Mass Card Controversy

Galvasean

Heard about this on the news briefly. So apparently on Tuesday the Government plan to bring in a law where it is illegal to sell mass cards unless they are solddirectly from a parish.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mass-card-makers-fear-jail-terms-under-new-act-1871924.html

So what do the Christian folk (and indeed anyone who frequents the forum) think about this; is it an unfair law that impedes business or is it the correct move to protect the sanctity of mass cards?

Broxi_Bear_Eire

I feel as a practicing RC they should be done away with altogether we shouldn't have to pay for masses for our departed

Turtwig

Not a Christian, but it was about time something like this was done.
Mass cards should be endorsed by priests/bishops not just sold off by anyone with no real spiritiual background applied to the card.

dvpower

Would be better suited to the politics forum or, better still, after hours. Why oh why does our government feel the need to get involved in regulating the sale of mass cards?

old boy

it seems the local clergy were not collecting enough, a tenner for one from a local golfer, three euro for one for some one working in appaling conditions, out in faraway lands where conditions may not be the best, ah well one does not expect any thing else from the supporters of the mankey rich.:(

DublinWriter

...coming on foot of the 'Indulgence Controversy' of 1554.

philologos

This is totally outside the scope of legislating. The Government shouldn't have any official role in the sale of mass cards or any other formal practice of any church. I mean, why shouldn't there be laws in the interest of the Church of Ireland, Presbyterians, Evangelicals, Methodists, Muslims, Mormons, and so on and so forth. Where does it end?

robindch

Jakkass wrote:

why shouldn't there be laws in the interest of the Church of Ireland

That's not the issue. The problem is that the term "mass" has traditionally been used by the CC exclusively, and up to the recent decline in its rep, nobody would have dared use it without their permission, which is what's happening here. If the other religions had terms which were specific to them, and were being used to sell similar services or whatever without their approval, then they'd probably be equally upset and have equally good (or otherwise) legal grounds for complaint.

Galvasean wrote: »

the Government plan to bring in a law where it is illegal to sell mass cards unless they are sold directly from a parish. [...] is it an unfair law that impedes business or is it the correct move to protect the sanctity of mass cards?

Well, within European trademark law generally, trademarking comes second to usage, so if the trademark "mass" or "mass card" isn't registered (as I would imagine it's not) then I believe that anybody can use the term to sell what they want. In the USA, it's the other way around, so prior usage determines subsequent and the boys would have harder time doing this without the approval of the CC, the prior user.

In terms of trademarks and the improper use thereof, I'd say that the CC is fairly well within its rights to complain. Though European trademark law and legal precedent probably isn't going to help much, short of the CC pulling a Champagne/Parma/Parmigiano manoeuvre.

All of that said, the government really does have far more pressing issues to deal with, instead of wasting its time on nonsense like this.

Jakkass wrote:

Where does it end?

In the bin, I should hope.

dvpower

Am i to understand that when someone buys one of these mass cards that no actual mass is said? Wouldnt that run contrary to existing legislation?

PDN

dvpower wrote: »

Am i to understand that when someone buys one of these mass cards that no actual mass is said? Wouldnt that run contrary to existing legislation?

It certainly looks that way.

As a non-Catholic I had thought that mass cards were just a Catholic version of a sympathy card - stupid of me I know, why did I think the word 'mass' was there in the first place? So I had thought this legislation was just an attempt to set up a monopoly and anti-competitive.

But if a mass card is supposed to assure the recipient that a mass has been said for the dead person then preprinted cards would appear to be fraud. They are purporting to offer a service (even if it's a service non-Catholics don't believe in) without actually providing the promised service.

There was a case where preprinted mass card being sold bore the signature of a priest in Ecuador who had been dead for two years. http://www.herald.ie/national-news/priest-who-had-signed-83645-mass-card-had-been-dead-for-years-1845166.html

Daftendirekt

If the act becomes law in its current form, it means that anyone who sells Mass cards, other than by agreement with a bishop or provincial of an order of priests, could be jailed for up to 10 years or fined €300,000.

Not a Christian, but that's just insane. More ridiculous legislation from an incompetent government.