Registrar

markpb

We're getting married in October next year. A lot of our friends and both our priests told us to get in touch with the Registrars office as soon as possible to get the state paperwork out of the way. I rang the Dublin office today to get an appointment but they won't give us one until 3.5 months before the wedding. When I broached the subject of an earlier appointment, I was brushed off and told June 2010 was fine.

My fiancè gets frustrated when things are left to the last minute (but is of course wonderful and beautiful ) thinks is a little strange to only have two weeks to spare if anything goes wrong. Is this normal?

tatli_lokma

its got nothing to do with leaving things to the last minute - its for legal reasons.

You will be signing a declaration that you are notalready married / there is no legal reason why you can't get married - this declaration is valid for only a max of 3 mths so this is why they don't bother making appointments prior to this, as there is no point to do so. Once you have confirmed that the date is available that is the main thing.

But why are your priests advising you contact the registrars office? if you are having a religious ceremony the priest should be taking care of this for you - AFAIK you only need to meet with the registrar and make an appointment if you are having a civil ceremony. If you are having a church ceremony then different paperwork is required (baprismal certs, confirmation etc) and you give this to the priest who will then lodge all the required paperwork for you.

markpb

Cincikchick wrote: »

You will be signing a declaration that you are notalready married / there is no legal reason why you can't get married - this declaration is valid for only a max of 3 mths so this is why they don't bother making appointments prior to this, as there is no point to do so. Once you have confirmed that the date is available that is the main thing.

That makes sense, thanks.

But why are your priests advising you contact the registrars office? if you are having a religious ceremony the priest should be taking care of this for you - AFAIK you only need to meet with the registrar and make an appointment if you are having a civil ceremony. If you are having a church ceremony then different paperwork is required (baprismal certs, confirmation etc) and you give this to the priest who will then lodge all the required paperwork for you.

Both parts are required for religious ceremonies, one set of papers which allows the Church to recognise your wedding and the other set which allow the State to recognise your wedding. We're doing the second ones at the moment.

Eyeofthetiger

Guess we're screwed then, we had our appointment in July and we're getting married in March.

OP I believe the Dublin registrar's office is extremely busy you might have better luck with one outside Dublin if you can get to it. You don't have to do it in the same place you are from or getting married in afaik.

Best of luck with the planning!

penexpers

Cincikchick wrote: »

its got nothing to do with leaving things to the last minute - its for legal reasons.

You will be signing a declaration that you are notalready married / there is no legal reason why you can't get married - this declaration is valid for only a max of 3 mths so this is why they don't bother making appointments prior to this, as there is no point to do so. Once you have confirmed that the date is available that is the main thing.

But why are your priests advising you contact the registrars office? if you are having a religious ceremony the priest should be taking care of this for you - AFAIK you only need to meet with the registrar and make an appointment if you are having a civil ceremony. If you are having a church ceremony then different paperwork is required (baprismal certs, confirmation etc) and you give this to the priest who will then lodge all the required paperwork for you.

The advice in this post is wrong.

When you meet with the registrar, you indicate the date of your marriage and your notification of intent to marry is valid until that date (I think you are allowed change the date though).

Secondly, it was the old way that the priests would also take care of the civil aspects of the marriage but this has no changed. No matter if you are having a ceromony in a church or not you have to meet with the registrar more than three months in advance of the wedding to notify the state of your intention to marry.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/birth-family-relationships/getting-married/notification_requirements_for_marriage

tatli_lokma

markpb wrote: »

Both parts are required for religious ceremonies, one set of papers which allows the Church to recognise your wedding and the other set which allow the State to recognise your wedding. We're doing the second ones at the moment.

yeah I know both parts are required, but AFAI was aware, the priest can arrange all this for you - have never heard of someone marrying in a church also needing the registrar appt - thought given that the priest can act on behalf of the registrar, meeting him was enough??? or perhaps I am wrong

Eyeofthetiger

This has been changed reasonably recently (last couple of years or later)...probably nothing to do with some priests not sending back the forms in time... :rolleyes:

You have to make an appt with the registrar now no matter which type you go for. Oh and that'll be 150 euro for the pleasure too...

tatli_lokma

penexpers wrote: »

The advice in this post is wrong.

