where you want to go with the army. Do you need tanks/armour, do you want more assault, do you want more ranged fiepower, you you want/need to use special characters? etc........

I think in 5th Edition the main points are: transports for your troops are good as you need mobility to win (claiming objectives), melta weapons are good as they can take out opposing transports/armour. You will need tanks at some points. Every other army is geared up to defeat marines or their equivalents (MEQ is the term) so expect to lose troops until to figure out how to counter opponents.

Naessens

How about this:

Librarian, 100pts

10 man tactical w. Flamer and Multi-Melta, 170pts

10 man tactical W. flamer and missle launcher, 170pts

5 man scout squad w. shotgun/sniper rifle/combat blade. (dont know which would be most effective) 75pts

Terminator squad, 200pts

Rhino for either Tactical squad, 35pts


All together that's 750pts.

Btw, i think ill do a Navy w. yellow on shoulder pad trim and helmet coulour scheme

cilliannolan

I'm sellin a space marine battle force and razor back both new and sealed in box name your price