Work Problem - Sick cert

LegacyUser

Hi Guys,

Im posting this as unregisted.

I was off for work for 2 wks just gone, returned this week after swine flu - confirmed by labs.

Doctor had given me a doctors note for work and put on Influenze, work have now called me into an office to ask was i telling the thruth about swine flu as it only has Influenze.

Now im sure most people know that Influenze is the flu full stop no matter what sort of flu it is, GP wouldnt put swine flu on the cert as he said it scare mongers people and that once i have a cert for work its really no ones business what sort of flu it is bar mine and the gp.

I have also be told im being moved up to the top floor of the building which is 4 floors up from the front door and im 15 wks pg also, plus going up my on stairs at home is a struggle with my back. i feel like i am being punished and not trusted that i was telling the truth about my sickness

Redshift

Swine Flu is not the proper name for Influenza A (H1N1)

So your sick cert is accurate in that your were suffering from influenza, it would be very unprofessional for your GP to put
Swine Flu on your cert

leeroybrown

If I were in you I'd get back to the GP requesting that they re-issue the cert with the correct information as it's causing problems with your employer. If they refused then I'd make an official complaint to the Irish Medical Council.

leeroybrown

Redshift wrote: »

Swine Flu is not the proper name for Influenza A (H1N1)

Clearly the doctor should have recorded Influenza A (H1N1) or Pandemic (H1N1) as it's now officially known. Simply putting down Influenza isn't accurate enough. Most employers will accept someone being off for two of weeks because of swine flu. Many employers will be very sceptical about of someone being off for two weeks with an ordinary dose of the flu before you even consider the accusation of lying.

PCPhoto

Unregistered wrote: »

Hi Guys,

Im posting this as unregisted.

I was off for work for 2 wks just gone, returned this week after swine flu - confirmed by labs.

Doctor had given me a doctors note for work and put on Influenze, work have now called me into an office to ask was i telling the thruth about swine flu as it only has Influenze.

Now im sure most people know that Influenze is the flu full stop no matter what sort of flu it is, GP wouldnt put swine flu on the cert as he said it scare mongers people and that once i have a cert for work its really no ones business what sort of flu it is bar mine and the gp.

I have also be told im being moved up to the top floor of the building which is 4 floors up from the front door and im 15 wks pg also, plus going up my on stairs at home is a struggle with my back. i feel like i am being punished and not trusted that i was telling the truth about my sickness

First: why not suggest that your boss contacts your doctor to confirm that you were unable for work - I can understand the Doc's thinking - everyone in the office would be scared of catching H1N1 Virus - despite the fact that you are over it.

Second: I assume you have had or have arranged scans/checks that the baby is OK - assuming I did read it correctly - you are 15weeks pregnant.

Third: were you given a reason why they are asking you to move up to the top floor ? ....if there was no reason then maybe you need to talk to a Union Rep or some of the other people on boards for advice on legal entitlements while pregnant..... and maybe contact a solicitor.

Mrs OBumble

leeroybrown wrote: »

Clearly the doctor should have recorded Influenza A (H1N1) or Pandemic (H1N1) as it's now officially known. Simply putting down Influenza isn't accurate enough. Most employers will accept someone being off for two of weeks because of swine flu. Many employers will be very sceptical about of someone being off for two weeks with an ordinary dose of the flu before you even consider the accusation of lying.

Eh? Does the doctor really have to say what the illness was? Is it any of the employer's business what it was?

I could understand if it was something that the employment may have contributed to, so the employer has a responsibility to minimise the chances of it happening again.

leeroybrown

If the patient asks the doctor to make the cert as clear and medically correct as possible I'd expect the doctor to do so. The OP appears to have asked for this. I'd certainly take serious issue with my doctor if they weren't willing to put a medically correct fact on a cert for me. There are lots of employers in the country who take a cert at face value and assume that someone was sick but there as plenty more who'll accept it from a legal point of view but will doubt whether the employee 'really' needed to be off work, especially at the moment. If it effectively said 'swine flu' as the employee had claimed they wouldn't have questioned it.

Mrs OBumble

And "swine flu" is different from other strains of influenza how exactly? Everything I've heard says that in general "swine flu" is a relativley mild influenza. The reason people are taking two weeks+ is that ALL influenzas are that serious.

OP - re the top floor thing, what floor were you on previously? ie are you being asked to walk up one more floor, or two or three or four?

Have you discussed your difficulties with stairs with your doctor/midwife? This should be the starting point, because if you're finding it hard when you're less than 1/2 way through, you've got some real problems coming later, which you need to plan for.

leeroybrown

Don't get me wrong - I agree that employees with any influenza are better off at home than infecting the workplace. It's just that a lot of employers wouldn't agree that they should be at home for two weeks. Regardless of the medical facts most Irish companies tend to expect their employees back to work as soon as the symptoms pass. Most Irish employees expect to turn up at their doctor's surgery and get a prescription that allows them to get back to work straight away. Swine flu is different in that companies have been genuinely worried that they'll be badly affected by it.

Also, a lot of companies will have realised that they'll probably end up losing a lot of work days due to people incorrectly/fraudulently claiming that they've got swine flu. If someone rings into work tomorrow claiming that they've got swine flu they'll be told to stay until home until it isn't contagious anymore. If it turns out that they might have had a dose of the mythical 'man flu' all along their employer will hardly be happy with them.

As I said at the start of the post I'm not arguing for a second that swine flu is somehow worse. It's just that a lot of employers will treat the two differently and doctors need to be willing to accommodate the employees by telling the truth and not trying to hide the medical facts because they feel like it.