When you meet with the registrar, you indicate the date of your marriage and your notification of intent to marry is valid until that date (I think you are allowed change the date though).

eh, no its not wrong - I got married just last May. Your notifcation to marry may be valid until the date of marriage - but the DECLARATION you sign to declare that there is no legal impediment to your marriage is only valid for a certain length of time.

Also you have to notify your intention to marry 3 mths before - but this does not have to be done in person, you can make a postal application (as I did). However you must meet the registrar to sign your declaration within 3 mths of the wedding, and no less than 5 days before the wedding. As mentioned before, this legal declaration is only valid for a set amount of time.

edit to add - wouldn't put too much faith in the info from Citizens info site - have checked several things on that site over the last few weeks and almost all of it has been out of date or blatantly incorrect! Go to the HSE site instead if you want info on registering a wedding.

tatli_lokma

Eyeofthetiger wrote: »

Guess we're screwed then, we had our appointment in July and we're getting married in March.

you probably won't have signed your declaration yet though - you will either need to go in again closer to the date, or you may be able to sign this declaration via your priest (not sure) but the declaration needs to be no older than 4 mths from the date of the wedding (hense why registrar prob gave the OP a date .3.5 mths ahead of wedding).

The problem with registry office is getting dates you want for civil ceremonies - this is the main challenge. If a registrar is not performing the ceremony and it is in a church, then I wouldn't worry about the date for the registrar being close to the wedding - would only worry if you wanted a civil ceremony on a certain date.

penexpers

Cincikchick wrote: »

you probably won't have signed your declaration yet though - you will either need to go in again closer to the date, or you may be able to sign this declaration via your priest (not sure) but the declaration needs to be no older than 4 mths from the date of the wedding (hense why registrar prob gave the OP a date .3.5 mths ahead of wedding).

Quote from HSE

Attending at the office of the Registrar
At the notification meeting you will be asked to sign a declaration that there is no impediment to your marriage. You will be given a Marriage Registration Form which is your licence to marry. This form will be signed by you and your witnesses and Solemniser on the day of your marriage. When it is returned to any registrar’s office, your marriage will be registered and it will then be possible for you to purchase a marriage certificate.

If it needs to be signed less than four months from the wedding, then why are the registrars giving out notification appointments months in advance of weddings and getting people to sign this declaration at the notification meeting (exactly what happened me - signed the declaration even though appointment was well in advance of four months of wedding).

Eyeofthetiger

Nope...I'm pretty certain we signed the declaration of no impediment. And we definitely don't have to go back in to them unless we want to hand the forms back in personally after the wedding, I made sure to check this myself.

Sorry OP for overtaking your thread like this.
http://www.gettingmarried.ie is a a great site for what you need to do and when for church weddings.

Kar!

Im not getting married till the end of October nest year either and my OH and I signed our declaration of marriage in June and was told it will stay valid. And yeah paying 150e just for that is a wee bit of a joke to be honest!

Cincikchick

Cincikchick wrote: »

you probably won't have signed your declaration yet though - you will either need to go in again closer to the date, or you may be able to sign this declaration via your priest (not sure) but the declaration needs to be no older than 4 mths from the date of the wedding (hense why registrar prob gave the OP a date .3.5 mths ahead of wedding).

That's not true. I'm literally in the door from the registration office. We've just signed everything and taken our MRF home with us. All done, and we're not getting married until June 2010.

The declaration is valid for six months after the intended date of marriage.

tatli_lokma

well all I know is, when we were originally arranging the wedding we were deciding between here and abroad. the cert of non-impediment only lasts for 6 mths from the date you sign - I was explicity told this and they went through it very clearly. the awkward bit was that you can't apply for it more than 6 mths before the wedding as it will expire, and for marriage abroad (except Italy) it can take a few weeks. I asked is this declaration the same as if you get married here - told by several parties YES. Due to the hassle of this, we opted to marry here, as my partner needs nothing other than birth cert to marry here, but I needed cert of non-imped to marry abroad.

Perhaps, as it is a church ceremony there are different rules, but we were told on many occasions that the declaration is valid for only 6 mths max. This is because it diminishes the change of bigamy or situations changing - if you need to give 3 mths notice then the window in which you can get married is lessened, so less chance of signing the declaration and getting married in the time between that and getting married!

We signed two forms - the first was a notification of intent to marry, and the second was the declaration. We then signed another declaration on the wedding day, declaring that nothing had changed since we signed our first declaration. Perhaps this is where they bend the rules?

Friend getting married in March - they are meeting registrar at end of sept to sign notification. They have the date pencilled in for the ceremony already. They will have to attend again in December to sign the declaration - they were told this only last Friday.

Seems to be different registrars give different information......what a surprise from the HSE - whomever would have thought it!???:rolleyes:

regardless, in answer to the OP - I wouldn't worry or stress in the slightest that your appointment is only 3.5 mths away - it is genuinely not an issue.

tatli_lokma

Kar! wrote: »

And yeah paying 150e just for that is a wee bit of a joke to be honest!

Slightly off topic, but I don't find paying to have the marriage civilly recognised a problem - my issue is with the church charging you to marry there when you have to go and get paperwork done civilly anyway. In most of Europe, once you are getting married in the parish of one half of the couple you do not have to pay for the priviledge of getting married in a church. And you don't get told you have to pay for flowers, the organist, alterboys/girls etc. I told a German friend about this paying for the church and she was amazed - if a church in germany asked this they would be laughed at. then again, generally people don't marry in a church in Germany if they are not religious - unlike here.

Our local church wanted €450 for the use of the church, priest, one alterboy/girl and use of the flowers that were there anyway! organist or music would be extra and a cleaning fee of €50 would be charged if the priest deemed it necessary! If I didn't want to use the flowers there he would take them off the alter and charge me €50 less! Plus we'd have to do that joke of a premarriage course! I'm not religious, so when I heard that it was very easy to make up my mind for a civil marriage!
We had our wedding in a Castle for significantly less than that, including the call out for the registrar!

whatdoicare

Cincikchick wrote: »

We had our wedding in a Castle for significantly less than that, including the call out for the registrar!

Hey cinkcikchick- I know this is off topic- but how did you go about getting the regestrar, how much did it cost and do they do saturdays? I'm trying (trying being the operative word here) to get married in knappogue castle with civil ceremony and blessing and were running into brick walls everywhere.

tatli_lokma

whatdoicare wrote: »

how much did it cost

ok, to register any marriage costs €150. Then after that you need to pay a call out fee which is based upon the mileage the registrar has to travel. So it varies. Mine was €60 from Dublin to Balbriggan which is about 25miles.

whatdoicare wrote: »

and do they do saturdays?

AFAIK no they don't - civil servants, working 9-5 mon-Fri! I think you can get saturdays in the registry office itself, but not for off site(may be wrong, others, feel free to correct me here). My wedding was via the Dublin registrar and we were told no to a saturday. It may be different in other regions -easiest way is to call the office and ask.

whatdoicare wrote: »

civil ceremony and blessing and were running into brick walls everywhere.

you cannot have any religious connotations to a civil ceremony, so if you want a blessing they will have to take place as seperate ceremonies. There can be no religious symbols etc at the civil ceremony, so even the room must be clear of these things - so no crucifixes, statues etc. I found it hard to get a priest to agree to a blessing, as technically these are not recognised by the catholic church, so again it will depend on the priest you get and their personal opinion on it - I know some of them are happy to do it, but others give a resounding no.

I don't know why you are hitting such brick walls. For me it was very simple and straight forward, and all arranged withing a few weeks (we were married 14 weeks after we applied for the date!).
First step, ring registry office and ask if the date you would like is available. If so, get the forms for off site civil ceremony, and arrange for your appointment to fill in the paperwork needed (this is required for ALL weddings, civil or religious).
Provided your venue meets the criteria, it is really just a rubber stamp issue. Fill in the form with the venue, send it off, registrar will come out and say yay or nay. If they have approved it previously it stands a very high chance of being approved again (provided you are not doing something different to the others). Once the venue is approved, registry office will then tell you how much it will cost for the registrar to call out and you pay it and there you go.

The registry office staff are very helpful and the HSE website is useful too. I found the staff in the office to be lovely and very accommodating, so your first step is really to give them a call. I see your biggest issue being getting a religious ceremony and the fact that it will have to be totally seperate from the civil one.