Spud83

Regardless of whether she had the flu or swine flue or whatever once the doctor signed her off for two weeks then she couldn't return to work for two weeks. Her employers would not be insured if something happened to her while working as she was medically certified unfit to work.

If they ask you why your cert says influenza all you have to say is that is what swine flu is. The doctor simply omitted what strain of influenza you had, but regardless of what I had the doctor certified me unfit to work for two weeks. So I followed my doctors advice in my best interests and yours.

As for the moving of floor, well you would have to ask them why this occurring, and could be possible to delay this move until after you return from your maternity leave (assuming you are taking it and return to work after it), as it is putting a great strain on your body. If they so well then roll with it and then after a week when you can't walk anymore get another doctors note.

How Strange

IMO in this case the OP has a cert from a doctor saying she had influenza so the employer cannot dispute the fact that she was on certified sick leave. She wasn't chancing her arm by taking a couple of days off with suspected swine flu that sudddenly vanished after two days.

OP, you should give them your GP's phone number so they can contact him/her and confirm the cert.

With regards to the issue of moving to 5th floor, are there lifts in the building? If not then on h&s grounds it would not be reasonable to move a pregnant employee to a place where she will have to climb stairs if it can be reasonably avoided.

Document everything that is going on. Give them your GP's details (so you are co-operating with them) and ask for a risk assessment to be carried out on you as a pregnant employee to ensure that risks to your h&s are identified and minimised.

The law is quite clear on the treatment of pregnant women and any interference or stress being put on a pregnant employee can be seen as grounds for constructive dismissal.

eth0_

Two weeks seems really excessive for flu. I know a couple of people who have had swine flu and it cleared up within a week..

As for moving you to the top floor - is there no elevator?

mood

How long a person has a flu etc can vary from person to person and other health problems can prolong the illness. I know from experience.

January

eth0_ wrote: »

Two weeks seems really excessive for flu. I know a couple of people who have had swine flu and it cleared up within a week..

As for moving you to the top floor - is there no elevator?

She's also pregnant which can prolong the effects of swine flu and also bring on other health implications. A woman I know was brought into hospital for a night and observed because she was pregnant and got swine flu.

Dublin_Gunner

leeroybrown wrote: »

Clearly the doctor should have recorded Influenza A (H1N1) or Pandemic (H1N1) as it's now officially known. Simply putting down Influenza isn't accurate enough. Most employers will accept someone being off for two of weeks because of swine flu. Many employers will be very sceptical about of someone being off for two weeks with an ordinary dose of the flu before you even consider the accusation of lying.

You've never had flu, have you??

I had flu, a 'normal' flu, and couldn't move for 2 weeks. It was the worst illness I've yet suffered.

Influenza in the cert - actually, merely a cert stating the time off required - is enough for the employer.

In fact, stating too much on a sick cert could actually be construed as breaking doctor / patient confidentiality.

If you want to tell the employer what was wrong, its up to you, it does NOT have to be on the cert.

Dublin_Gunner

eth0_ wrote: »

Two weeks seems really excessive for flu. I know a couple of people who have had swine flu and it cleared up within a week..

As for moving you to the top floor - is there no elevator?

2 weeks?? It most certainly is not. 'Swine' flu is a relatively mild form of H1N1. Spanish Influenza, which was also H1N1, was far more potent. There is a gene missing from the 'Swine' variant that makes it less potent than other forms.

And from an employers point of view - if I had a staff member out with flu, I'd rather they were out until it totally cleared up anyway, to avoid a spread of the disease to other members of staff.

It has clearly been stated that persons who have confirmed cases of Influenza H1N1 'Swine Flu' must not come into work, and preferably remain in quarantine until the infection has cleared.

It is totally irresponsible of an employer to A) expect someone to be in work when suffering flu and request if what is on the cert is correct.

LegacyUser

Hi guys,
The op here,

I went sick from a weds till the friday wk later. so 8 days from work i was off.
I know quite a few people who have come down with the swine flu and have been off for longer.

As for moving up the top floor no there has been no lifts and i have refused to move due to its way to hard to get up to top floor with being pregnant, its a really really old victorian building with really steap steps up to the last floor.
Swine flu is a 7 day flu, got it the weds so its weds to weds, doc wouldnt let us go into work on the thursday or friday to make double sure its gone as they dont want it spread either

Dublin_Gunner

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

You've never had flu, have you??

I had flu, a 'normal' flu, and couldn't move for 2 weeks. It was the worst illness I've yet suffered.

Indeed, same here, it was easily 2 weeks. It's not a cold, it's an ache all over cant eat cant move can't do *anything* illness

gdael

Just tell them to call the doctor if they dont believe you. You got a Doctors note. It doesnt matter, he could put nothing apart from that you were unfit from work on it and they have to accept it.

colmar26

Hi all,

Just wondering if I hand in a sick cert at work is it my responsibility to organise cover or my employers? The last time I was sick my boss insisted that I organise cover as it wasnt her problem otherwise I turn up (I had concussion). I am currently quite ill with flu for over a week and am hesitant about going in tomorrow. I work in the hotel industry and would be very wary of passing my flu onto customers or other staff members (1 of whom is pregnant and works in my department).

mood

colmar26 I would think this is total rubbish. Call Citizen Info. They will know for sure. Have you a contract? If so I'm sure is says nothing about sorting out cover.

colmar26

Thanks Moody. I dont have a contract. I thought as much myself but just before I get into a debate with them about it, I wanted my facts straight. Its a family run business and at times is run very old school.