Good luck:)

whatdoicare

Cincikchick wrote: »

AFAIK no they don't - civil servants, working 9-5 mon-Fri! I think you can get saturdays in the registry office itself, but not for off site(may be wrong, others, feel free to correct me here). My wedding was via the Dublin registrar and we were told no to a saturday. It may be different in other regions -easiest way is to call the office and ask.

Ah well thats a pain- who gets married on a weekday?? That'll be to inconvenient for most of my relatives and my hubby too TBH.

you cannot have any religious connotations to a civil ceremony, so if you want a blessing they will have to take place as seperate ceremonies. There can be no religious symbols etc at the civil ceremony, so even the room must be clear of these things - so no crucifixes, statues etc. I found it hard to get a priest to agree to a blessing, as technically these are not recognised by the catholic church, so again it will depend on the priest you get and their personal opinion on it - I know some of them are happy to do it, but others give a resounding no.

We have a celtic monk doing a handfasting blessing ceremony- he was the easiest part to organise haha. I'm not religious and not fussed about a priest or any of that- but a civil is just too short and kind of boring plus I have 150 guests! All I want is to organise the registration part, which is really annoyingly hard to do- the rules are very outdated and very much in the thinking of convincing us to go to a church that's easier and "normal".

tatli_lokma

whatdoicare wrote: »

Ah well thats a pain- who gets married on a weekday?? That'll be to inconvenient for most of my relatives and my hubby too TBH.

well I got married on a weekday, as do many many people, perhaps reconsider the tone of your reply? sorry a weekday wedding is too inconvenient for making a committment to your partner! :rolleyes:

whatdoicare wrote: »

We have a celtic monk doing a handfasting blessing ceremony- he was the easiest part to organise haha. I'm not religious and not fussed about a priest or any of that- but a civil is just too short and kind of boring plus I have 150 guests! All I want is to organise the registration part, which is really annoyingly hard to do- the rules are very outdated and very much in the thinking of convincing us to go to a church that's easier and "normal".

I honestly don't see how it can be "annoyingly" hard to do - it is simple and straight forward. And a civil ceremony does not have to be short - you can personalise it. Ours was about 45 mins, maybe a little bit more. There is no way that it is "outdated" or putting barriers and making it "easier" to have a normal church wedding - I think you are finding barriers that are not there. ALL marriages, even in a church have to register. I had a female registrar - certainly not an option for a catholic service, we had our own music, our own personalised vows, readings, symbols etc. In no way outdated and very personal.

you asked for advice, I gave it. Its a simple process and there is lots of help out there. TBH you seem to be quite negative towards the process which will only make the thing stressful and a hassle. Its not a big deal to organise at all. And I would be mindful of calling certain elements of a ceremony boring - as a person who had a civil ceremony I am a bit miffed at that! If your ceremony is boring, the only blame is with you, as you can make it as personal as you want, you just have to want to make the effort.

whatdoicare

Cincikchick wrote: »

well I got married on a weekday, as do many many people, perhaps reconsider the tone of your reply? sorry a weekday wedding is too inconvenient for making a committment to your partner! :rolleyes:

Cinkcikchick, I apologise to you, I in no way meant to insult or belittle you in any way shape or form- I hope you can forgive me.
What I meant by that was that it would be hard for my hubby and his family (not one or two individuals, I mean the majority and a good chunk of my own family tbh) to have to take a weekday day off and unfair to expect them to, given their professions, relatives have to travel from England aswell which will be very hard for them on a weekday, also kids would have to be taken out of school which isn't a good thing to do as we all know.

I honestly don't see how it can be "annoyingly" hard to do - it is simple and straight forward. And a civil ceremony does not have to be short - you can personalise it. Ours was about 45 mins, maybe a little bit more. There is no way that it is "outdated" or putting barriers and making it "easier" to have a normal church wedding - I think you are finding barriers that are not there. ALL marriages, even in a church have to register. I had a female registrar - certainly not an option for a catholic service, we had our own music, our own personalised vows, readings, symbols etc. In no way outdated and very personal.

In st Camillas', Limerick- it's pretty much wham bam thank you maam, Obviously it's different if you pay for one to come to a venue but not possible on a Sasturday. , no room for personalisation either bar an odd poem or reading,(well, according to the fellow we met with about the subject) Also the office is tiny and can fit about five people if we all lose a good few stone each- haha

you asked for advice, I gave it.
Its a simple process and there is lots of help out there. TBH you seem to be quite negative towards the process which will only make the thing stressful and a hassle. Its not a big deal to organise at all. And I would be mindful of calling certain elements of a ceremony boring - as a person who had a civil ceremony I am a bit miffed at that! If your ceremony is boring, the only blame is with you, as you can make it as personal as you want, you just have to want to make the effort.

Oh no, I'm sorry, I didn't mean that as a personal attack- I'm sure that your personalised ceremony was very beautiful- just, I attended a friends wedding here and it was all of ten minutes long and very impersonal. That was just my own experience of it. I was very afraid mine would be similar.

Again, sorry if I offended you in any way and I sincerely apologise to you.

tatli_lokma

whatdoicare wrote: »

Again, sorry if I offended you in any way and I sincerely apologise to you.

no serious offence taken, its just really frustrating how many people think that a civil ceremony equals a short, boring, unpersonal experience. In addition to my own I have been to 3 civil ceremonies, all of which were lovely, and also from on this forum I got some lovely ideas so clearly other people also have very nice civil ceremonies. Before the wedding I found quite a few people (thankfully none of which were actually coming to my wedding I might add!) kind of turned their noses up at the idea of a civil ceremony. One going so far as to outright say that it wouldn't be as special as a church affair! I got married in a castle for goodness sake! not like it was in a ditch at the side of the road! so I possibly am a little frustrated and touchy about it, for which I apologise also!

TBH the registrar you speak of sounds like a numpty! anyone I know who had a civil ceremony were more than free to add in their own bits provided they weren't religious in any way (your celtic ceremony would still be classed as religious I'm afraid so would have to be done totally seperately from the civil part!)

Having said that, there are licenced officiants apparently who are registered to solemnise a marriage and they do not have to be so stringent to these rules (as they are not civil servants so don't need to follow the same rules as they do not work for the state). One hotel we had considered had the name of an officiant who would perform the ceremony for €350 (:eek: plus the €150 reg anyway!!!!) Apparently he could perform the ceremony outside which the registrar would not - now they may have been totally spinning me a line, which is entirely possible! but it is an avenue worth searching. Some 'clergy' are also licenced officiants (hence why priests can register you and you don't need a registry wedding and a church wedding). I know there is supposedly some monk in the West who does such things. Other boardsies may be of more help on this one.

But like I said, don't let it get you down too much - weddings can be stressful, but a lot of it is being determined NOT to let it stress you TOO much! Just approach it as something that has to be done, so get it done and the paperwork over with so you can concentrate on other things - don't let it be too big an issue. You should enjoy the process, not feel its a hassle, and with everything you need to do it can easily feel like a hassle if you don't discipline yourself to be 'calm'! that is just some advice from a former bride who organised a wedding in 14 weeks and managed to avoid being medicated through it!:P

(oh PS - if all else fails a quick trip to the reg office by you, HTB, and witnesses, dot eh formal bit, don't even think of it as your 'wedding day' just part of the paperwork. Then arrange the wedding for the saturday after with a monk, priest, druid, monkey in a clown suit....whatever! to perform the 'special' bit. I know that is what some others have done to resolve the weekend wedding bit)

magconn

oh lads. whatever ye do , dont get caught out like me.. back in the day (nearly 10 years ago) when the parish priest was "da man" and looked after everything. i.e 3 months notice to registrar etc......... Got married in church ,all hunky dory, a year later wanted marriage cert, and guess what, no record of our marriage and registrars... yikes. Rang priest, said he would look into it. he rang back and said marriage not legal..and did i not give notice to registrar!!! (no i did not cos you said you were and i've never been married before (( )

Turns out i had to make an appointment with registrar, bring 2 witnesses, pay fee of 17 pounds (yes seventeen..) and get married again in a civil ceremony. Pain in the arse but much cheaper than first time around.............

whatdoicare

Cincikchick wrote: »

no serious offence taken, its just really frustrating how many people think that a civil ceremony equals a short, boring, unpersonal experience. In addition to my own I have been to 3 civil ceremonies, all of which were lovely, and also from on this forum I got some lovely ideas so clearly other people also have very nice civil ceremonies. Before the wedding I found quite a few people (thankfully none of which were actually coming to my wedding I might add!) kind of turned their noses up at the idea of a civil ceremony. One going so far as to outright say that it wouldn't be as special as a church affair! I got married in a castle for goodness sake! not like it was in a ditch at the side of the road! so I possibly am a little frustrated and touchy about it, for which I apologise also!

No not at all- I understand why you'd be touchy- I see nothing wrong with civil ceremonies (my friend got married in one in Italy and I still go on about it two years later! It was just gorgeous!) I don't know if it's just in Limerick that the registrars are so unwillinging to put the effort in for us and others- we came away from the meeting just depressed and the two I attended recently were equally depressing (one couple were so disappointed they actually went to las vegas and renewed their vows)
I'm glad to hear you had the opposite experience as I wrongly assumed that it was the same deal everywhere in Ireland.

Some 'clergy' are also licenced officiants (hence why priests can register you and you don't need a registry wedding and a church wedding). I know there is supposedly some monk in the West who does such things. Other boardsies may be of more help on this one.

Haha you'll laugh when you hear that that exact Monk (Dara Molloy) is who's marrying us, only problem is he's not able to register us- hence our dilemma, we have it planned that we might register the day before and then have our actual wedding day- I was just hoping to tie the whole lot together on one day to lessen the stress (haha- causing me more stress )
Although someone recently told me a solemniser can be appointed for just one day to register a single wedding- which I'll have to look into as I'm not sure how much of that is actually true. It'd be really brilliant if it is! I know you can in America but thats a whole different kettle of fish!:pac:
Thanks so much for all the help and advice and hopefully it'll run as smoothly as in my head haha (ps mine is also in a castle- can't wait for that part- it's gonna be awesome!):cool:

whatdoicare

magconn wrote: »

oh lads. whatever ye do , dont get caught out like me.. back in the day (nearly 10 years ago) when the parish priest was "da man" and looked after everything. i.e 3 months notice to registrar etc......... Got married in church ,all hunky dory, a year later wanted marriage cert, and guess what, no record of our marriage and registrars... yikes. Rang priest, said he would look into it. he rang back and said marriage not legal..and did i not give notice to registrar!!! (no i did not cos you said you were and i've never been married before (( )

Turns out i had to make an appointment with registrar, bring 2 witnesses, pay fee of 17 pounds (yes seventeen..) and get married again in a civil ceremony. Pain in the arse but much cheaper than first time around.............

That's terrible!! I think that happened a few people, which is why they changed it so you have to go in yourself 3 months before and (I think) you can register the paperwork yourself after if you wish.

magconn

yep, would have totally preferred to that myself as i am a control freak (in my husbands words!) but wasnt permitted by the padre !!! ah well, no big harm done..not funny at the time tho

Jellyjelly

Hey

You can get an appointment to do your paperwork in the main office in Joyce house within a week no matter when you get married they have availability.

In relation to the MRF expiring, it ONLY starts to expiry from the date of marriage so if you sign today, get married 1st June 2010 it is valid till the 1st January 2011, if you do change the date you can change the date in section 5 of the MRF or you can contact the office get a new MRF issued with the new date eg 1st Oct 2010 and then its valid till the 1st April.

JJ

scratchy11

hi

can anyone tell me of a registrar that will work on a bank holiday?
or any advice on how we can overcome this issue
thanks

tatli_lokma

scratchy11 wrote: »

hi

can anyone tell me of a registrar that will work on a bank holiday?
or any advice on how we can overcome this issue
thanks

as mentioned, registrars are civil servants and therefore only work mon-fri, so you would not be able to get a registrar on a bank holiday. Again, as mentioned, another option is to get a solomniser, or last option is to go into the registry office prior to your 'ceremony' have a legal marriage there, and then on your wedding day have whatever ceremony you wish. Other than those options you cannot get married on a BH.

HTH

BC

Jellyjelly wrote: »

Hey

You can get an appointment to do your paperwork in the main office in Joyce house within a week no matter when you get married they have availability.

I had my appointment in Joyce house. I rang in January to make the appointment for the wedding in July and was told that the ONLY available appointment there was in April.